07-07-2003 11:37									#1
	Scenario Editor vs Text Editing Remove this text

I'm curious as to the advantages/disadvantages to text editing/using the builtin Civilization Gold scenario editor. A long while back, when I first got my hands on Fantastic Worlds, I remember the builtin editor would frequently scramble your data and ruin your work, which discouraged me from scenario making for some time. Does it still do this? Is there any reason to use the editor (if you're not using batch files)?

	07-07-2003 14:53									#2
	Suffering from ads?

I always use the scenario editor. It works okay me thinks. The most frequent "problem" i've had is when sometimes i finish editing i press "cancel" instead of "ok" and nothing is saved.

	07-07-2003 16:40									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Here's a question: When I patched my copy of FW with the MGE upgrade files from Civ Fanatics the in-game editors disappeared. I assumed MGE didn't include them. Are you guys saying your copies include the editor?

	07-07-2003 16:42									#4
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Only people with legal copies are allowed to use the editors.

	07-07-2003 16:48									#5
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

If I could still get hold of a legal copy I would. I did after all pay full price for civ2, FW and ToT

	07-07-2003 16:57									#6
	Inflate your Upload Space

Gareth you don't have the editor?

I don't know if i could ever design anything without the editor.

	07-07-2003 17:32									#7
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by fairline If I could still get hold of a legal copy I would. I did after all pay full price for civ2, FW and ToT

MGE is still available online at various places. And at the low price it's sold now, even with shipping you'll be off cheaper than paying full price.

But the only reason the editor's aren't there is because the menu text file is defective.

	07-07-2003 19:00									#8
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

My MGE has editors. I only use them for editing some stuff tho (never graphics nor techs, the editors will almost guaranteed mess up any tech tree you have without it being noticable at first (changing the second preq to nil, randomly assigning new preqs, etc)).
It appears it does this to protect you from creating tech loops, however more often than not it just screw things up...

	07-07-2003 20:31									#9
	Tech Trees? Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Well, Henrik, perhaps I should relate my experiences with the editor. I've used them since day one, and only one time was I forced to go into the text file and alter things manually.

There are some rules.

Henrik is correct about the automatic reassignment of preqs by the Advances editor. If you attempt to create a tree that has, somewhere in its base, a "no,no" tech, the MGE editor will change it. Interestingly enough, the editor will allow you to create a "tech loop." I can verify this from experience--it was the reason I was forced to go into the text file to begin with.

Some editors will not save your changes unless you "Save as Scenario" from the Cheat menu. The units, terrain, improvements, effects, and cities editors will save your changes. My practice is to simply exit out. The game will save it.

The Events editor requires a special touch. Any changes made in it will ONLY be saved if you "Save as scenario." (AFAIK--there may well be other ways.) The best way I've found to deal with this is to make the file outside the scenario and just set it in place when it's completed. Then locate the problems and fix them.

Perhaps others can provide more knowledge?

	07-07-2003 21:07									#10
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I only use text editors.
The built-in editors are buggy and also quite circumsantial. Text editors give you much more freedom.

	07-07-2003 21:31									#11
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

One thing the scenario editor cannot do is list Barbarians as a tribe in the events file (meaning that you won't be able to create barbarian units or pop up messages when a barbarian unit is killed or city taken). And once you create an events file with the editor, it will not let you re-create a new one which you can edit by hand. If you know you won't have barbarians in your scenario then you should be OK, but writing the events file by hand is definitely the safer move.

	08-07-2003 19:01									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

The last year I have done text editing manually, as FW doesn't work on Windows XP. I've never seen the editor in MGE, does that even exist? Are you saying I have to buy MGE to get that? I have the legal copy of civ2 and have just upgraded it to civ gold from the download section at CivFan.

Please tell me I can get the MGE with the built in editor somewere...It would save me alot of work

	08-07-2003 19:48									#13
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Kobra I have the legal copy of civ2 and have just upgraded it to civ gold from the download section at CivFan.

You do know that the patch at civfan is ilegal?
Not that it matters to me, I'd have used it if there was one for the mac version

	08-07-2003 20:06									#14
	Ooops! Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Correction and retraction;

I take back what I said about the terrain editor. You must "save as scenario" to save changes there too.

	08-07-2003 22:51									#15
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Henrik You do know that the patch at civfan is ilegal? Not that it matters to me, I'd have used it if there was one for the mac version

No, I didn't know that But I have the legal original Civ2 CD. But where can I get an *cough* illegal *cough* copy of MGE with the scenario editor?

	08-07-2003 23:10									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Not supposed to discuss such things here, polly is stricter about these things than civfan. And in any event I don't know, I'm a mac user, and thus know little about the obtaining of PC programs.

	09-07-2003 00:29									#17
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I assumed that the patch at CivFan was legal because MGE is no longer available to buy and, like Kobra, I have kosher versions of vanilla civ and FW..... OK anyone know where I can buy a legal copy of MGE from?

	09-07-2003 00:36									#18
	Got spare money?

I found it! :b Hurray! ...on *cough* Kazaa *cough*

	09-07-2003 00:48									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: I assumed that the patch at CivFan was legal because MGE is no longer available to buy and, like Kobra, I have kosher versions of vanilla civ and FW.....

Abandonware is equally illegal, and having an earlier version is no excuse unless they had made multiplayer available in a free patch.

You should be able to find it on eBay at least... And there are various links among the banners and buttons on Apolyton where you can get it (and when perusing those, you'll also support Apolyton).

Kobra, may you gently roast in civ2 hell.

	09-07-2003 00:58									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Mercator quote: Kobra, may you gently roast in civ2 hell.

I'm already here, baby And I'm not alone...

	09-07-2003 04:41									#21
	Got spare money?

I've been using text-editors since the days of 2.42 and the propensity of the FW editors for data loss did not entice me to switch over to them at all.

Oh, and I also am using the infamous patch. I am not buying MGE just for PBEM. Besides, Microprose sent me two free copies of ToT. Surely, they actually meant to send one ToT and one MGE.:P

BTW, it's the FW install program that causes the problems on XP. You can install the game on a different computer, record the directory onto a CDR, and then copy it onto the harddrive of your XP computer (and later removing the readonly bit in the Properties dialogue).

	09-07-2003 07:11									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I manage to install the game alright, but when I am to install the Wing program/driver that follows with the CD it says stop...I only use MGE anyways, so it doesn't matter

	09-07-2003 11:06									#23
	Get a bigger avatar today!

That's weird - I installed vanilla civ2 and the FW expansion disk without any problems on my winXP computer

@mercator: the only copy of mge I found on eBay was being sold by a company that requires AmEx-only payment, and a cursory perusal of both the Poly ads and a google search revealed nothing.

	09-07-2003 16:32									#24
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

How about these?
http://search.ebay.com/search/searc...rty=MetaEndSort

or this one...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...&category=11053

Last edited by Mercator on 09-07-2003 at 18:10

	09-07-2003 20:53									#25
	Re: Ooops! Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Exile Correction and retraction; I take back what I said about the terrain editor. You must "save as scenario" to save changes there too.

I dont have to! I can make changes per editor and save it as a normal savefile. Or did I misunderstand you now?