05-07-2003 11:17									#1
	I Recommend "T3: Rise of the Machines" (SPOILERS) Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Everyone:

I just got back from the movie, and I assure all of you that it is a worthy sequel to T1 and T2.

I know there has been a degree of uncertainty in regards to how good T3 would be, what with James Cameron and Linda Hamilton (among others) no longer being involved with the Terminator series, and I went into T3 with that knowledge. Am I ever glad I did, because if I hadn't, I would have missed out on a *helluva* movie. Even better, it's not stupendously long — maybe 1 hour, 45 minutes, tops. But TPTB use that time to tell an almost complete story that, literally, had me nearly screaming at the movie screen (out of anticipation).

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Just some quick notes on the movie:

1. I definitely enjoyed the suspense the movie provided. Part way into the film, we learn that the outcomes of T1 and T2 merely *delayed* Judgment Day — the day that SkyNet attacks humanity, wiping out half the planet's population in a matter of hours.

2. We find out that the events portrayed in T3 occur on Judgment Day itself. The race is on to prevent SkyNet from being activated, and it's an exhilarating one, IMO.

3. There was a nice tie-in to T2 when we learn that the girl Connor "made out" with the night before his foster parents were terminated by the T-1000 has a father who's involved in the SkyNet research program. And not just any researcher — he's the U.S. general in charge of the entire project. Heh. Sadly, Connor and the girl never cross paths again until T3, and during that time her father was moving the SkyNet project along, unaware of the horror lurking in the near future.

The CyberDyne laboratory destroyed in T2 was merely a *part* of the overall SkyNet program. Thus, it's destruction did not prevent more research, research that got under way in the first place when scientists got ahold of remnants from the first T-800, the one that tried to kill Sarah Connor in T1. The line of thinking that led to SkyNet continued to flourish ... kind of like Pandora's Box, in a way. Once the idea was out and about, there was no putting it back in the bottle, er, box.

Basically, they hit the wrong target in T2. They should have been gunning for the general — he was the key to the entire lock. As it was, they merely destroyed one of the labs working on the SkyNet program.

4. The reason for sending the TX back in T3 was to terminate Connor's future lieutenants in the upcoming War Against the Machines. Oh, and to take Connor out, too (he was the "primary" target). While the TX failed to take out Connor and the woman who would become his second-in-command (and wife, and mother to their children), it did terminate a number of his future lieutenants (there were 22 lieutenants, but not all were killed ... I think three to six got offed on-screen).

5. I enjoyed how SkyNet was portrayed. It basically masqueraded as some sort of "super virus" on the Internet (i.e., it was spreading fast across the entire globe), taking down parts here and there (even affecting cell phone service, satellite service and so on). The Pentagon didn't realize it was already being played the fool by a nascent SkyNet, and thought the "virus" was really just that — a virus. So they went ahead and began the activation of the main SkyNet program to eradicate the "virus" from the Internet. Well, things begin to go downhill from there ...

6. I must touch on Connor's reaction when he learned the world was only hours away from Judgment Day. The T-800 wanted to get Connor, the woman and itself out of the United States and into northern Mexico, since that area would not be totally devastated by multiple nuclear strikes. Apparently its mission was to see Connor survive, not prevent, Judgment Day. But Connor gets all stubborn and they end up heading toward the military base instead of fleeing with their tails between their legs. He's dead set on preventing Judgment Day, and the 3 billion people who will die in a matter of hours.

7. The scenes in the military base where the main part of SkyNet was activated was cool. I loved the tense atmosphere as the "super virus" spread across the Internet, and standard methods to stop and erase it failed. I loved how it grew tenser and tenser as the "virus" advanced into really sensitive areas (think military and science here, folks), and the last resort option — activating SkyNet — became the *only* option to cleansing the "virus" from not only the Internet, but other computer networks (folks, this infiltration went all the way down to the at-home and at-work PCs you and I use) . I was sweating in my seat at the theater ... and so was the general who, ultimately, flipped the switch that set SkyNet's main program in motion.

At first it looks good. SkyNet is doing exactly what it's supposed to do — stopping and cleansing the "virus." We see global maps showing the progression of SkyNet in its battle against the "virus." SkyNet sweeps across North America, Europe, the Middle East and into Asia ... and then the global maps go blank.

Personnel in the military base — including the general — begin to get nervous. But then the global maps come back online, things seem fine ... and then SkyNet begins its assault against humanity by attacking the very base that gave birth to it.

8. It was interesting seeing the TX infiltrate the military base mentioned above. It took *proto-type* SkyNet units — i.e., defense droids and even one of those warbird-like attack ships — and reprogrammed them. The viewer gets a glimpse of early SkyNet units in action, and they're lethally effective as all hell breaks out on the military base. Humanity gets its arse kicked in, losing the first battle.

9. I liked how Connor, et al., fled the military base (they arrived mere moments after SkyNet had been fully activated), with a nascent SkyNet in hot pursuit, along with the TX. They were headed for Crystal Mountain, a redoubt containing SkyNet's central processing core about 56 miles (in the mountains, and heavily fortified) from the besieged military base. It was bittersweet, though, as the TX managed to terminate the woman's father (the general), and he lived just long enough to direct them to where they could destroy SkyNet before it could launch the nuclear missiles (which, by that point, would be fired within an hour, according to the T-800) against a variety of global targets.

10. The most stunning part of the movie? Connor *fails* to prevent Judgment Day. Yes, you read right. He *failed* to stop SkyNet from destroying nearly half of humanity. The movie closes with scenes of missile fields firing, of clouds of warheads in Earth orbit, falling towards the surface of the planet, of cities dying beneath miles-high fireballs. SkyNet has won ...

... Or has it? Crystal Mountain, it turns out, was a hardened shelter intended to protect the U.S. government. Connor and his lady friend — essential to the survival of the human race — are there, alone, listening as reports begin flooding the airwaves of the world-wide destruction. He hears a plea for help from the Montana Civil Defense, and answers. Connor has started to connect with those who will survive Judgment Day, those who he will lead to, apparently, ultimate victory over SkyNet in the horrible decades of war to come on a mostly-ruined Earth.

You see, Connor and his friends were never supposed to prevent Judgment Day. It was intended that they *survive* the most horrible day in human history, nothing more. IOW, folks, there was no "happy" ending to T3.

11. Here's something of an irony: The T-800 sent back to ensure Connor's survival in T3 was the same unit that *killed* him in 2032.

Whew. That's it, folks. T3 rocked, and I recommend it whole-heartedly.

Gatekeeper

	05-07-2003 11:25									#2
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I agree with these sentiments.

The humor in it was good, too - not too cheesy, and appropriate in the right spots.

	05-07-2003 12:03									#3
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Gozer?

I've got a freakin' key, but nobody's been by yet. Are we PST or EST?

	05-07-2003 12:42									#4
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Wow, sounds like a deep and great movie. I will check it out for sure.


How did you feel about Arnie? Good as ever, better or worse?

	05-07-2003 12:45									#5
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I thought he pulled it off really well. He definitely seemed to be enjoying his role.

	05-07-2003 12:58									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Sn00py How did you feel about Arnie? Good as ever, better or worse?

Let's put it this way: It was just like the days or yore in T1 and T2. IOW, quite good.

Gatekeeper

	08-07-2003 18:59									#7
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Agreed Everyone can understand how hard it is to make a sequel to this series.. especially after magnificent second movie, which btw is still one of the greatest movies ever.

SPOILERSssssssssssss!

T3 didn't let me down. I think it wasn't at the level of the second one, considering when it came out, but I was not disappointing. It captured some of the.. atmosphere that was in the first ones, which is tough to do after what,, over 10 years? So, that is a huge accomplishment.
And also, because I was so young then, that everything with big guns and robots will give my two thumbs up..
.. well they still do

This film was HIGHLY erotic. I mean.. everything in it had some erotic meaning. Robots.. they wear only leather. Sexy clothing! Then the other fembot was also very hot with tight composure at all times. Then there was another pretty lady. It was a battle of two beautiful women.

On the other hand the machine was hotter, and definitely a great enemy you just have to respect. You can shoot it, throw it, wrestle it, put it through walls, smash it head.. and it still keeps on coming, never messing up its make up. How cool is that? Now, every guy wants to have his ways with this fembot, I know I did. But how to do it? It can literally rip you to pieces and she woulnd't think twice about it! Only adds to the erotic aspect.. oh yeah...

And then the other one, the human woman. She was pretty too. But she was not so tough opponent, though she showed some good spirits picking up a gun and shooting it wildly and having good 'GRRRR' expression on her face. And even more, robot threw her ground, head first.. what happens? She recoveres.. and like it never happened and then goes to fly a plane! Impressive..
And it is human, so it's better compared to machine in ways of erotic and sex, because that's what it was all about after all.

And when the movie ends.. you're trapped in a fall out shelter for who knows how long with a pretty little thing that wants you because you're hot and sexy too with explosives in your hands and little dirty hair look. Perfect. And then you are in charge of defending the world, with all means necessary.. I mean think about it! You're THE man, you get to do anything you want with nukes and stuff if they still work or are available, plus hot chick trapped with you under the ground.. how hot is that? You can only shoot guns, be the leader of defenders and have lots of sex. I dig it.

	08-07-2003 19:04									#8
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You know, Gatekeeper? I might watch this movie just because of your review. Thanks!!

	08-07-2003 19:05									#9
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JohnT, I know you meant to say Pekka instead of Gatekeeper.. that's ok though. It's a sexy flick.

	09-07-2003 09:42									#10
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I liked it, not as good as T1, or T2, but not as bad as I thought it would be.

But I like long movies. I happen to think between 2 and 2 1/2 hours is perfect time for a good movie (bad movies should not exceed 1 1/2 hours). I would have liked to see more interaction between Connor and Claire Danne's character- maybe a little bit of naught action . Although the only time that could have happened is at the end, and you can't have sex scenes at the end of the movie. So I can see the reason that isn't in there.

Plenty of plot holes, but those are problems with the series in general, not with this movie specifically. T2 raised more questions than answers. I still can't see skynet launching a nuclear war. but ohh well. in the imdb message boards they make a good point that by nuking all the cities, skynet is also nuking itself.

Without major cities, there won't be manufacturing centers to produce more robots and cyborgs. Many power plants will be destoryed, electricity will be scarce. Though many power plants reside outside of cities, much of the grid infrastructure is inside the cities.

	09-07-2003 09:50									#11
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT You know, Gatekeeper? I might watch this movie just because of your review. Thanks!!

that's not a review- that's the entire movie!!! .

Another plot hole. If all that occurs on judgement day, and some of those lietenants live in Los Angeles- how did they survive? Surely the entire Los Angeles county and whole area would be obliterated.

and they screwed up the no fate but what you make part of T2.

I loevd that part. It was a good line from T2. I loved the scenes when they were in Mexico. No fate but what you make. I happen to believe that.

But they still did a pretty good job explaining why judgement day happened (aside from the nuking itself thing I mentioned above)

And yes the T-X was hot. I'd have sex with her in an instant. Imagine the sexual positions she can get into.

	09-07-2003 09:57									#12
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Let's hope the characters trapped in the vault have water chips or a GECK

great ending though. I had heard about a different sort of ending from Ebert and Roper. And I had a feeling something like this was going to happen. But I didn't expect it to happen quite like this.

The only downside is most americans don't like endings that aren't completely good. This movie may not do as well financially as T2.

	09-07-2003 10:16									#13
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VB-code reminder: [spoiler] [/spoiler]

	09-07-2003 11:08									#14
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT You know, Gatekeeper? I might watch this movie just because of your review. Thanks!!

Hey, cool. I hope you like it as much as I did — and Diss is right, my review is pretty much the whole movie (I thought it was taking me a bit too much time to write ... but thoroughness won out over brevity). Right now, I'm waffling between watching T3 again this weekend or checking out "Pirates of the Caribbean." Hmm. Maybe both!

Gatekeeper

	09-07-2003 11:18									#15
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you gotta love the destruction.

too bad you don't see more aftermath of that. I would have liked to have seen the city streets as a whole after that crane went through. And maybe show people coming out and seeing the destruction.

I would have liked to have seen more motorcycle action with the police bike- but there was plenty of that in T2 with the Harley and dirt bike- so I can see why they didn't do that. More action between the crane and the fire truck would have been cool as well.

They took a chance with the ending. I like it though.

	09-07-2003 11:19									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident Plenty of plot holes, but those are problems with the series in general, not with this movie specifically.

Agreed. The more entries there are to a franchise, the more likely it is that plot holes are going to pop up. They're to be discouraged, IMO, but not completely unexpected. The franchises w/no plotholes are nice, but rare.

quote: I still can't see skynet launching a nuclear war. but ohh well. in the imdb message boards they make a good point that by nuking all the cities, skynet is also nuking itself.

That's an interesting point. Perhaps SkyNet didn't target all the cities that contained the hardware necessary to maintain what it thought was essential to keeping *its* part of the Internet running.

Or perhaps SkyNet really does have backup modules and an actual core hidden somewhere — which is possible, since this is an AI that had some time to "plan ahead." IOW, I think it became sentient long before Judgment Day (hence its spread through the Internet, which would not have been as extensive if JD had originally happened in August 1997).

quote: Without major cities, there won't be manufacturing centers to produce more robots and cyborgs. Many power plants will be destoryed, electricity will be scarce. Though many power plants reside outside of cities, much of the grid infrastructure is inside the cities.

I don't think *all* the cities were destroyed. Even if all the larger metropolises were hit with nuclear weapons — say, those with more than 250,000 people — you'd still have good-sized cities left with manufacturing and power facilities. It's also possible SkyNet used some neutron bombs to clear out human life from some cities, but kept the infrastructure intact.

It's true that 3 billion people killed is enormous, but that still leaves 3.3 billion people left scattered across all of Earth. So the planet's still a fairly crowded place, and I don't think SkyNet had as easy a time of things once the shock of its initial strike wore off and the surviving humans struck back.

We do know that the ensuing war lasts for decades, though, and it's possible more nuclear strikes — from both sides — are initiated during this time. Heck, it's even possible that the 3 billion dead are *not* strictly from JD itself, but from the entire 30-year war. Perhaps 800 million died on JD, but the rest were killed by radiation and war in the following decades.

It's all fascinating, really, and an entire universe was opened up by the T1-T2-T3 films.

Gatekeeper

	09-07-2003 11:21									#17
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now I'm ready for T4

	09-07-2003 11:24									#18
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Heh. That will be at least two to three years down the road, I'm sure. In the meantime, I hear publishers are coming out with books set in the post T3 world, the first being a hardcover scheduled for release in December.

Gatekeeper

	09-07-2003 11:55									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident I liked it, not as good as T1, or T2, but not as bad as I thought it would be.

My feelings about T3, exactly.
I guess the weakest side of the movie was its soundtrack. No Brad Fidel's main theme of both previous parts during entire movie (you know Scouter's re-make it as "age of love"). Music in T2 was just great, it was a part of the action. In T3 no music at all during truck race. That's not good.
Sure this movie worth the $$$ I paid for tickets and it was very good, but with Brad Fidel's music and with James Cameron and with Linda Hamilton and with Stan Winston and other guys from T2 team it would be much better.
Everyone should watch it anyway.
Btw, Mostow sounds like a Russian name.

	09-07-2003 11:58									#20
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great movie worthy of the terminator series, i say. i miss linda hamilton tho

	14-07-2003 06:28									#21
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the funny thing is the day after seeing this movie, going to work, I saw 7 or 8 trails accross the western sky that looked like a nuclear missile launch . I figured this because when they did the ABM missile defense tests a couple of years ago they launced the nuclear capable missiles from vandenberg air force base in california. And these trails were in the same general direction as vandenberg air force base.

I admit I was a little concerned . I figured, if ww3 is about to happen, I'm not going to work. I'm staying home. I was wondering if there was some number you could call to see if ww3 is happening

but the trails were a little further south than the ballistic missile tests a couple of years ago. They were probably some high flying bombers flying together making contrails.

	14-07-2003 07:26									#22
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I had low expectations for the film when I went into the theater but when it was all said and done I was left wanting to watch it again. I can't say it any better than Gatekeeper.

What I will say is that I believe it did an excellent job in furthering the Terminator universe instead of just going over old ground like so many sequeals do these days. It makes me hope that they do a T4 before Arnie becomes governor.

	14-07-2003 07:38									#23
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wow, i just now read gatekeeper's review... nce work i wanna see it again now