12-08-2003 14:18									#1
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30 : Tolerant / +10
20 : Repulsive / -6
110: Creative / +8
30 : Production +2 / +6
50 : Production +1 / +3
30 : Omniscient / +3
40 : Artifact HW / +3(?)
30 : Large HW / +1
0 : Rich HW / +2
50 : Dictatorship / 0
30 : Feudal / -4
40 : Uni / +6
40 : Science+2 / +6
120: Subterran / +6
40 : Aquatic / +5(?)
40 : -20& Ship def / -2
80 : Warlord / +4


those are the settings we decided upon, but I must admit I am not sure how to continue from here, we can't take them all , so we need to narrow down a bit................

Any suggestions? I'll think myself as well, but just in case

We could run another poll like the one before but less points for example............or set together out of this result combinations you have to vote upon............

	12-08-2003 17:36									#2
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We could organize them by number of votes, then select the attributes from the most to the least until we use all our picks. If we run out of picks for a selection, we move to the one below it to see if it will fit. That way we get the most picks with the most votes. If we have any points left over we can fight it out in another thread.

	12-08-2003 19:13									#3
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looks like creative/subterranean/warlord/+1 production/dictatorship/LHW

negatives will have to be chosen separately, though I doubt anyone would have anything against -pop/repulsive or even bumping off dictatorship and going feudal/repulsive.

	12-08-2003 20:07									#4
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If we buy into the Creative Subbies for 14 points (yes/no -- first poll for confirmation), then it comes down to the last 6 points (second poll) and the negatives (third poll).

	12-08-2003 20:23									#5
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As Old N Slow already pointed out, creative and Sub have the highest points, but Warlord not being far away.............

But Production isn't so far away either, if you coun't both together.................

Maybe we should mention (just in case for newbies) we start with 10 free points for race picks and can get another 10 by using negative picks for a maximum of 20 points used on positive picks......

	12-08-2003 21:24									#6
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Maybe it is just me, but I do not see Warlord as worth much and certainly not useful for a creative race. It is a special trait as is Fuedal. They should only be used for fast conquest races. I don't think creative fits that.

	12-08-2003 21:29									#7
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Racial traits that fit with each other:


Unification government
Tolerant, +1 production, large
Aquatic, +1 production, +50% growth, rich, large
Aquatic, subterranean, +50% growth or +1 production
Subterranean, +1 food, +1 production, large
Creative, aquatic, large
Aquatic, omniscient, artifacts, rich, large
Aquatic, telepathic, rich, large

Democracy government
Lithovore, rich, large
Aquatic, +1 BC
Creative, aquatic

Regular government
Subterranean, Lithovore, +50% growth, large
Subterranean, aquatic, +100% growth, rich, large
Tolerant, Lithovore
Tolerant, +1 food, +2 production
Aquatic, +100% growth, +2 production, rich, large
Creative, aquatic, +1 production, artifacts, large
Creative, Lithovore, rich
Telepathic, Lithovore, artifacts, large
Telepathic, feudal, aquatic, rich, +50 ship offense, omniscient

	12-08-2003 22:19									#8
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Perhaps we should do a point choice on negatives and then go with the most popular negatives to balance out the total.

	13-08-2003 19:00									#9
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OK another idea:

Everyone chooses and post a combo out of what is there and what he wants to use, staying within the limitations of MoO2 (so max. of -10 points for negative picks and therefore not more than +20 on positive picks.) This way we might be able to come down to only a few solutions on which we can vote in a normal poll?

might be the best to continue from here

How you think about this one?

	13-08-2003 20:01									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Whoha looks like creative/subterranean/warlord/+1 production/dictatorship/LHW

That's 8 + 6 + 4 + 3 + 1 = 22. Won't do.
At least calc tells me so =)

	13-08-2003 20:52									#11
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It works, because he is using 1.2 version.
So it is 6+6+4+3+1=20

	13-08-2003 21:03									#12
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no im using 1.3 with creative at 6.

	13-08-2003 22:31									#13
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I know, it was like that in earlier versions, but look up to the first post in this thread. I thought it was decided already to use 1.31?

	13-08-2003 22:40									#14
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Me, too. I don't have 1.2.

	14-08-2003 03:38									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Whoha no im using 1.3 with creative at 6.

The readme says that 1.3 changed the creative to 8 picks. So I don't get it, what are you saying, that you have done something to your version?

	14-08-2003 04:17									#16
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yea, i've got the data file that makes the cost of creative 6 instead of 8.

and I have 1.31 not 1.3, messed up there.

	14-08-2003 06:10									#17
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That is what I figured.

	14-08-2003 07:35									#18
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if we use creative Ill probably have to dig up the file to put it to 8.

	14-08-2003 18:52									#19
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So gent's how shall we continue with the rest? Or do you leave it up to me ?

	14-08-2003 20:48									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Gilgamensch OK another idea: Everyone chooses and post a combo out of what is there and what he wants to use, staying within the limitations of MoO2 (so max. of -10 points for negative picks and therefore not more than +20 on positive picks.) This way we might be able to come down to only a few solutions on which we can vote in a normal poll? might be the best to continue from here How you think about this one?

Creative Subbies = 14 pts.

Next six points are Aquatic, LHW or +2 pro (I'm sort of indifferent -- both look good to me.)

Negs: Repulsive (6) , - ground (2) , -ship def (2).

The creative slows us down a bit, but saves many choices (and votes). Repulsive simplifies the activity as well. To offset the ground, we simply have to build a few more transports wnehver we go any where in force; since we get to attack first, ship def is less important.

	14-08-2003 21:04									#21
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I am willing to leave it up to you.

	14-08-2003 23:10									#22
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I still think we should compile three race types and vote between the three. Barring that, you can decide.

	20-08-2003 08:52									#23
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hey guys, I am new here but I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents anyway. IMO the best picks are creative, telepathic, and uni...with negs on combat spying and low g. I've had loads of success with this race. the telepathic and the uni overide the spying neg and the telepathic overides the ground combat neg...plus the uni helps out with the low g until the right tech comes along. let me know what you guys think.

	20-08-2003 10:49									#24
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One of many solid race. I am not fond of LowG, but have used it many times. If you use LowG, you almost have to use -spy.

	20-08-2003 19:10									#25
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Why would you need a negative spy bonus if you choose low gravity? Just for the additional picks?

	20-08-2003 22:11									#26
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Because -5 means you need -3 and -2 to get to 10. Unless you want to use less than the full 10. So I would expect to see LowG, -spy, -GC for 10. You could use poor home world and -2, -2, but PHW is nasty.

	20-08-2003 22:40									#27
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Yes PHW does suck royally. The only other viable option for the negs would be to pick repulsive and then ground combat and ship defense. However, I find its helpful to make a few friends in the begining of the game utilizing the diplomacy bonus that telepathic gives you. Normally I'll try and make friends with the Gnolams or the Alkari because they are not a threat and are fairly friendly, considering that they always wait till I'm on the other side of the galaxy before they backstab me...esspecially in Impossible mode. In the end though you are right; this race pick list is one of many options to choose from.

	21-08-2003 01:06									#28
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

no one else uses -pop -money and -ship def?

	21-08-2003 06:43									#29
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I tend to use Rep/-SD/-GC it does not cost me a thing except no trade and no exstortion. I do not want to exstort anyway as it is too easy.
-Pop will hurt. I would use that only as handicap game.

	21-08-2003 20:57									#30
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even with housing? I don't find -pop to be painful at all. And I tend to not extort tech,I either trade or conquer myself. what do you think about -money?