12-07-2003 23:57									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Sava Sorry, I tend to defend Democracy and freedom when someone tries to take it away and abuse power.

Who's trying to take away freedom and abuse power? Bush?

Again, this is what I am talking about. Leftist are so filled with hate, they actually think that Bush is some Nazi dictator or something, trying to usurp power and destroy democracy. That is so outrageous! Give me a break!

	13-07-2003 00:01									#32
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quote: Who's trying to take away freedom and abuse power? Bush?

yup... pick up a newspaper, or read a book, you might learn something...

quote: they actually think that Bush is some Nazi dictator or something, trying to usurp power and destroy democracy. That is so outrageous!

He's already succeeded once... remember FLorida? Jeb and Katherine prepared the state by instituting massive "reforms" to the voting process which illegaly removed tens of thousands of legal black voters from voting eligibility... then Bush and his connections in the SCOTUS helped pave the way for stopping the election results from being accurately confirmed.

The Patriot Act and the sequel (soon to pass) have done enough to attack "dissenters" in America.

The war is just the icing on the cake.

	13-07-2003 00:11									#34
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Personally, I think that Bush was actually the ringleader of a CIA-FBI-DEA-IRS-NAACP-NCAA-NBC-Illuminati-Freemasons-Teamsters conspiracy to destroy the WTC.

	13-07-2003 00:13									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Sava He's already succeeded once... remember FLorida? Jeb and Katherine prepared the state by instituting massive "reforms" to the voting process which illegaly removed tens of thousands of legal black voters from voting eligibility... then Bush and his connections in the SCOTUS helped pave the way for stopping the election results from being accurately confirmed. The Patriot Act and the sequel (soon to pass) have done enough to attack "dissenters" in America. The war is just the icing on the cake.

You are paranoid and obsessed. it is not healthy, I say.

1) Bush did not steal Florida! The countless recounts proved that Bush had the votes to carry the State. It is dems that constantly wanted more recounts with looser and looser standards. The Supreme Court did not select Bush. It simply declared that the law must be respected, and you dems can't change the rules over and over again hoping to change the results of an election.

Get over it! Bush won Florida. You lost! And if you dems don't forget the past and focus on the future, you are going to lose again in 04.

The Patriot Act simply allows law enforcement to investigate possible terrorists in this country. It targets terrorists not dissenters. It targets people with clear ties to Al Queda. It is not some Gestapo-like secret program to target people's opinions. If it were, then where are all these innocent people being unlawfully arrested for expressing an opinion? Don't you think we would have heard about it if it were hapening?

The Bush administration is not targetting people's civil rights.

As a matter of fact, it was FDR, a Democrat who created internment camps for japanese during WW2. If anyone was abusing power and subverting civil rights and freedom, it was Roosevelt, not Bush!

	13-07-2003 01:12									#36
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quote: 1) Bush did not steal Florida! The countless recounts proved that Bush had the votes to carry the State. It is dems that constantly wanted more recounts with looser and looser standards. The Supreme Court did not select Bush. It simply declared that the law must be respected, and you dems can't change the rules over and over again hoping to change the results of an election. Get over it! Bush won Florida. You lost! And if you dems don't forget the past and focus on the future, you are going to lose again in 04.

I didn't just lose... America lost... Democracy lost... pick up a book and educate yourself... that way you can save the embarassment...

quote: The Patriot Act simply allows law enforcement to investigate possible terrorists in this country. It targets terrorists not dissenters. It targets people with clear ties to Al Queda. It is not some Gestapo-like secret program to target people's opinions. If it were, then where are all these innocent people being unlawfully arrested for expressing an opinion? Don't you think we would have heard about it if it were hapening?

There are stories every day about someone wrongfully arrested who gets no legal representation, no habeas corpus, nothing...

quote: As a matter of fact, it was FDR, a Democrat who created internment camps for japanese during WW2. If anyone was abusing power and subverting civil rights and freedom, it was Roosevelt, not Bush!

two different times... different political landscapes...

I love your two-faced approach to debate... applaud one violation of liberties and freedom, and denounce another... it fits right in with the obscene hypocrisy and mistruths coming from the Republican party.

	13-07-2003 01:33									#37
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saw the movie. its called 'wag the dog'.

	13-07-2003 01:37									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Sava I didn't just lose... America lost... Democracy lost... pick up a book and educate yourself... that way you can save the embarassment...

Hanging chads, double ballots, ballots with pencil marks, etc are not legal. Surely you can see this, can't you?

You are so partisan! When a republican wins, you think democracy loses. I guess when Clinton won, it was a victory for democracy.

republican. evil. democrats. good. Is that it?

quote: There are stories every day about someone wrongfully arrested who gets no legal representation, no habeas corpus, nothing...

yes, terrorists, not ordinary people.

quote: two different times... different political landscapes...

So what FDR did was ok then because we were in WW2? Aren't we at war now? So, it is ok to intern innocent japanese because we were at war with Japan and they might be spies, but it is not ok to investigate saudis or other arabs who might have terrorist connections because we are at war with islamic extremists?

Aren't you the one being a bit hypocritcal here?

	13-07-2003 01:53									#39
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quote: You are so partisan! When a republican wins, you think democracy loses. I guess when Clinton won, it was a victory for democracy. republican. evil. democrats. good. Is that it?

You really need to pay more attention to this forum... I hate Clinton... both parties are corporate wh0res.

quote: yes, terrorists, not ordinary people

talk about going through life with blinders....

quote: So what FDR did was ok then because we were in WW2? Aren't we at war now? So, it is ok to intern innocent japanese because we were at war with Japan and they might be spies, but it is not ok to investigate saudis or other arabs who might have terrorist connections because we are at war with islamic extremists?

I'm not going to comment on the Japanese internment... different times... such a threadjack would be irrelevant, and I'm not going to allow you to go down some tangent just because you are getting slaughtered on the main topic.

	13-07-2003 11:27									#40
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I'm a leftist and I don't think Bush stole the election. Wait a minute- I'm not a leftist. I'm just a wannabe leftist.

didn't the dems throw out thousands of military votes? We all know with the military votes Bush would have won easily.

Lately, I've been kind of wishing Gore won- long as Lieberman has the power that Cheney has now . I like leiberman. He's one of the very few sensible democrats.

	14-07-2003 00:10									#41
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oh yeah it wasn't an 'leftist' opinion about the head of the CIA saying that that particular document was a forgery, it was a fact(main headlines on our bbc news over here).
And I'm for no particular side of this left/right nonsense. Sometimes i like human kind, sometimes i don't.
I just found it funny that no one at the whitehouse had botherd to let our Prime Minister know this fact as over here it is a corner stone of the pro-war argument

It makes it seem all so well organised