17-09-2003 06:48									#31
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Dan, do you really think the US military would maintain large bases when they are not somehow useful? How would you quickly react to a crisis anywhere? Ok, you can send the Navy, but some countries canīt be reached in that way, and even if they can, this needs days, if not weeks.

You have a point that the concentration on (Central) European bases isnīt that important after the cold war, maybe youīll some move more forward over time, but the existing bases are military infrastructure - to abandon them certainly doesnīt help the US influence overseas.

Edit: didnīt saw your last two posts....

	17-09-2003 06:51									#32
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quote: Originally posted by DanS Where?

Reread the entire artile you linked. Pay special attention to the second paragraph and the final paragraph where he claims that the policies which many of our allies have had during the recent Iraq war make then nonallies (specifically he says only Britain, Japan, Australia, and eastern Europe are allies) he also calls for bases in neutral countries to be closed.

quote: In fact, there is no real joint defense; there is no common enemy; and soon there should be no shared depot.

He makes the above claim based solely upon the recent Iraq situation.

quote: With China and Russia claiming neutrality; with Britain, Australia, Japan, and much of Eastern Europe allied; and with India increasingly receptive to American peace-feelers

He does the same here.

So what conclusion am I supposed to reach other then he wants bases closed in countries which didn't support the recent war in Iraq? It seems pretty clear to me he wants to make a every mole hill into a either your with us or against us type moment. The truth is when lose bases like the ones we had in the Phillipines they are almost impossible to replace and so we should not start closing them just because some journalist thinks the locals haven't sucked up to Bush's policies enough.

	17-09-2003 06:54									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse We're continent sized so watch out! We'll squash you!

You also have less then 20 million people so you are no where near populous enough to act like a big power.

	17-09-2003 06:55									#34
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quote: Dan, do you really think the US military would maintain large bases when they are not somehow useful? How would you quickly react to a crisis anywhere? Ok, you can send the Navy, but some countries canīt be reached in that way, and even if they can, this needs days, if not weeks.

Sure, the large European bases are useful. I never said they weren't. But this has to be weighed against the costs, broadly construed. There's always more than one way to skin these cats.

quote: You have a point that the concentration on (Central) European bases isnīt that important after the cold war, maybe youīll some move more forward over time, but the existing bases are military infrastructure - to abandon them certainly doesnīt help the US influence overseas.

Why would it impact on US influence in some place like Germany? We don't get our money's worth, if it does.

	17-09-2003 06:56									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Sava US Allies? NATO and the rest of the Democratic World. Following along with some dipshit politician's little war is NOT the definition of an Ally. I think Britain, France, and Germany are our strongest allies. In a TRUE emergency... when there IS a real IMMENENT threat (not manipulations and distortions) they would be with us. Unfortunately, war-profiteering and ideologically blind politicians have alienated our allies with their lies.

war profiteering????

you mean the french who didn't want saddam to fall because he owed them so much money? same with russia? which was at the heart of their oppostion.

you mean the french? who, if we would allow them a cut of the re-build profits, would drop all opposition against the war and suddenly sing a different tune?

the biggest guilty party of forming foreign policy based on potential profits are the french, russians and possibly the germans.

Those fools wouldn't know a true emergency if it bit them in the ass.

The country that is funding this war to a deficit (the US), somehow is the one getting rich off of it??...while the french and germans won't budge a muscle unless we cut them in for a portion of the re-building contracts and profits...

yet, the US is the money grabbing bad guy...where's rod serling when you need him...he'd love this ****.

	17-09-2003 06:58									#36
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I'm sure if Russia or China or someone was threatening to nuke us, France or Germany would not stand idle.

	17-09-2003 06:59									#37
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quote: Originally posted by vee4473 war profiteering???? you mean the french who didn't want saddam to fall because he owed them so much money? same with russia? which was at the heart of their oppostion. you mean the french? who, if we would allow them a cut of the re-build profits, would drop all opposition against the war and suddenly sing a different tune? the biggest guilty party of forming foreign policy based on potential profits are the french, russians and possibly the germans. Those fools wouldn't know a true emergency if it bit them in the ass. The country that is funding this war to a deficit (the US), somehow is the one getting rich off of it??...while the french and germans won't budge a muscle unless we cut them in for a portion of the re-building contracts and profits... yet, the US is the money grabbing bad guy...where's rod serling when you need him...he'd love this ****.

sure the French probably had business interests... but they are dwarfed compared to the fat blank check Cheney's Halliburton is getting.

	17-09-2003 07:00									#38
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Tass: noone had a problem towards the US after 9/11. Itīs all about the Iraq hysteria ...

	17-09-2003 07:00									#39
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keep snoring.

you obviously are very much asleep.

sweet dreams

	17-09-2003 07:02									#40
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quote: Originally posted by vee4473 keep snoring. you obviously are very much asleep. sweet dreams

know who runs your government and where they get their money from... educate yourself...

	17-09-2003 07:04									#41
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quote: Originally posted by vee4473 Those fools wouldn't know a true emergency if it bit them in the ass.

I supported and even advicated the invasion of Iraq but it was never a "true emergency". It was and remains an optional war which had nothing to do with the war on terror. Except for Saddam paying pensions to the people in Hamas (BTW who oppose OBL but who are still nasty people) no one has ever found any links to terrorism; quite the opposite as a secular nationist dictators of the Baathists in both Syria and Iraq were/are hated by the fundimentalists.

The best case for the Iraq war wasn't that Iraq was a part of the war on terror or that it was a "true emergency" but that Saddam was a thorn in our side and that we should make an example out of him in order to send a message to the Irans, Syrias, and North Koreas of the world. Iraq made sense in a Machiavellian sense.

	17-09-2003 07:05									#42
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Oerdin is the most reasonable, intelligent, and logical pro-war poster.

	17-09-2003 07:06									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Sava know who runs your government and where they get their money from... educate yourself...

Sava is a good guy but he listens to much of Pacifica radio and he gives to much attention to the conspiracy theories which the far left loony fringe comes up with.

	17-09-2003 07:07									#44
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perhaps

	17-09-2003 07:20									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin You also have less then 20 million people so you are no where near populous enough to act like a big power

True, but if we could work out a way to fling a big chunk of the continent at other people we could very dangerous.

	17-09-2003 07:22									#47
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You can have bases in Europe then

	17-09-2003 07:22									#48
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The good thing about the German bases is that it reminds them that we kicked their asses and are occupying them.

	17-09-2003 07:24									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar I'm sure if Russia or China or someone was threatening to nuke us, France or Germany would not stand idle.

You are probably right...

France goes with Russia...Germany with China.

	17-09-2003 07:29									#51
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand USMC? Oh thats the definitive in flight, no question. Stupidass squids.

Gameleague p2ssy. Eyes o Night Beeyatch.

	17-09-2003 07:34									#52
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quote: Originally posted by vee4473 you mean the french who didn't want saddam to fall because he owed them so much money? same with russia? which was at the heart of their oppostion.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Russia was at the heart of the Russian opposition. Seems logical enough.

quote: you mean the french? who, if we would allow them a cut of the re-build profits, would drop all opposition against the war and suddenly sing a different tune?

Imagine if Bush told Haliburton where to go and how to get there...... THEY'D be singing a different tune.

quote: the biggest guilty party of forming foreign policy based on potential profits are the french, russians and possibly the germans.

Yeah. Bombing a country and killing 6000 of its civilians is much smaller "foreign policy based on potential profits"ness than opposing the war

quote: Those fools wouldn't know a true emergency if it bit them in the ass.

President Bush said that at any moment...New York city....could.....turn....into a.....mushroom cloud....

True emergency my ***

quote: The country that is funding this war to a deficit (the US), somehow is the one getting rich off of it??...

Oh no, the US isn't getting rich. Haliburton is. You really should do more homework.

quote: while the french and germans won't budge a muscle unless we cut them in for a portion of the re-building contracts and profits...

And we won't budge unless we get ALL the profits.

quote: yet, the US is the money grabbing bad guy...

Well yes, you kind of proved your own point. If FRANCE of GERMANY will only help if they get PROFITS, and we do not give them PROFITS, despite our need for their help....

Then the US becomes the money grabbing bad guy.

Really, you have one of the most poorly constructed arguements ever.

Slowwy could make a better argument than you

	17-09-2003 07:36									#53
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Old Eurocom Axis of Evil

Attachment: axisofevil.jpg
This has been downloaded 95 time(s).

	17-09-2003 07:38									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker Old Eurocom Axis of Evil

edit: that's Rummy shaking hands with Saddam... probably confirming delivery on chemical and biological weapon components shipments...

	17-09-2003 07:38									#55
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Axis

Eurocom

	17-09-2003 07:54									#56
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Is Texas an ally of the United States?

	17-09-2003 07:55									#57
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The better question is: Is the United States an ally of Texas?

	17-09-2003 07:56									#58
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they are part of the craxis of evil

	17-09-2003 07:56									#59
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Naw. They're just the ugly step child we keep in the basement.

	17-09-2003 07:56									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Sava edit: that's Rummy shaking hands with Saddam... probably confirming delivery on chemical and biological weapon components shipments...

That's great, what do you want, a first place ribbon?

Here's everyone carrying on with Uncle Joe!