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Ljube
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Belgrade
May 2003
time: 06:30
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quote:
Originally posted by finbar
Nong. MP and SP are exactly the same when it comes to maps. As soon as you meet another civ in the game, you have the option to exchange maps. In SP, you will just about always need the other civ to be Worshipful (or Enthusiastic, at the least) in order for them to agree to an exchange. Handing them a zillion techs usually does the job. Unless you've got a dodgy reputation. Next turn, of course, regardless, they're back to hating your guts. |
Well, I must have played hundreds of games in single player and I have never been able to exchange maps with a civilisation that didn't have map making. It works like this: On our first contact, I sign a peace treaty and want to exchange maps. I know that they must be at least enthusiastic, but this one civ has been a tough nut to crack. Since they didn't have map making, and didn't want it at all, in order to exchange maps, I was forced to give them 3 extra techs even after we have reached worshipful, and then, as a second option, map making appeared, which I gave them promptly, and finally they exchanged maps with me. I emphasize that I have tried to exchange every time when they became worshipful, but success came only after I gave them map making. Coincidence?
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Carolus Rex
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Sweden
Jan 1970
time: 06:30
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quote:
Originally posted by finbar
For crying out loud! It's very simple!
You have the capacity to trade maps in SP as soon as you meet another civ in the game. Just as in MP. In SP, whether an AI civ will agree to trade maps is another matter. But the capacity exists. Start an SP game, meet a civ, look at the options available under "Have A Proposal To Make". You can ask to exchange maps.
The thread to which Slow Thinker linked talks about the AI civs' willingness to trade maps. The rule of thumb is that an AI civ will probably agree to exchange maps if:
(a) Their attitude is Worshipful or Enthusiastic. They will rarely agree at a level below Enthusiastic;
(b) You have a Spotless reputation. They will rarely agree if your reputation is less than Spotless;
(c) You are allied with the AI civ in question. But even this doesn't guarantee they will agree.
So, once again, for the slow people - and the very slow person, the economist - you have the capacity to exchange maps with an AI civ from the first meeting. Whether or not the AI civ will agree to an exchange is a different matter. |
No, no, no...
Ok, another economist adds to the confusion. If the AI doesn't have Map Making there will never be an exchange of maps no matter how much they regard you. The reply is always "We don't need your useless maps!".
So, while the option (or "capacity" as you put it) indeed always exists under the "Have a Proposal to Make"-menu it will never actually work without the AI having Map Making. I guess it's convenient programming (otherwise they would have needed two menus: one before Map Making is discovered and one after).
Maybe we're splitting hairs here, but that's one thing economists are good at...  
Edited: Put in a space between one of the commas and one of the "no":s... Yes, it's true. Being a perfectionist slows down life so much ...
Carolus
Last edited by Carolus Rex on 16-08-2003 at 18:29
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Carolus Rex
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Sweden
Jan 1970
time: 06:30
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Ah yes, I can see the intro now... A retired Alan Greenspan sneaking up behind an unsuspecting banker walking down an abandoned street, a knife in his hand, whispering hoarsely to his victim: Can you say interest rate cut?
Carolus
Last edited by Carolus Rex on 16-08-2003 at 23:05
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SlowThinker
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homeless, Praha, Czech Republic
Jan 2000
time: 06:30
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BTW who is the first one?
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Six Thousand Year Old Man
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Ad Rock
Aug 2000
time: 00:30
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I'm going to agree with the economists too (I'm a broker; we always blame the economists when something goes wrong  ).
I play SP on a lot of very large maps. Consequently, a key strategy is to get MPE early, make contact and trade for maps. Both parties need to have Mapmaking for a swap to actually take place. Otherwise, you get the message 'we have no need for your frickin maps', much the way you get the message 'we have no need for your useless techs' when the AI has no technology to swap. Perhaps that was the game designer trying to keep knowledge from the human player - if the map trading option was grayed out, then we would know the AI didn't have Mapmaking (?).
Anyway, there have been MANY times I've stupidly forgotten to check whether the AI had MM after all the tech swaps, and consequently couldn't trade maps. A quick check of the intelligence screen, a gift of MM, and voila, now they'll trade (assuming they're Worshipful or at least Enthused). At which point I know where to send the boats full of Caravans/Crusaders 
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15-08-2003 05:37
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