28-08-2003 12:39									#31
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Strange timing. We have had several dog attacks child incidents in the past 10 days here. All the same breed. Akita (sp?).

	28-08-2003 12:40									#32
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Those are interesting suggestions Pekka. Especially the last one

	28-08-2003 12:40									#33
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As for credentials, I've been attacked by a former police dog, and I ran away (in my fathers friends yard, so no I wasn't doing anything illegal) because it charged me like a bull and I thought I'd make it out of its range (it was on leash), but those are some fast animals if they start raging. It got my ancle, and downed me in second and started chewing my thigh. Don't make the same mistake, it hurts like hell because rarely they let go even when the owner comes raging and getting the dog away from you. They are in kill mode, they won't have any sympathy for you, so you shouldn't have either. Kill the bastard with a hard kick to its stomach. Or you end up in the dogs stomach.

If you get downed, don't scream like a little girl. Go 'GRRRRRRGRRRRRR!' like a big testosterone man, because at least that way they'll remember you as fighting warrior and not little girl.

	28-08-2003 12:42									#34
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Spiffor, well the dog owner is responsible. If the dog attacks, the owner IS responsible. If the dog is outside without any restriction, and it attacks, it's the owners fault. If some dog comes and bites my nuts off because the owner is inside looking spring break girls gone wild and zipping beer when I can't ever enjoy those videos again because of the owner, I'll be sure to slap them around and steal their ****!

Besides, if they attack you without you doing anything, they just went nuts and have to be put to sleep anyway. You are doing the owner a favour by doing it for free.
They don't understand when you say 'stop, it hurts!' They won't STOP. They're raging animals at that point and they won't have any sympathy for you. Listen, it's very simple. It's you or the dog at that point. When they see the blood, they go like 'Wuf! This is what I was supposed to do, this is what I'm made for yeahh lets eat this human!'. Don't let it happen. Besides, I'm a dog lover and I love dogs, so this is not some psycho ranting about wanting to kill dogs. This is clear self defense and if it attacks, you better take the dog out cold.

	28-08-2003 12:50									#35
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One of the incidents, the dog ripped into a 15 year old girl's face, right in front of the owner.

	28-08-2003 12:50									#36
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I am a dog hater and I wholeheartedly agree with you. When in killer mode, the beast will not let go, that's obvious.

I often figured how to defend myself in the case of a dog attack. The only possible answer was utter ruthlessness (and possibly some cruelty over the corpse, to get the stress out).

But I was never fond of making justice myself past self defense. You can be sure I'd bring the police and I'll sue the sucker the eyes out of their orbits.

	28-08-2003 12:51									#37
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Also dogs ears are very sensitive to them. So you can think about ripping them if you're down and it's on your face. Put the other arm in front of you, so it'll start biting it, and with your other hand rip the ear off, at the same time standing up, because it will be in horrible pains and might let go of your arm, now it's the time for the penalty kick. Dogs kill people everyday, so you better make sure you're not going down easy.

	28-08-2003 12:52									#38
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That's exaclty what I mean! It doesn't matter if the owner is there, if it attacks you, it won't stop! THe dog will be eliminated anyway after the attack, so it's about how much damage you will take. I suggest you take minimum damage.

Spiffor, and yeah, it's difficult to fight with a dog, but it's good to know that try to protect your nuts, face and neck/throat, because those are your sore spots, and the dog will go for them all when given the opportunity. Small dogs are easier to kick, but bigger dogs man that's a tough one, you get in trouble for sure. Then just be animal yourself, rip it's face and go for the stomach.

And that's why you fix your shirt arabian style to have it working like a mask when you kick the owners butt, if the owner is inside house. Then you sue afterwards anyway and deny everything.

	28-08-2003 15:44									#39
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither One of the incidents, the dog ripped into a 15 year old girl's face, right in front of the owner.

For some reason Akitas like to go for the face.

	28-08-2003 15:48									#40
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Another thing to keep in mind regarding dogs is that they are much weaker when they are in the air than when they are on the ground. If you can get ahold of their collar with one hand, throw the other under their belly and lift them into the air. They are very weak here. Now you can either stuff them into a garbage can, throw them off of a bridge or break their back by slamming them down on something hard, like your knee if necessary. Any dog not completely crazed with blood lust will succumb to a body slam, especially when you follow up with a series of hard kicks to the abdomen. Crazy dogs will probably require the back breaking throw, or a savage coup de grace after the body slam.

	28-08-2003 22:59									#41
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No dog breed is inherently dangerous. One of my aunts breed a rotweiler with a standard Doberman..the resulting animals were beautiful..imagine a rotweiler whose features have been elongated and made sleeker. She had this b1tch in her far, and at under 1 year of age the dog was already over 100lbs. She was also incredably sweet and playfull (though at that size, it can easily push someone down).

If a dog is danagerous, it is the fault of the owner, not the dog. These dogs are inherently guard dogs of a specific group they come to trust..it is that characteristic that people can warp..but people are still necessary to do the warping. The dangerous breed here is man; the dogs only get abused.

	28-08-2003 23:07									#42
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It mostly comes down to the owner.

My next door neighbor has a Doberman - Tasha. Tasha isn't what I'd call outgoing & affectionate, but neither is she scary or aggressive. There are tons of kids in the immediate area, and she roams freely amongst them. The only time I've ever seen her get the slightest bit agitated is when I was taking care of my friend's Labrador puppy (Gus) and Gus jumped on Tasha's head (Gus thinks that's a good way to say "Hi! Can I be your friend?!?!"). Three words from Tasha's owner ("Tasha - go home!") ended the encounter.

Having said all that, gimme the Golden or Black Lab any day. Even if they jump on your head to say hi.

-Arrian

	29-08-2003 00:04									#43
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Its not the breed of dog that matters (although obviously a large breed is potentially more dangerous than a small one) it's the attitude of the morons who abuse the dogs to the point where they become psychotic/vicious.

	29-08-2003 00:16									#44
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Look, I know it ultimately rests with the owner in regards to the temperament of their dog.

BUT, certain breeds, such as ones I mentioned, are POTENTIALLY more dangerous than others.

	29-08-2003 00:21									#45
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Sure. And certain people (say, big ones) are POTENTIALLY more dangerous than others. But let's not ban them, ok?

Not the best analogy, I admit. But as a dog lover, I have to counter the wacko extreme hysteria about vicious dogs in this thread. And I don't even really like Dobs, Rotts, or PBs.

-Arrian

	29-08-2003 00:26									#46
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quote: As for credentials, I've been attacked by a former police dog, and I ran away

Yup, as MtG said, I guess dogs are a good judge of character... sorry Pekka.

In general people with those breeds train them to be aggressive. However, not all are that way. My wife and I hooked up one of my friends with a Rot. puppy last year. It was 4 pounds when he got it, it is now 120 pounds. It is the alpha male puppy and his dad it about 180 pounds of pure muscle! The dog, however, never barks and is the calmest dog in the world.

I know pitbulls that also have good temperments. Thus, I don't contribute behavior to the breed so much as its training... don't be a breedist MrFun...

Another thing. If the dog was going to hurt you it would of... It also thinks it now has you under control seeing as you probably reacted with fear towards it; and they can sense that. Had you just of ignored it, it probably would of been a lot friendlier to you... Why do you think dogs bark at the mailman? Pretty much you are now at the mercy of a dog, and that is laughable. You should go and get to know the dog before you start making such blatant accusations... your so prejudice.

That is all... Or you could just go buy a bullmasive and have it dominate the little runt!

	29-08-2003 00:26									#47
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No, I wouldn't say outright ban certain breeds -- read my post in which I described the lovable doberman owned by my best friend's aunt.

	29-08-2003 00:28									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Japher Yup, as MtG said, I guess dogs are a good judge of character... sorry Pekka. In general people with those breeds train them to be aggressive. However, not all are that way. My wife and I hooked up one of my friends with a Rot. puppy last year. It was 4 pounds when he got it, it is now 120 pounds. It is the alpha male puppy and his dad it about 180 pounds of pure muscle! The dog, however, never barks and is the calmest dog in the world. I know pitbulls that also have good temperments. Thus, I don't contribute behavior to the breed so much as its training... don't be a breedist MrFun... Another thing. If the dog was going to hurt you it would of... It also thinks it now has you under control seeing as you probably reacted with fear towards it; and they can sense that. Had you just of ignored it, it probably would of been a lot friendlier to you... Why do you think dogs bark at the mailman? Pretty much you are now at the mercy of a dog, and that is laughable. You should go and get to know the dog before you start making such blatant accusations... your so prejudice. That is all... Or you could just go buy a bullmasive and have it dominate the little runt!

And here what is one possibility as a result that I give this supposedly friendly dog a chance -- I get one of my legs ripped off.

	29-08-2003 00:29									#49
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Or humped

Get to know him when his master is around. Either that or call the cops, isn't there a leash law in your county?

	29-08-2003 00:30									#50
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I'm not sure what the laws are . . . .

But the dog DID stop from attacking me even though it could have.

	29-08-2003 00:32									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Japher Had you just of ignored it, it probably would of been a lot friendlier to you...

This is the big problem for people like me who fear dogs. In some circumstances, it is impossible to ignore the dog in the first place, and to act like you didn't notice him. Obviously, dogs generally get agressive when you can't control your fear. I think there has been only one time when I have been attacked by a dog I didn't notice (since the time when I was bitten as a kid).

	29-08-2003 00:33									#52
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You could try and bribe it. Get some Snausages or some other doggie treat from the store, and take 1 (not the whole bag) with you when you leave, when it comes up throw the treat at it... It will love you after that... Either that, or think your made of beef by-products.

	29-08-2003 00:34									#53
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Even though I had a heart attack from this scare, I did not run away, I looked at it nervously, but continued walking at a normal pace.

	29-08-2003 00:36									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Japher You could try and bribe it. Get some Snausages or some other doggie treat from the store

Does it occur to you that when you are attacked or harassed by a dog, you don't have time to go to the police / to the store / to the public phone / to your home ?
It is generally a matter of seconds, especially because dogs run fast.

	29-08-2003 00:37									#55
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Spiffor, he meant for next time, that I should have some kind of treat on hand.

	29-08-2003 00:39									#56
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My dog (A german shepard mix) barks at everyone who comes near the house. She learned how to open the screen door (but only if she sees a cat). Anyway, one of my friends came over, and had never met the dog. He walks in without knocking, as is my policy, and walks right through the house and into the backyard where I was hanging out. Right beside him was the dog behaving very well. The dog never barked, didn't bust open the screen door, nothing... I asked him how he controlled the dog so well, and he said "what dog?"

He is one of my dogs most favorite people, whenever he comes over she never leaves his side. Which is kind of a bummer for me since she is generally at my heals

Anyway, some ppl like dogs, some don't...

Oh, one other thing, many of those aggressive type dogs are cursed with lock-jaw, and I think I would be more scared of that then the actual bite

	29-08-2003 00:39									#57
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quote: Does it occur to you that when you are attacked or harassed by a dog, you don't have time to go to the police / to the store / to the public phone / to your home ?

You can't stop time?

	29-08-2003 00:42									#58
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quote: Originally posted by Japher Oh, one other thing, many of those aggressive type dogs are cursed with lock-jaw, and I think I would be more scared of that then the actual bite

When I encounter one of the few dogs who have a lock-jaw (generally police dogs), I have no fear at all. Despite the claws being potentially very dangerous, I seem only to have a disproportionate fear of being bitten only. Even small annoying barking poodles may scare me in some circumstances.

	29-08-2003 01:14									#59
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Wow... that sucks, Spiff.

I don't really understand people who have that type of fear of dogs (being someone who grew up with a big 'ole Golden Retriever in the house). I'm sure if I was bitten as a kid or something I would have a similar reaction, but I didn't, so it's hard to figure, ya know?

So many people are petrified of dogs that aren't being aggressive at all (just exuberant and friendly). I'm sure Gus scares some people, because of how excited he gets when he sees a person. He gets the full body wag going, and jumps up, and licks, and generally goes berserk (but in a good way, for those of us who understand the body language).

I'm not comparing this to the experiences people have mentioned in this thread, btw, before people accuse me of belittling their fears. It was more of a general observation & memories of childhood friends being scare of my golden retriever (what a joke! It's a golden for chrissakes!).

-Arrian

	29-08-2003 01:24									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor When I encounter one of the few dogs who have a lock-jaw (generally police dogs),

You're thinking of a muzzle. By lock-jaw he means bull-terriers, which can bite down so hard it's impossible to get them to open their mouth and they have to be killed.