06-09-2003 19:19									#1
	Automated Formers Tired of ads?

Anyone know if there's anything that can be done to make automated formers plant only forests (ie tweak some settings in alpha.txt)?

	06-09-2003 19:58									#2
	Suffering from ads?

I know you can disable specific kinds of terraforming in the alpha.txt. However I suspect the actual terraforming AI is embedded in the terran.exe.

If you feel like fiddling with what kinds of terraforming are available, do a search for "#TERRAIN" and adjust lines to suit your preferences. Note that this will affect all terraforming rather than just the automatic formers.

	06-09-2003 20:33									#3
	Re: Automated Formers Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by socrate95 Anyone know if there's anything that can be done to make automated formers plant only forests (ie tweak some settings in alpha.txt)?

I thought there was a menu in the game where you can tweak it. But, I hear it doesn't work anyway as the AI will still have formers plant other stuff.

Jac.

	06-09-2003 21:14									#4
	Put an end to popups!

I'm not worried about the AI's formers. I only worry about my formers. I want them to only plant forests and nothing else. There is a menu in AC, but there is no way to prevent the stupid formers from planting farms, mines and solars.

	07-09-2003 00:49									#5
	Support Apolyton

Yes, autoformers blow goats, unfortunately there's really no way to get around it. I'd like very much if it were possible to fix the AI's terraforming, which is uniformly horrid, but I have a feeling that if the AI were able to terraform well, I would be unable to beat it at Transcend, since they get substantial industry, growth and research bonuses.

	07-09-2003 16:47									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Put arid land world setting and chances are your formers plonk down forests over those dry squares.

Although chances are that the AI might still stuff things up.

"Hey let's mine that rolling square!"

	09-09-2003 12:31									#7
	Re: Automated Formers Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: socrate95 asked: Anyone know if there's anything that can be done to make automated formers plant only forests (ie tweak some settings in alpha.txt)? I'm not worried about the AI's formers. I only worry about my formers. I want them to only plant forests and nothing else. There is a menu in AC, but there is no way to prevent the stupid formers from planting farms, mines and solars.

Automation Preferences {Ctrl+A}

On:
__Automated Formers can plant forests.

On or Off:
__Automated Formers can remove fungus.

Off:
__Automated Formers can raise/lower terrain.
__Automated Formers can build condensers, boreholes, etc.
(does that etc. mean farms, mines, solars?)
__Automated Formers can build sensors.
__Automated Formers can build roads and tubes.

	09-09-2003 21:13									#8
	Remove this text

Yeah, the problem is that there's no switch that says: Formers CAN'T build farms and Formers CAN'T build Solar Collectors.

	20-09-2003 17:07									#9
	Put an end to popups!

There is no way. This means, auto formers are useless in most cases. There are some exceptions:

ctrl shift F forces them to remove fungus only. I usually have some of them.

ctrl shift O forces a former to build sensors only

In some cases it makes sense to automate sea formers, since there are not many options for them.

	20-09-2003 19:48									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Yes automated sea formers are excellent. They even raise sea squares for free!

	21-09-2003 01:26									#11
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Hmm..did not know that

The only thing auto former do decent is the aforementioned fungus removal, as well as road/magtube building.

	21-09-2003 02:35									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Indeed they do. But make sure to check Automated Formers can raise terrains in the Automated section of Preferences.

	30-09-2003 01:56									#13
	Increase the size of your Attachments

you shouldn't have to use autoformer later in the game, each former should be specialized into his own individual tasks and have his job completely picked out.

	30-09-2003 18:18									#14
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Depends on circumstances. Personally, I like to guide my formers early on to clean up my home territory and (after getting WP) build a few choice Boreholes in the Rocky squares. Once that's done and one of the AI decide it's time to vendetta me because of SE choices or because of my refusal to vendetta someone else (Yang, Miriam, and Santiago love doing this to me) & I start kicking ass, I tend to let the new formers auto-improve the base and use my older formers to do brush up work (IE: More boreholes!) on new territory or plant forests/boreholes on islands and put a bunch of sea bases around them for the mineral boost in the early/mid-game period before Adv. Eco Engineering makes tidal harnesses worthwhile. I usually have enough to deal with having to pummel 2-3 different factions without guiding my formers too.

BTW, one of my favorite custom units are (Super) Drop Formers.

	01-10-2003 00:30									#15
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I manual virtualy all my terraforming, even when set to do SIMPLE things like remove fungus the formers are idiots, every former set to auto fungus clearing will target the same patch of fungus on the other end of the continent, then they will laboriously move their over a decade and then the whole group will pick a different patch of fungus back on the other end of the continent and laboriosly move back their while ignoring fungus right next to them!!!!

I have had a bit of success with Auto Mag tubes, as they will thus be upgrading your existing road network to tubes without wasting time building mag tubes from scratch in inapropropiate places.

	01-10-2003 04:44									#16
	Re: Re: Automated Formers Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by gwillybj __Automated Formers can build condensers, boreholes, etc. (does that etc. mean farms, mines, solars?)

My guess is that means soil enrichers.

	01-10-2003 10:49									#17
	Re: Re: Re: Automated Formers Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by jtsisyoda My guess is that means soil enrichers.

...and echelon mirrors. Did you know that those things when used in a certain way can nearly quadruple the energy gotten from themselves and solar collectors? It's incredible!

	01-10-2003 19:11									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I always just plant a couple of squares of forest around the base and build tree farms and hybrid forests...

	02-10-2003 13:46									#19
	Inflate your Upload Space

I used to do automatic formers, but it isn't the same civ feeling.

I like to decide on my own what to do, especially since borehole sites etc. are so sensitively to be planned

	02-10-2003 17:30									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

If you want to win at SMAC you really MUST manage your formers yourself. The reason the AI does so badly is becasue it has a poor terraforming plan.

-Jam

	03-10-2003 01:46									#21
	Increase Your PM Length

That and the AI isn't smart enough to double-up formers for big terraforming jobs. But truth be told, I really wouldn't want to see Yang or Miriam build boreholes.... I build at least one for every base I have and seeing the AI build *one* borehole would scare the hell out of me.

Also, the AI sucks donkey because it isn't half as aggressive with its units as the player with the acception of Conventional Missles (GRR), but that's getting off-topic.

	03-10-2003 09:52									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I've seen every one of the SMAC-7 make boreholes. I think the only thing I've never seen any of them do is raise or lower land. It may have happened often and I've just never noticed it.

	03-10-2003 10:43									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

They raise land. Matter of fact, the AI raises land without Environmental Economics or the Weather Paradigm....That is, perhaps, the AI cheat I hate the most!

	04-10-2003 04:37									#24
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Jamski If you want to win at SMAC you really MUST manage your formers yourself. The reason the AI does so badly is becasue it has a poor terraforming plan. -Jam

That's just one of the reasons that it performs badly.

I think that the inability to mount effective military campaigns, particularly airpower campaigns, is far more crippling for the AI.

Don't forget the AI's inability to conduct diplomacy productively.


Mead

	04-10-2003 15:24									#25
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I've never exploited land raising, how is it? Does it help with energy problems a lot?

	04-10-2003 20:50									#26
	Inflate your Upload Space

Ecthy our favourite Ossi,

I usually start land raising to shorten shore line, to place boreholes, or for an energy park (SP, in MP you may not have the time to do the latter). It depends quite a lot on your planning.
I think it was Ned who mentioned that to place a borehole, you shouldn't raise the land around your preferred borehole site but to lower the borehole site. Obvious, but it takes years to figure out
Then, building an energy park, you should always extend a plateau of maximum height. In extreme cases, you can raise more than 50 squares by 1000 m at turn and energy costs of one ...
Your favourite Wessi

	04-10-2003 21:27									#27
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Don't forget the AI's inability to conduct diplomacy productively.

Amen to that. I've been playing several Thinker difficulty games and keep finding myself vendetta'd by every faction in the game almost without trying.

I'd also add to the complaint list about AI how untrustworthy it is on higher difficulties. I've had cases where the AI offers a truce then a round or two later launches a surprise attack.

quote: I've never exploited land raising, how is it? Does it help with energy problems a lot?

I rarely bother raising land unless my main island is extremely small or I have a bunch of little islands I want to connect via land. I personally prefer Sea Formers & Sea Pods for the energy/nutrient bonus while planting Boreholes and Forests on the land territory for the extra minerals.

	04-10-2003 21:59									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Ecthelion I've never exploited land raising, how is it? Does it help with energy problems a lot?

Yes.


Raise your engery park elevation to over 3000. This will result in max output from the solar and mirrors. A large, well elevated, well located, well protected, and equipped energy park is a beautiful thing.



Mead

	04-10-2003 23:29									#29
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Energy park? is that like a super science city just a city with super enery?

	05-10-2003 01:55									#30
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

No, its an area outside of a city where you use resource convoys to harvest the energy. (At least I do it this way) That way, you can have one city with income increasing improvements harvest 100s of energy/turn over your whole empire. Then I plant forests in my cities to give the balanced food/energy/mineral ratio. It also helps to cut down on fungus growth by having them outside city radii.