11-07-2003 18:54									#1
	Iroquois Cities Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I'm trying to find out in what state (or province) Civ3 Iroquois cities are located.

I have two:

Mauch Chunk: Pennsylvania
Centralia: Indiana

	11-07-2003 19:54									#2
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Ok, quick google search....

http://www.tolatsga.org/iro.html

I didn't read much since it is long, but maybe it has what you are looking for?

	11-07-2003 23:31									#3
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Niagra Falls

	11-07-2003 23:53									#4
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

* counts the minutes till Ribannahs arrival *

	12-07-2003 12:07									#5
	Re: Iroquois Cities Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Feephi I'm trying to find out in what state (or province) Civ3 Iroquois cities are located. I have two: Mauch Chunk: Pennsylvania Centralia: Indiana

hi ,

send a PM to Ribannah , she really is an expert on them

have a nice day

	12-07-2003 13:01									#6
	Re: Iroquois Cities Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by Feephi I'm trying to find out in what state (or province) Civ3 Iroquois cities are located. I have two: Mauch Chunk: Pennsylvania Centralia: Indiana

Interesting that you should mention these two, since they aren't Iroquois cities at all. Mauch Chunk is a Delaware town. Centralia is a white man's town (founded by George Washington!), the natives in the area were the Chehalis.

There was never a town called Niagara Falls. Originally, the Neutrals lived there, before the Iroquois trampled them in 1651. There was also a white man's fort that IIRC was eventually taken by the Iroquois, but they never settled there. Much later a Tuscarora reservation was opened nearby so it can be on the Iroquois city list, but much lower.

Firaxis did a terrible job on the Iroquois city and leader lists. For instance: Salamanca was never their capital, that always was and still is Onondaga.

If you want to find the locations of the Iroquois towns, all you need is a good map, you can still find many of them.

The link that Stonewall supplies above is a good one.

quote: At its maximum in 1680, the Iroquois empire extended west from the north shore of Chesapeake Bay through Kentucky to the junction of the Ohio and Mississippi Rivers; then north following the Illinois River to the south end of Lake Michigan; east across all of lower Michigan, southern Ontario and adjacent parts of southwestern Quebec; and finally south through northern New England west of the Connecticut River through the Hudson and upper Delaware Valleys across Pennsylvania back to the Chesapeake.

Note, however, that they didn't settle everywhere, much of the conquered land was used only as hunting grounds to support the Fur trade.

Here is the city list that I use for the Iroquois civilization:

Onondaga (Onondaga)
Oneida (Oneida)
Teyagon (at Toronto) (Seneca)
Ganaraske (at Port Hope) (Cayuga)
Akwesasne (=Saint Regis) (Mohawk)
Canienga (Canienga=Mohawk)
Ogdensburgh (=Oswegatchie) (Onondaga / Oneida)
Caughnawaga (Mohawk)
Cattaraugus (Seneca)
Kente (Cayuga)

Gandesetaiagon (=Oshawa) (Seneca)
Tiohero (Cayuga)
Niagara Falls (Tuscarora)
Tonawanda (Seneca)
Owego (Cayuga)
Kanagaro (Mohawk)
Opolopong (Oneida)
Grand River (Seneca)
Deseroken (Onondaga)
Allegany (Seneca)

Salamanca (=Bucktooth) (Seneca)
Tuscarora (Tuscarora)
Saratoga (Mohawk)
Geneseo (Seneca)
Chondote (Cayuga)
Tyendinaga (=Brantville) (Mohawk)
Tueadasso (Onondaga)
Buckaloon (Seneca)
Onnontare (Cayuga)
Skohare (Mohawk)

Catherine's Town (Seneca)
Ganogeh (Cayuga)
Lac des Deux Montagnes (near Oka) (Mohawk)
Skannayutenate (Cayuga)
Oriska (Oneida)
Canajoharie (Mohawk)
Oil Springs (Seneca)
Gannentaha (Onondaga)
Buffalo Creek (Seneca)
Neodakheat (Cayuga)

Cowassalong (Oneida)
Union Springs (Cayuga)
Venango (Seneca)
Nowadaga (Mohawk)
Chemung (Seneca)
Osquake (Mohawk)
Cittenango (Oneida)
Gadoquat (Onondaga)
Onnahee (Seneca)
Mingo Town (all)

	12-07-2003 18:30									#7
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hi ,

thanks Rib

have a nice day

	13-07-2003 06:24									#8
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Did the Iroquois live in cities? I thought they didn't have permanent settlements, they just migrated frequently to follow the hunted animals.

	13-07-2003 13:46									#9
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The Iroquois lived in towns of up to several thousands of citizens, comparable in size to most European towns at the time. Their wooden longhouses were good for 20-30 years, and they had the technology to keep the soil fertile for that long. They would typically move between a limited number of good sites, keeping the name of the town.

Their main source of food was agriculture, not hunting, so there was no great need to follow any herds. Also, as they lived in the woodlands, they hunted beaver and deer rather than the buffalo.
In summertime, groups of Iroquois men would form hunting parties, staying away for months. But they also had a lot of other activities such as fishing and playing Lacrosse.

	13-07-2003 15:05									#10
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Yes, the Wyandot were also farmers rather than hunters (formerly located in the Ohio/Michigan region). I've tried researching some city/town/settlement names of former Wyandot sites...but to no avail so far.

EDIT: Found one! (Inside the above posted link):

quote: Its first council fire was at the Shawnee village of Waketomica. After Waketomica was burned by the Americans in 1786, it moved to Brownstown, a Wyandot village south of Detroit.

	24-07-2003 01:18									#11
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This is a good source:

http://www.tolatsga.org/hur.html

	24-07-2003 19:30									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Ribannah This is a good source: http://www.tolatsga.org/hur.html

Thanks Ribannah. Your posts on this topic were very interesting and informative .

	25-07-2003 02:29									#13
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Most of these cities are in New York state or northern PA. I was surprised they didn't include Gonondagan (near present Victor NY), which was the Ir. "capital" until 1687 and the Marquis de Denonville, Governor General of New France, crossed Lake Ontario with some troops, landed in present day Irondequoit Bay and then marched south (the trail they took is less than 1/4 mile from my house). The French burned Gonondagan to punish the Ir. for interfering in the fur trade. Several towns and land features within a 30 minute drive from where I sit have their names from the Iroquois.

	26-07-2003 03:49									#14
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'Gonondogan' is a faulty spelling of Onondaga.

	26-07-2003 06:19									#15
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http://www.ganondagan.org/iroquois.html

	26-07-2003 14:26									#16
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Ah, YOU spelled it wrong.

The history part on that site seems a little off. The Seneca were the LAST to join, the Onondaga were the first.

Ganondaga, then known as Gannagaro or Kanagaro, was a principal Seneca town for several decades.
Probably two villages close together.

It was never the Iroquois capital.

I have a Mohawk town of the same name on my list but that one is in mid-west NY. Would be confusing to have two towns with the same name, hard to say which one was more important!

By the way, the Iroquois took revenge the next year by plundering Montreal.

Edit: that second town was also burnt to the ground by the French, 20 years earlier. Nasty barbarians, those French.

Last edited by Ribannah on 26-07-2003 at 18:09