04-07-2003 08:13									#1
	Has the AI been fixed yet? Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Has the totally crazy and retarded diplomatic AI been fixed yet? (you know the declaring a non agression pact and war in the same turn, or doine peace/war peace/war constantly every other turn for no apparent reason). If so, I may consider trying to play this game again

What about the galactic military AI? Is it competent yet? Can it send more than 1 ship at a time in an 'invasion' (lol)?

Ive always thought moo3 was decent but needs a great deal of 'patching' to make it a good game.

	04-07-2003 16:27									#2
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Diplomacy still needs work.
Military wise the AI is alot better - play on hard or impossible and it is a challenge, but there are still faults - like the AI will not colonise a planet it has glassed (to be fixed soon).

It needs more patching, but the first patch has made me like it alot and makes the game a challenge.

	04-07-2003 16:46									#3
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Yep, the AI Player know really tries to attack your Planets if youīre at war with him and he does it with really significant forces

	04-07-2003 19:08									#4
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The diplomatic AI has never been crazy or retarded. Its just not holding your hand and explaining to you that because Aliens A and B hate each other, once they get into a fight you're going to have to pick a side and expect to fight the other. Even if they think you're cute, you're the friend of the enemy.

Some aliens hate other things too. Quite a few hate the biggest empire, so your relations deteriorate when you get powerful. Usually if I unload all ordinance on races they hate, relations will improve. For some races if I do it to races they are tolerant of, they see it as an atrocity. I've yet to puzzle all of these out, but you can figure out many of them.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if the 1.2.4 patch makes some of these circumstances clearer in the diplomatic messages from other races but its not just random numbers generating love/hate messages.


On the military AI, on normal mode they seem to be able to keep pace with you technologically, expand like crazy and build some serious fleets of ships. I've not had them invading my planets but thats because I've never been at war on more than one major front at a time. The few times I've left a star lane unprotected fleets of ships have shgown up with transports following behind. I haven't waited to see what might happen
Their indirect ships are expert at hitting and running so that alone makes them more of a threat. Especially when the PD bug shows up (its much rarer now)

Last edited by Grumbold on 04-07-2003 at 21:33

	04-07-2003 23:50									#5
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make more smart AL's

	05-07-2003 09:53									#6
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What AI?

	05-07-2003 15:06									#7
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Artificial Intelligence

the Computerplayers of the Game.

In some games rather to be referred as AS, Artificial Stupidity

	06-07-2003 03:54									#8
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sigh... some jokes are just lost on the weak minded...

	06-07-2003 04:12									#9
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Some "jokes" aren't funny

	09-07-2003 07:53									#10
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Like Grumbold said - its not the AI, but not enough feedback when your actions have affected relations with other races.

Perhaps modders can add these race "reactions" if developers don't?

	09-07-2003 22:10									#11
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I second Gumbold and AceCiv's comments.

When an example of apparent AI retarded diplomacy occurs dig a little. I'd bet you'll find you are at war with another race they have an alliance (or equivalent) with. Or, their reactions to you have deteriorated significantly. I've noticed that I can keep a non-aggression or similar treaty even though relations are falling apart. Then, when they suddenly declare war, I check and - sure enough - their cassus belli (sp?) is very negative.

As has been said, it is too bad that they didn't give you a bit of feedback as to why things are happening.

	10-07-2003 05:03									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Grumbold I've not had them invading my planets but thats because I've never been at war on more than one major front at a time.

You should be glad about it

I had a war with the Tachidi.
The Tachidi glassed 2 defenseless Planets within my Empire and so I assembled a Fleet with my most modern Ship and send them to the Tachidi-Empire to take revenge. After I took out a few Systems on one Side of their Empire and destroyed a lot of Planets with the modern fleet on the other side of their Empire they repeatedly begged for a Ceasefire, but I always refused coldly
After I wanted to stop the war, as I had taken the worlds I wanted to take (which made defending my Systems against the Tachidi easier, as I now had a bottleneck System between the Tachidi and my other System where I could prevent any Attacks against my Empire by stationing a Fleet within the System) I wanted to make peace with them.
But now they were really pissed off and refused all of my Offers for peace (and the Situation hasnīt changed since maybe 100 turns).
The really problematic thing is, that the Tachidi have Military Alliances 3 other Races and have a mortal enemy in another Race (the Silicoids) and so I am constantly at war. Even if I negotiate a Peace Treaty with one of the other races (or a conditional surrender, which I am often also offered by other Races [which means that they pay you Reparations after you accept it ]) war would always recommence after maybe 3-10 turns (because the Tachidi urge the other races to fulfill their Alliance Obligations, I suspect).

So I have a multiple Fronts war, with normally 2-10 Star Systems per turn, where I fight against other Races. And if I wqouldnīt be the Technological Leader and if I hadnīt the by far largest Empire (I have nearly 300 Planets, every other Empire has less than 100 Worlds) I surely would have lost the war.
Especially hard fighting happens at Whinly, there I won a world (a present from the Gasbags) and the Gasbags also have 5 worlds which they have settled there.
So as I am now constantly at war with them they desperately try to conquer or destroy my world. They have 2000 Ships (maybe 300 Transports and the Rest Combatfleets) within the System and if it wouldnīt be the case that you can use a max of 10 Fleets in each Battle, they would have destroyed the defending Fleet and glassed the Planet. But so, I just have to occasionally replace Fleets lost around Whynil via my Mob-Center (as I have the tactical and technological superiority, they nearly always tend to loose more Ships than I do).

Defensive Ground Fightings I havenīt seen any to date in this game, despite the constant warfare, but it isnīt amazing, as my Resistance encourages the enemy to rather use Combatfleets than Transportfleets, and so in the rare Occasions where the enemy defeats one of my defending fleets around a planet or invades a (nearly) defenseless Systerm, he always bombards the planet (I have lost maybe 5-10 Planets this way) instead of waiting for Transports and trying to conquer it.

But now I try to end the war with the Tachidi by Erradicating the Systems he has next to me, so that he vanishes out of my Diplomacy-Menu (if he canīt see you, he canīt have any war with you ) so I can make lasting peace with the other Races.

	10-07-2003 07:41									#13
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What you need Proteus is some Ithkul to beat the snot out of. Everyone hates the Ithkul, so making war on them will help them like you. Then many of your enemies will be your friends. Be sure to draw it out to bet maximum political benefit. The Ithkul deserve no better, anyway.

Just be careful about colonizing their glassed worlds. They have this nasty habit of having remnant Itkul present. I think that if there are any troops left over after bombardment (as there frequently are) that these count as population, which will then grow by HarvEat of your people. I make it a habit of giving these infected planets back to the Ithkul and then start by bombarding them all over again. I HATE the Itkul - they must be exterminated. I will look through every single world I have periodically (especially after I turn on auto colonize) to search for the telltale "HarvEat" under unrest, or any tiny Ithkul population under demographics. I've had no Itkul under demographics but still had HarvEat under unrest - a sign of infection that will only spread.

My response? "Planet Sculpture Class 101 Report To The Bridge!!"

hehehehe

	10-07-2003 11:17									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Hydro What you need Proteus is some Ithkul to beat the snot out of. Everyone hates the Ithkul, so making war on them will help them like you. Then many of your enemies will be your friends. Be sure to draw it out to bet maximum political benefit. The Ithkul deserve no better, anyway.

I already had my war against the harvesters.
It was some time prior to the war against the Tachidi. The strange thing though was, that some of the other races didnīt seem to like me glassing Ithkul-Worlds. I got a lot of threats. I am not really sure if the war against the Ithkul was responsible but I suspect so, as before I started the war there have been no such Threats.
So, after decimating a couple of Systems (The Ithkul Capital was one of the Worlds glassed) I stopped the war, as this was also the time the Tachidi attacked me and so I decided to shift my attention the those little bugs

I think the difference if other races like or dislike it if you glass enemy worlds is, if they are at war with the other race.
If one Race is at war with the Ithkul or if there is a "Declare total war against the Ithkul"-Bill within the Senate (which is probable, as they are generally disliked) the other races involved like it if you glass Ithkul worlds.
But if those Races are not at war with them, glassing Ithkul worlds could be an atrocity.
In my current game there was no "Declare total war against the Ithkul"-Bill and, as the Ithkul inhabited only a portion of a remote arm of the Galaxy, there was only one Race which had contact with the Ithkul except me, and both of us lost diplomatic Contact with them, after I glassed the first Ithkul-System (which was located 2 jumps away from Whynil).

btw.
I never regained Contact to them, so I suspect I hit them very hard and they never fully recovered from the Loss of all those Systems
(O.K. not totally true. I regained, for a very Brief time Contact to them, as I colonised a small System in the Vicinity to Whynil, where I knew it would be within 2 jumps distance of one of the Ithkul Systems I spared and, despite of the prior war, after I regained Contact I really got good relations with them, also signing a defensive Treaty, but this contact was lost again after the Gas Bags managed to overhelm the defensive Armadas I left within the System and glassed the two worlds I had colonized there. I havenīt recolonized the System, as it just would mean another front where I would have to station a strong defensive Fleet [and at the Moment I just have Point Defense-Ships for maybe 5 more fleets and LR-Ships for just one more fleet [but SR-Ships in Abundance ], and so, as I have to occasionally have to replace fleets lost within other Systems, it seems unwise to open another front).

	10-07-2003 14:42									#15
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Lol it just goes to show that achieving your short term military objectives can really backfire in the long run. Deliberately cutting yourself off diplomatically is an interesting idea. Working out how to get friends of both races to like you more than your enemy is one of the harder tricks in MoO3, especially if you're the bigger nation and therefore the more feared.