23-09-2003 22:54									#31
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conspiracy theories rise up as soon as it turns out (or seems to turn out) that the official explanation of a political event is either implausible or contradictionary. the conspiracy theorist considers the official version as just another conspiracy theory among others, including his own one. his theory may be wrong (sometimes it is even offbeat) but there´s oftenly the valid point that the whole case needs to be investigated.
as long a politician or official behaves like he has to hide something or to cover someone and openly hinders investigations he deserves no better than being the victim of a conspiracy theory.

	23-09-2003 23:19									#32
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To be fair, single bullet theories
How one bullet could have been used:
http://www.jfk-assassination.net/wound3.txt
How the exit wound could have been smaller:
http://www.jfk-assassination.net/wound2.txt

I've been trying to find information that would pass the scrutiny of the Apolyton Fact Checkers but I need some better info. I'll be back.

	24-09-2003 00:09									#33
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Siro, just a little bit about America. When I grew up, we commonly referred to presidents by their initionals. For example, we always said FDR instead of Roosevelt, LBJ instead of Johnson, and JFK instead of Jack (not John) Kennedy. Eisenhower was IKE. It seems that we had a fascination for three-letter abreviations for our presidents - probably because at that time news was dominated by print media and they needed abreviations.

As TV began to dominate, we no longer abreviated our presidents names. I don't recall anyone referring to Nixon as RMN. I actually have no idea what the middle initial is for Ford, Carter, or Clinton. We are aware of the middle initials to Bushes to distinquish them.

And, Che, Warren commission appears to have been more of an effort to justify the lone gunman theory than to deal with the evidence. Congress later concluded that there was a conspiracy, but why the FBI never looked into it is a mystery to me. I find it remarkable that the executive branch continued seemed to continue to ignore the evidence of a conspiracy.

Here is a link to a story about the book. It is to come out on Sept. 30.

http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/ar...ation20-ON.html

Here is another link that is very interesting on the single-bullet theory. Apparently a critical photo on the path of the bullet was "missing." The data also suggests that Kennedy was "operated" on to suggest that the bullets came from the rear.

http://www.jfklancer.com/Clark.LBJ.html

	24-09-2003 00:13									#34
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Better than what I could find. abovetopsecret.com is down and I didn't want to wade through the Black Vault for specific links.

	24-09-2003 00:22									#35
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I find two theories plausible (but not probable).

One, the Mafia whacked Kennedy because of his betrayal. After they helped get out the vote for him, his brother went after them. So they killed him to take the heat off.

Two, Cuban exiles had it done for Kennedy's betray of not sending in air cover during the Bay of Pigs.

There is little more than a quote supprting the first, and no evidence so far as I am aware supporing the 2nd.

No other theory holds water. Until I see concrete evidence, and not just speculation, I'm going with he official story.

	24-09-2003 00:30									#36
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William Jefferson Clinton

Gerald R? Ford?

what are the middle names of the Bushes? GWB is George Walker, right? What about his father? And how does Herbert play in?

	24-09-2003 00:39									#37
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Some initialized names are harder to say than others.

Last edited by chegitz guevara on 24-09-2003 at 00:55

	24-09-2003 00:43									#38
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yeah, what is Bush senior's second name and does GWB have any more?

	24-09-2003 00:50									#39
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I believe both are George Herbert Walker Bush.

	24-09-2003 00:54									#40
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Like the 2 Rasmussens the Danes could once choose between?

	24-09-2003 00:57									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Harry Seldon I believe both are George Herbert Walker Bush.

No, just the first one. The second is GWB, hence, Dubya.

	24-09-2003 00:58									#42
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Harry Spencer Truman

	24-09-2003 00:59									#43
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what's the D in Dwight D Eisenhower for?

what are the second names of Ford, Nixon, Reagan, Teddy Roosevelt, Coolidge, Hoover?

then there was Thomas Woodrow Wilson!!

Ulysses S. Grant. S-what? Stonewall? That was Jackson!!!!!

	24-09-2003 01:04									#44
	Re: LBJ had Kennedy killed... Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Ned ...according to a new book by a law partner of a man whose last name is Clark. (I am writing this from memory of part of a report I just heard on a FOX News show "Your World.") According to the interviewee, I don't know his name, LBJ hired Clark to do Kennedy. The interviewee said he represented his law partner, Clark, in an effort to get LBJ to pay Clark a bonus for a job well done. If anyone has anything more on this, I think we all would like to have a link. BTW, immediately after Kennedy was shot, my Dad several times said that LBJ did it. Apparently LBJ's reputation as a killer was well know even at that time. The interviewee said that Clark also helped LBJ kill another politician in 1961 and that LBJ did his first murder in 1951. This should be interesting reading.

The idea is absurd, It was then, and it is now.
Johnson absolutely loathed his time in office.
To make the accusation that he was behind assassination so he could do something he hated, makes zero sense.

	24-09-2003 01:04									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Ecthelion Harry Spencer Truman

???

Truman always said his initial stood for S.

	24-09-2003 01:05									#46
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you what?

	24-09-2003 01:08									#47
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The S stands for nothing. If memory serves, he had to come up with a middle initial for his permenant record in grammer school.

	24-09-2003 01:27									#48
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I think Mr. Rogers had Kennedy killed.

	24-09-2003 01:29									#49
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More plausible than Johnson.

	24-09-2003 01:55									#50
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand The idea is absurd, It was then, and it is now. Johnson absolutely loathed his time in office. To make the accusation that he was behind assassination so he could do something he hated, makes zero sense.

I am sure you are aware that LBJ ran for president in '60 and lost to JFK?

As to LBJ hating his time in office - well he certainly screwed up, didn't he?

	24-09-2003 02:02									#51
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He ran against Kennedy? Well horror of horrors.
So did Nixon. Maybe it was him.
Screwed up, by not letting the military run the war?
Maybe. Maybe it was bad advice from his advisors, which is still ultimately his resposibility, I know.

Are you now switching your gripe/accusation?

	24-09-2003 02:03									#52
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I thought JFK beat Nixon. in 1960

	24-09-2003 02:05									#53
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JFK beat both of them. LBJ for the nomination and Nixon for the Presidency.

	24-09-2003 02:13									#54
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quote: Originally posted by rah I thought JFK beat Nixon. in 1960

LBJ and JFK faced off in the Democrat primaries and convention. It was close all the way. When the dust settled, JFK named LBJ as his VP then assigned him no responsibility when they won the narrowest election in history (votewise). LBJ delivered Texas in that election by stuffing the ballot boxes. His control over the Democrat party in Texas was legendary.

LBJ definitely wanted to be president. He was defeated by JFK and then assigned no substantive role in the Kennedy administration. I think there was bad blood between the Kennedy's and LBJ.

Regardless, based solely on the history of LBJ, his rivalry with JFK and the fact of the murder in Dallas, Texas, my Dad drew the conclusion that LBJ did it. Well it now looks like my Dad may have been right.

	24-09-2003 02:17									#56
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How do you figure; and RAH, your dumbass wink doesn't help.

	24-09-2003 02:21									#57
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Crossposted, I was winking at Che feeling the need to point out JFK beating LBJ for the dem nomination that year. I actually witnessed it, these guy read it from a history book.

	24-09-2003 02:29									#58
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Oh. Sorry. Am I red.

	24-09-2003 02:49									#59
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how can someone run for president, lose and become vice president?

	24-09-2003 02:52									#60
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Why is that so hard in a country when you can run for President, lose, and still become President?