27-08-2003 16:50									#1
	Two strange Moo3 issues. Full PM-box? Change here!

Hi guys.

I have run into 2 really crazy issues with Moo3 this past week. I got a new lap-top computer, then installed Moo3 and the patch as well.

The first problem is the freaky research. In my current game, I have an empire with 400+ planets and a total research output of 6 million points. I'm in the level 40's of all research fields.

The problem is that some techs I have either go in prototype indefinitely (repeats again and again every turn with the "Tech X is going into prototype" in the SitRep), or the research matrix says "1 turn" to get the particular tech.

For example, I have "Heavy Missile Chassis" which is level 35'ish Physical Science (I forgot) but I have all level 36 - 40 Physical Science technologies already researched. For some reason a few technologies refuse to go into prototype EVER, or go into looping prototype (Says "Tech X goes into prototype" BUT never get "Tech X gets completed").

Is that a bug, and what can be done to fix it?



The second issue is game slow-down. I have to wait like forever per turn at the "Ground combat" words on the screen and a planet at the bottom of the screen.

It took 5 minutes by turn 400 on my old computer with 128 MB ram, 1.5 GHZ processor. My new laptop, which I'm using right now has 1 GB RAM and 3 GHZ processor, but takes 3 minutes to wait for the turn to process.

I've read on the boards that a bigger memory RAM and GHZ processor chips means all games will run faster with more memory and power allocated to them.

How come my uber laptop doesn't do the turns in like 30 or 45 seconds like it's supposed to, having 8x the RAM of my old computer and 2x the GHZ processor speed?

Any ideas or recommendations on this one?


Any help would be appreciated on these issues.

	27-08-2003 17:29									#2
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Congratulations on your new laptop! MOO3 runs fine on my laptop with 2.2 GHz P4 and 1/2 gig RAM, so my first suspicion would be background program interference, the first potential culprit a virus checker? Try turning the memory-check feature off on the virus checker and also make sure the virus checker is set to check only program files and not "all files." Caveat emptor on messing with your virus checker, of course. Also check for other programs running in the background and try turning them off, CD player and so forth. Even try shutting down other applications like your mail client, your browser, Adobe reader, Excel, etc., even though with 1 Gig of RAM I would think you would not have memory problems from other applications. BTW, do not Alt-Tab to the desktop once MOO3 is running as this sometimes causes bizarre results.

If none of the above works, post and let us know what processor you are running, what OS, and so forth.

	28-08-2003 04:40									#3
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

what race are you?

	29-08-2003 05:14									#4
	Hmmm Put an end to popups!

I got nothing to help you with. I just haven't posted here for a while, and I wanted to.

	29-08-2003 15:22									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

We really don't get the traffic around here to be good for encountering and solving bugs. The tech one I've never heard of. Tried the official help forum?

Late game slowdown is a problem for some systems, especiallu in the larger universe configurations, but usually consistent with the vast expansion in forces roaming around as you get past turn 200 or so. Running medium sized games on a 2 Ghz I've not had any end-turn results lasting over 10 seconds.

	02-09-2003 09:33									#6
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Forget the ATMOO forum! Nothing there but the blind leading the sightless.

!. Stuck research. Game bug, no workaround, may need to reload the game from scratch.

2. Length of turns in large and huge galaxies after about 250 turns... take wayyyyyyyy toooooo long! Bad AI combat engine. Needs to be rewritten in assembly.

Last edited by BenRipped on 03-09-2003 at 03:14

	02-09-2003 19:54									#7
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by BenRipped Forget the ASTMOO forum! Nothing there but the blind leading the sightless.

Its mostly the same here ... we just tend to be more polite about our answers, when we actually know any

	03-09-2003 04:05									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Grumbold, what do you do to have your "past turn 200" only last 10 seconds?

My OS system is Windows XP, and I tried disabling Norton virus autoscan or whatever its called. I have the antivirus thing installed when I had this laptop custom made.

Are there any ways I could fix this issue? Could any of you give me ideas or steps or anything?

I have the processor and memory power, basically a uber top-of-the-line laptop which can outpeform most desktops. Yet, the laptop lags almost the same as a slow desktop?



About the tech thing, I have another example. I got tech level 40 in physics, enabling me to research Behemoth class starship. But after 100 turns I still don't get "prototype in progess". I generate 6.5 million research points a turn.

Also, some other techs do get researched and completed, while others go into this infinite loop like the Behemoth tech (either get "prototype progress" 100 turns in a row.... or no "prototype progress" at all).



I appreciate all your help and advice on this. If I can get both issues out of the way, I can truly start to enjoy Moo3, and finally get Levithan ships after 6 months rofl.

	03-09-2003 19:48									#9
	Tired of ads?

The only think I "do" is avoid huge maps. Other than that I have no custom content at all. Since my game has never slowed down significantly I haven't needed to seek a solution. Nor have I had the tech bug in my 3 post-patch games, for that matter.

	14-09-2003 23:09									#10
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I have the same problem with than other game afew time. I just unintrall the game and patch and run evident elimator to get rid of all delete file's. I hope this help you.

	15-09-2003 00:01									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Stuck research looks to be related to overruns from what i've seen.

	15-09-2003 01:12									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I've seen turns take a while (a minute or two) for huge galaxies after turn 250 or so. But then I've got an older P3 450 w/640 mb ram (running a clean non-upgraded XP OS). This is at the very low end of what Moo3 will work on, so I wasn't surprised. I am surprised that new, fast machines are just as slow, if not much slower. Perhaps this isn't related to processor speed?

	15-09-2003 03:52									#13
	Increase Your PM Length

AFAIK it has a lot to do with your available RAM.
There were already some Threads shot after MOO3 came out, where it became clear, that too few RAM could be a posible cause for the Game slowing down.

The Posts in this Thread also seem to support this.
Sovereign with just 128 MB (but a High End Processor) has massive Problems with the Game slowing down.
Hydro and Wilebill with a RAM of >= 512 Megs don´t have this problöem,s to such an extent as Sovereign (although Hydros Processor is much slower than soveeogns).
I have also 512 MB RAM and just a 900 MHz T-Bird, and I also don´t have any grave Problems with the Game slowing down in later turns (and I always play on huge Maps )
So I just can recommend you to upgrade your RAM, Sovereign

	16-09-2003 21:08									#14
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Hi Proteus,

I'd like to clear the misunderstanding.

I have TWO computers. One desktop, and one laptop (new).

My desktop = 128 MB RAM and 1.5 GHZ p4 processor.

My laptop = 1 GB RAM and 3.0 GHZ processor.


Moo3 still runs slow on my laptop even though it has 8 times the RAM of my old desktop computer, and 2 times the processor speed. I think it may not be the processor or RAM that is making the game slow down.

My laptop for some reason, despite its super-powered memory, processors, and systems doesn't show any significant improvement over my old desktop.

Hopefully this helps clear things up Proteus.

	16-09-2003 23:49									#15
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Sovereign Hi Proteus, I'd like to clear the misunderstanding. I have TWO computers. One desktop, and one laptop (new). My desktop = 128 MB RAM and 1.5 GHZ p4 processor. My laptop = 1 GB RAM and 3.0 GHZ processor. Moo3 still runs slow on my laptop even though it has 8 times the RAM of my old desktop computer, and 2 times the processor speed. I think it may not be the processor or RAM that is making the game slow down. My laptop for some reason, despite its super-powered memory, processors, and systems doesn't show any significant improvement over my old desktop. Hopefully this helps clear things up Proteus.

When a computer games I than playing act realy weid like
your on the laptop I uninstall the game and run any program that delete the files on your harddrive( Windows
doesnot really delete the files). Then I reinstall the game.

Can it also be the hardware artch is different from the desktop artch. That the reason I avoid buying laptop computer as many game have touble running on then.

	19-09-2003 00:07									#16
	Inflate your Upload Space

Charles,

I tried running other games and programs on my lap-top computer, and they run just fine.

Even the vaunted Rise of Nations runs just fine on my lap-top... no bugs or game crashes on that game yet (even though many of you had trouble with RoN on desktop computers).

So if RoN, the computer wrecker can work fine on my lap-top then Moo3 should, but yet it doesn't.

You know what I think? Even if there was a 100 GB RAM, 100 GHZ computer in 2050 AD, Moo3 would still run slow on that giga super computer

	19-09-2003 03:25									#17
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Sovereign Charles, I tried running other games and programs on my lap-top computer, and they run just fine. Even the vaunted Rise of Nations runs just fine on my lap-top... no bugs or game crashes on that game yet (even though many of you had trouble with RoN on desktop computers). So if RoN, the computer wrecker can work fine on my lap-top then Moo3 should, but yet it doesn't. You know what I think? Even if there was a 100 GB RAM, 100 GHZ computer in 2050 AD, Moo3 would still run slow on that giga super computer

May be when you install MOO3 it didnot install all the files correctly so uninstalling and installing it might solved your problem unless it like Windows the more memeny you have the more of it it use.

	19-09-2003 12:03									#18
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

He-he an AI may be designed to use all of the resources it can get and this way to improve the taken decisions, but not its performance. May be this is the case with MOO3 ... Of course this will not stop the AI of taking stupid decisions sometimes. It will get better ones only according to its point of view which is hard-coded and cannot be changed :-)

	22-09-2003 08:44									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

It may be that something else has to be researched first, as sometimes 2 or 3 schools of research have to be done. If not check over at the Atari Forums, probably something there about it.

	23-09-2003 20:40									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Raion, whats the website or link for the Atari forums?

I appreciate all the help here, and I'm trying to get to the bottom of this problem.

By the way, I just tested my lap-top with RoN again, but this time, I moved about 100'ish units at once. I edited the max pop to 999, so I could maximize the number of units moving on my screen. My lap-top didn't suffer a choppy slowdown with all these units moving around.

Then I tried Moo3's tactical combat. I sent 180 of my ships to fight a 180 ship enemy taskforce (we both had carriers and zillions of beam weapons) and my lap-top ran that just fine, with no choppiness, just like with RoN.

That really makes me wonder. If my lap-top can handle tons of graphics moving around in a limited or defined area, then why can't it handle the simple "between-turn" calculations such as unit movements, population growth, production of units or structures, etc? Computers can do billions of those calculations per second?

What am I missing here?

	23-09-2003 20:51									#21
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

May-be your laptop doesnot like MOO3 for some reason, I have game which could run on my computer refuse to run on it.

	10-10-2003 22:29									#22
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Here's a shot in the dark...

How much free hard drive space do you have on you laptop? Some programs need lots of HD space while they're running.

	18-10-2003 15:45									#23
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I'm having the same problem. My computer is 1.5-1.6GHz and 128MB ram. It runs slow on huge galaxy when nearly everything is colonized

	27-10-2003 04:56									#24
	Got spare money?

My hard drive has a total capacity of 80 GB, Zanthis.