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Apolyton Civilization Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.0.3 Apolyton Civilization Forums > Civilization III > Civ3-Democracy Game > Intersite DG: Apolyton Team > Proposed Ammendment on Consular Elections
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Arnelos is offline Arnelos
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Sep 2002
time: 00:31
  Old Post 25-09-2003 16:42
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Proposed Ammendment on Consular Elections Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Proposed Ammendment to the Constitution for Consular Elections

Article A, "The Consuls", should be reworded to the following (added sections in bold):

quote:

A. The Consuls
  1. Three Citizens shall be elected as Consuls.
    a. Initial elections will occur upon ratification of this Constitution.
    b. There will be an opportunity to nominate the Consuls, and then an election, where the 3 people with the most manual ballots are chosen as Consuls.
    c. Each month, one of the three Consul positions shall come up for election.
    d. Consul positions which have never undergone scheduled elections shall undergo scheduled elections once per month in order of the tenure of the position's occupant until all Consul positions have undergone scheduled elections.
    e. Once all Consul positions have undergone scheduled elections, the Consul position up for election each month shall be the one which has gone 3 months since its last scheduled election.
    f. Any citizen who is not holding another Consul position may become a candidate.
    g. Candidates for scheduled Consular elections must announce their candidacy by the first day of the month.
    h. Scheduled Consular elections will be held for 48 hours starting on the 4th of the month.
    i. If a single candidate obtains a majority of votes in the first vote, he will be the new Consul.
    j. If no candidate achieves a majority of the votes, then a second vote will immediatley be held for 48 hours between the two leading candidates of the first vote. If a tie on the first vote prevents only two candidates from being chosen for the second vote, then any ties will be broken by a vote of the the other Consuls and the three ministers until there are only two leading candidates available for the second vote.
    k. If there is a tie vote and only two candidates have received votes, the current holder of the Consul office up for election will break the tie.
    l. If a Change of Command (CoC) is successfully exercised against a sitting Consul, the citizen who becomes Consul will fill that Consul position until the next scheduled election for the position rather than receiving his own 3-month term from the date of the CoC.

  2. The Consuls have the authority to play the game.
  3. The Consuls have the authority to make final game decisions, but must act within the boundaries of the law.
  4. The Consuls should follow legal minister orders unless forced by unforseen circumstances.
  5. One Consul shall be appointed President.
  6. The Consuls have the power to rule on senatorial disputes in a manner they see fit.
  7. Consuls may only be removed from office by a vote of No-Confidence.
  8. The Consuls appoint Ministers.
  9. A Consul may appoint a replacement Consul for himself for up to a two week period of time so that vacations and other such short term absences won't interupt the game. Before the absence the Consul shall start a thread naming a replacement and the replacement shall accept before it is considered official. Upon returning from the absence, the Consul needs only to post that he has returned and state that he is relieving the replacement of his duties in order to reclaim the Consulship. The replacement Consul has all powers and responsibilities of a regular Consul except that he may not call a CoC on himself nor may any other team member call a CoC on the replacement.



EXPLANATION:

- One Consul is up each month. This was voted upon in a poll posted by MrWIA about 2 weeks ago.
- There are three Consuls, so that gives them 3-month terms once each office has undergone a scheduled election. Also decided by the poll posted by MrWIA about 2 weeks ago.
- CoC's do not impact the length of hte term for a *position*, so if you CoC a sitting Consul a week before they're up for election, you only get to be Consul for one month before the position is up for election, when you stand for election again (to earn the right to serve for the next 3 months). This is my suggestion so that we can rely upon one Consul being up for election each month on a regular rotating schedule. If you challenge a Consul with only 1 month left in his term, tough.
- Elections will be 2-round elections requiring a majority (50%+1) to a single candidate for said candidate to become Consul. If people would rather have a plurality system, speak up, but when we held the Consular elections at the start of the game, we decided to use a system (I advised Togas on its use) that ensured that candidates had to have the support of a majority of voters.
- Ties between only 2 candidates (the winner becomes Consul) are broken by the Consul whose position is up for election. This effectively gives a sitting Consul an extra 1/2 vote to win if a challenger ties him or gives him the right to name his successor if two candidates tie in an attempt to replace him.
- Ties of more than 2 candidates (in the first round) are broken by the full cabinet (minus the Consul whose position is up for election). While letting a sitting Consul win a 2-way tie seems fair, letting a Consul pick his opponent in the second round between candidates that tie with each other in the first round doesn't seem as fair. So I suggest that we let the rest of the Cabinet pick who makes it to the second round in the event of this rarity.

Comment is welcome. If people are happy with it, we'll go ahead and vote on it. If discussion takes time, we can always just change the dates of the 1st of the month and the 4th of the month in the ammendment so that we can hold an election quickly after the ammendment's passage.

Last edited by Arnelos on 26-09-2003 at 06:47

Arnelos is offline Arnelos
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Sep 2002
time: 00:31
  Old Post 25-09-2003 16:44
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I went ahead and did this because, simply put, it needs to be done already. We've been talking about holding Consular elections for months, but it hasn't happened yet.

roadcage is offline roadcage
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Minneapolis Kansas
Nov 2001
time: 23:31
  Old Post 25-09-2003 17:13
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Got spare money?

Ready to vote. So where's the poll?

Arnelos is offline Arnelos
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Sep 2002
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  Old Post 25-09-2003 18:29
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Just want to make sure that the specific provisions I've outlined don't get an outcry from half the people here. If not, we can vote on it already.

Lord Nuclear is offline Lord Nuclear
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Jun 2002
time: 21:31
  Old Post 25-09-2003 20:25
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It looks fine to me Good job Arnelos

BigFree is offline BigFree

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Oct 1999
time: 21:31
  Old Post 26-09-2003 01:42
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I have a problem with this part:

k. If there is a tie vote and only two candidates have received votes, the current holder of the Consul office will break the tie.


The "current holder(s)" Consul is actually two consuls; so how do they break a tie? Or are you saying the incumbent wins the tie, if it is an incumbent?

E_T is offline E_T
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Mar 2001
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  Old Post 26-09-2003 05:55
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About GD time

E_T

E_T is offline E_T
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Orlando, Florida
Mar 2001
time: 00:31
  Old Post 26-09-2003 05:57
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quote:
Originally posted by BigFree
I have a problem with this part:

k. If there is a tie vote and only two candidates have received votes, the current holder of the Consul office will break the tie.


The "current holder(s)" Consul is actually two consuls; so how do they break a tie? Or are you saying the incumbent wins the tie, if it is an incumbent?


Hmmm, maybe we should also have the Ministers help with this one., except if one of them is the canidate....

RPS???

E_T

MrWhereItsAt is offline MrWhereItsAt
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Nov 2001
time: 17:31
  Old Post 26-09-2003 06:22
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I chanced upon Arn in the chatroom when he was writing this, so I know exactly what he intends.

quote:

k. If there is a tie vote and only two candidates have received votes, the current holder of the Consul office will break the tie.

The "current holder(s)" Consul is actually two consuls; so how do they break a tie? Or are you saying the incumbent wins the tie, if it is an incumbent?


He means the Consul whose position is up for reelection gets an extra 1/2 vote in the case of a 2-way tie, whether that Consul is running or not. In the case the incumbent is involved in the tie, they are effectively given the right to retain or gift the Consul seat to their opponent.

I am content with this amendment, but I can see some areas where slight changes could be made (tie-breaking situations) if people felt strongly enough about them. Remember however that we want a system that is feasible, and attainable within a timespan of only a few days max.

As an alternative option, in the case of ANY tie, we could have the other two Consuls and 3 Ministers vote on the next step. In the case of the 2-way tie where there are only two running candidates, this quorum would decide upon who wins the seat. In the case that more than 2 candidates are tied, the quorum would decide on who to exclude from the follow-up, 2-person poll.

This is just a thought that occurred to me - I am not suggesting we need it, but just giving an idea for consideration.

Arnelos is offline Arnelos
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Sep 2002
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  Old Post 26-09-2003 06:53
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Ok, I've altered the ammendment to make it more clear that the Consul breaking a tie in a 2-way tie is the Consul whose position is up for grabs.

Arnelos is offline Arnelos
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  Old Post 26-09-2003 06:53
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quote:
Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt
As an alternative option, in the case of ANY tie, we could have the other two Consuls and 3 Ministers vote on the next step. In the case of the 2-way tie where there are only two running candidates, this quorum would decide upon who wins the seat. In the case that more than 2 candidates are tied, the quorum would decide on who to exclude from the follow-up, 2-person poll.

This is just a thought that occurred to me - I am not suggesting we need it, but just giving an idea for consideration.


I'm not clear on what you mean by this. Please elaborate.

Lord Nuclear is offline Lord Nuclear
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Jun 2002
time: 21:31
  Old Post 26-09-2003 07:19
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Arnelos can you make this an official poll in a new thread?

MrWhereItsAt is offline MrWhereItsAt
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Nov 2001
time: 17:31
  Old Post 26-09-2003 07:34
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Arn - what I mean by my post is this:

in the case of a tie (either two way between the only two candidates), or three+ way, we need someone to decide what happens next. In the case of the 2-way tie, we need to decide on a winner, in the case of a multi-way tie we need someone to decide which two go on to the final polling round.

My idea is that the group of the two Consuls who are not up for re-election and the three Ministers decide in both cases. In your first post you have this group deciding on the latter case only.

Do I need to find a better way of explaining this for anyone? Sorry - it IS a Friday here, so I may be less than rigourous with things today

Arnelos is offline Arnelos
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  Old Post 26-09-2003 08:21
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quote:
Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt
Arn - what I mean by my post is this:

in the case of a tie (either two way between the only two candidates), or three+ way, we need someone to decide what happens next. In the case of the 2-way tie, we need to decide on a winner, in the case of a multi-way tie we need someone to decide which two go on to the final polling round.

My idea is that the group of the two Consuls who are not up for re-election and the three Ministers decide in both cases. In your first post you have this group deciding on the latter case only.

Do I need to find a better way of explaining this for anyone? Sorry - it IS a Friday here, so I may be less than rigourous with things today


No, that explains it.

I had considered this, as you know when we talked in chat. I'm open to either, quite frankly.

Do you think it's worth polling on that or just going with what we have (since people seem to not really care much one way or the other)?

Lord Nuclear is offline Lord Nuclear
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  Old Post 26-09-2003 09:51
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What ever as long as it becomes official.

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