18-07-2003 19:22									#1
	Humvee Safety Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I just read that another soldier dies due to a bomb blast from under a Humvee. It seems that we lose more guys being bombed or hit by rocket propelled gernades, why don't our soldiers ride around in the Bradley Fighting Vehicles instead, instead of what appears to the defenseless Humvees. Do we just not have enough of the Bradleys? Need some military logistical advice here.

	18-07-2003 19:26									#2
	Re: Humvee Safety Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Defiant I just read that another soldier dies due to a bomb blast from under a Humvee. It seems that we lose more guys being bombed or hit by rocket propelled gernades, why don't our soldiers ride around in the Bradley Fighting Vehicles instead, instead of what appears to the defenseless Humvees. Do we just not have enough of the Bradleys? Need some military logistical advice here.

hi ,

a 200 pound bomb gets even a bradley , .......

there are plenty of bradleys

have a nice day

	18-07-2003 19:28									#3
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Why haven't we heard of any Bradley's being taken down, are just not targeted? I have no idea of the explosive power of a 200 pound bomb.

	18-07-2003 19:32									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Defiant Why haven't we heard of any Bradley's being taken down, are just not targeted? I have no idea of the explosive power of a 200 pound bomb.

hi ,

there have been , 200 pounds , , enough to make a large hole in an M1a2 , .......

it all depends how the charge is build , is it directed or not , what is it made out off , ....

normally this is dont like this , one pound of explosive power means what one pound of dynamite would blow up , the explosive power has nothing to do with the real weight (!)

have a nice day

	18-07-2003 19:33									#5
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Well, to me it doesn't seem like a problem. The hmmv that is. They are more mobile anyway. The power of 200 pound bomb properly made will destroy lots of things. It's enough to bring down Las Vegas hotels, if set properly.

I don't know what kind of explosives they use though, but I don't think that's the problem. Add more armour, and it's less mobile and a target for different set of dangers.

	18-07-2003 19:34									#6
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Bradleys are tracked. That means they **** up roads, their tracks wear out, they're 50-100 times as time and cost intensive to maintain compared to a Humvee. They're also a lot slower, and consume a lot more fuel.

Bradleys are being used to support infantry in securing occupied areas, in base security, for rapid response by mech infantry, etc. The airborne doesn't have them at all, and neither do non-line division units (i.e. aviation, MP, loggies, etc.) so they're also only available to 3 ID, 4 ID and 1 AD troops.

	18-07-2003 19:35									#7
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

hi ,

btw , there are many types of hummvee , each with different levels of protection , .....

most of the troops remove the doors and side plating in order to have things a bit cooler and to move faster , .....

have a nice day

	18-07-2003 19:37									#8
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Defiant Why haven't we heard of any Bradley's being taken down, are just not targeted? I have no idea of the explosive power of a 200 pound bomb.

Even a crude 200 pound bomb under a street surface can take out an Abrams.

Bradleys aren't targeted much because they operate with their infantry, and often in platoon or company strength, with a lot of mutually supporting firepower.

We don't have near enough troops in theater to be everywhere in strength, so the *******s focus on the small pieces they can take on, and leave the big forces alone.

	18-07-2003 19:41									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Sure.. also in terrain and place like Iraq.. I'd might to bet more on mobility than armour. A big blast will stop heavier stuff for a moment, becoming target for ambush.
I wouldn't bet on how much the enemy has piercing and blasting material, but bet on how fast the thing goes to get away. The temperature factor is also th ere, just like panag said. It's hot enough outdoors yet alone, not even talking about inside vehicles.

It's a tough decision. Just like in the level of one trooper. You might not want to wear all the super kevlars and armour that could stop 7.62 bullets shot from 100 meters away in theory. It's hot, they weigh a lot and they make you slow. So drop some of them and you're faster, and more unlikely get hit. At least in combat situation. YOu don't need anything really, helmet, your combat vest and maybe knee pads, and set of gloves. Should be enough to protect you.

So, IMO it's not a problem. The problem is to keep the roads clear and avoid getting convoys to ambushes. But then again that's almost impossible too. Hey, this gives me some ideas.. Maybe I should get my papers and design some new weaponry against these situations for Punisher Weapon Systems..

Last edited by Pekka on 18-07-2003 at 19:46

	18-07-2003 19:48									#10
	Put an end to popups!

M998

The M998, M998A1, M1038 and M1038A1 HMMWVs are cargo/troop carrier configurations of the HMMWV family. The vehicles are equipped with basic armor and used to transport equipment, materials, and/or personnel. The cargo carrier configuration is capable of transporting a payload (including crew) of 2,500 pounds and the troop carrier is capable of transporting a two man crew and eight passengers. Both use a troop seat kit for troop transport operations. The cargo/troop carrier can also be configured in a four man crew configuration. The vehicles can climb 60% slopes and traverse a side slope of up to 40% fully loaded. The vehicles can ford hard bottom water crossing up to 30 inches without a deep water fording kit and up to 60 inches with the kit. The M1038, M1038A1 are equipped with the self-recovery winch which can also be used to recover like systems. The M998A1 and M1038A1 models have the latest modifications applied to the vehicles.



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M1097

The M1097 and M1097A1 HMMWVs are higher payload capacity cargo/troop carrier configurations of the HMMWV family. The vehicles are equipped with basic armor and used to transport equipment, materials, and/or personnel, like the M998/M1038 series, except with a higher payload capacity. The cargo carrier is capable of transporting a payload (including crew) of 4,575 poundsand the troop carrier is capable of transporting a two man crew and eight passengers. Both use a troop seat kit for troop transport operations, a 200 ampere umbilical power cable to power shelter equipment, and stowage racks for ammunition and equipment. To accommodate the higher payload capacity, the vehicles are equipped with a re-inforced frame, crossmembers, lifting shackles, heavy duty rear springs, shock absorbers, reinforced control arms, heavy duty tires and rims, and a transfer case and differential with modified gear ratio. The vehicles can climb 60% slopes and traverse a side slope of up to 40% fully loaded. The vehicles can ford hard bottom water crossing up to 30 inches without a deep water fording kit and up to 60 inches with the kit. The M1097A1 is equipped with the self-recovery winch which can also be used to recover like systems and has the latest modifications applied to the vehicle.



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M1025

The M1025, M1025A1, M1026 and M1026A1 HMMWVs are Armament Carrier configurations of the HMMWV family. The vehicles are equipped with basic armor and the weapon mount, located on the roof of the vehicle, is adaptable to mount either the M60, 7.62mm machine gun; M2 .50 caliber machine gun; or the MK 19 Grenade Launcher. The weapons platform can be traversed 360 degrees. The vehicles can climb 60% slopes and traverse a side slope of up to 40% fully loaded. The vehicles can ford hard bottom water crossing up to 30 inches without a deep water fording kit and up to 60 inches with the kit. The M1026/M1026A1 are equipped with the self-recovery winch which can also be used to recover like systems. The M1025A1 and M1026A1 models have the latest modifications applied to the vehicles.



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M1043

The M1043, M1043A1, M1044, and M1044A1 HMMWVs are Armament Carrier configurations of the HMMWV family. The vehicles are equipped with supplemental armor and the weapon mount, located on the roof of the vehicle, is adaptable to mount either the M60, 7.62mm machine gun; M2 .50 caliber machine gun; or the MK 19 Grenade Launcher. The weapons platform can be traversed 360 degrees. The vehicles can climb 60% slopes and traverse a side slope of up to 40% fully loaded. The vehicles can ford hard bottom water crossing up to 30 inches without a deep water fording kit and up to 60 inches with the kit. The M1044/M1044A1 are equipped with the self-recovery winch which can also be used to recover like systems. The M1043A1 and M1044A1 models have the latest modifications applied to the vehicles.



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M1037

The M1037 and M1042 HMMWVs are Shelter Carrier configurations of the HMMWV family. The vehicle are equipped with basic armor and used to secure and transport the S250 electrical equipment shelter with a total payload (including crew) of 3,600 pounds. The vehicles can climb 60% slopes and traverse a side slope of up to 40% fully loaded. The vehicles can ford hard bottom water crossing up to 30 inches without a deep water fording kit and up to 60 inches with the kit. The M1042 is equipped with the self-recovery winch which can also be used to recover like systems.



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M997M1035

The M996, M996A1, M997, M997A1, M1035 and M1035A1 HMMWVs are the Ambulance configuration of the HMMWV family. The vehicles are equipped with basic armor and used to transport casualties from the battlefield to the medical aid stations. The M996/M996A1 are designated as Mini-Ambulances and can transport up to 2 litter patients, 6 ambulatory patients or a combination of litter and ambulatory patients. The M997/M997A1 are designated as Maxi-Ambulances and can transport up to 4 litter patients, 8 ambulatory patients, or a combination of litter and ambulatory patients. The M1035/M1035A1 are soft-top Ambulances and can transport up to 2 litter patients. The vehicles can climb 60% slopes and traverse a side slope of up to 40% fully loaded. The vehicles can ford hard bottom water crossing up to 30 inches without a deep water fording kit and up to 60 inches with the kit. These configurations of the HMMWV are not equipped with the self-recovery winch. The M996A1, M997A1 and M1035A1 models have the latest modifications applied to the vehicles.



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M1109/M1114

The M1109 and M1114 HMMWVs are an Up-Armored Armament Carrier configuration of the HMMWV family. The vehicles are equipped with additional armor both on the sides and underneath to protect the crew from small arms ammunition and mines. The weapon mount, located on the roof of the vehicle, is adaptable to mount either the M60, 7.62mm machine gun; M2 .50 caliber machine gun; or the MK 19 Grenade Launcher. The weapons platform can be traversed 360 degrees. This confirguration of the HMMWV is equipped with the self-recovery winch.

The Up-Armored HMMWV is designed to conduct reconnaissance and security operations as its primary function. Up-Armored HMMWVs are organic to the scout platoons of the armored, infantry, and mechanized infantry battalions. Up-Armored HMMWV-mounted scouts enhance the capability of scout platoons to provide accurate and timely information about the enemy and the area of operations.

During reconnaissance operations, the scouts provide the commander with a mobile reconnaissance platform to perform detailed route, zone, and area reconnaissance; prevent surprise by enemy forces; and help retain the freedom to maneuver. The speed, mobility, and stealth of the Up-Armored HMMWV also allows the scout to extend the depth of his reconnaissance, providing increased security and additional time and maneuver space for the commander. Due to its small signature relative to the Cavalry Fighting Vehicle (M3), the Up-Armored HMMWV provides the stealth necessary to conduct detailed reconnaissance in areas where contact with the enemy is possible. This information is rapidly reported to higher headquarters through secure radio means or by physical delivery (particularly during periods of reduced electronic communications).

Security operations are also significantly enhanced by Up-Armored HMMWV-mounted scouts. In screen missions, scouts operating independently, or in conjunction with other reconnaissance elements, will be used to establish observation posts to the front or flank of the maneuver force, patrol between observation posts, and cover gaps between forces. In rear areas, Up-Armored HMMWV-mounted scouts enhance security by patrolling primary lines of communication, providing threat early warning to rear area units, and reconnoitering potential threat landing and drop zones.

	18-07-2003 19:58									#11
	Suffering from ads?

It seems like most of the attacks are rocket propelled gernades and smaller mine explosives. I thought I saw Bradley type(size) vehicles on TV with standard(huge) rubber tires, but I am no expert and that is why I was aksing for information. If I had a choice between being mobile or protected, take the protection any day, most of these hits are not combat situation but pot shot attacks. Then again, I am not there either under 114 degree heat.

	18-07-2003 19:59									#12
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat We don't have near enough troops in theater to be everywhere in strength, so the *******s focus on the small pieces they can take on, and leave the big forces alone.

But remember - this conflict is nothing like Vietnam at all.....

	18-07-2003 20:04									#13
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In Vietnam "they" (resisting the use of other terms ) had a superpower and a major regional power actively supporting and supplying them, they had two alledgedly neutral countries they used as sanctuary areas, they had a shitload of jungle to hide in and under so they could move all over the place outside our surveillance capabilities, and they inflicted fatalities at a rate of 100-200 per week. So sorry, the Vietnam analogy is a bad joke. It's about as applicable as saying "it's another Arbella"