30-09-2003 23:49									#1
	Kyoto Dies Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Putin has decided not to sign Kyoto, signaling the permanent death of Kyoto because Russia was needed for the treaty to go into effect. Russian scientists have concluded that the proponents of the global warming "theory" have not proven the link between greenhouse gases and warmer termperatures. Besides, and this is probably more important, to sign the agreement would mean Putin could not achieve his economic goals of doubling Russian GDP in 10 years.

Is anyone surprised?

http://apnews.excite.com/article/20.../D7TSRQTO1.html

	30-09-2003 23:53									#2
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He didn't say he wasn't going to sign. He said they haven't made a decision yet on ratification.

	30-09-2003 23:55									#3
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Greed will be the death of us all, bastards!

	30-09-2003 23:57									#4
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Che, seriously, Kyoto wouldn't save us, anyway. Better yet harness the energy now. ( but use the economy to develop other stuff, while you can! )

	30-09-2003 23:57									#5
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How about "greed will be the death of all of us bastards."

	01-10-2003 00:00									#6
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Yeah, Che, you got it right.

	01-10-2003 00:14									#7
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Putin is stupid. Russia is well BELOW Kyoto emmision levels, and he could make a good profit selling the left over poluting-room to other countries.

	01-10-2003 00:18									#8
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I think he prefers selling the OIL.

	01-10-2003 00:37									#9
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Kyoto was lame any way...

	01-10-2003 00:44									#10
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I'm surprised that no one has blamed it on Bush yet.

	01-10-2003 00:47									#11
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quote: Originally posted by rah I'm surprised that no one has blamed it on Bush yet.

It's all Bush's fault . . .


happy now?

	01-10-2003 00:50									#12
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course it's Bush's fault. Putin is only doing this to make up for Russia's oposal to the Iraqi war. cause Putin knows very well that Russia polutes less than the Kyoto-limit.

	01-10-2003 00:52									#13
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Now I feel more at home. I was getting worried.

	01-10-2003 01:07									#14
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I don't think it was just Bush's fault, I blame Texas! Slowwhand in 5...4...3... jk.

Seriously, Kyote wasn't enough to save us, we're doomed unless we can take some seriously painful measures, which are politically inaffordable in a democracy, particularly one like the USA. As a result, the human race is boned.

quote: I'm surprised that no one has blamed it on Bush yet.

No prizes for guessing who you voted for then

	01-10-2003 01:11									#15
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quote: Originally posted by elijah Seriously, Kyote wasn't enough to save us, we're doomed unless we can take some seriously painful measures, which are politically inaffordable in a democracy, particularly one like the USA. As a result, the human race is boned.

Only if you believe in junk science.

	01-10-2003 01:11									#16
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Kyoto may have been insufficient, but it was a step in the right direction. You have to start somewhere. And continuing the way we do, is not the way to go.

	01-10-2003 01:11									#17
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Perhaps Putin sees that in order to develop his country economically, Kyoto isn't in the best interest.

I still don't believe that he's right in not signing.

	01-10-2003 01:14									#18
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quote: Only if you believe in junk science.

Nope, just good science. Ok, maybe not the human species (though I do expect numbers to suffer), but certainly the West as we know it.

	01-10-2003 01:16									#19
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Its not in our economic interest to have sea levels rise by stupid amounts, temperatures to go through the roof, parts of Europe returned to the ice age (melting artic interrupting gulf stream), and the possibility of our civilisation dying out.

	01-10-2003 01:16									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Only if you believe in junk science.

It's those opposed to Kyoto that believe in junk science. When 98% of scientists in the field say, global warming is real, it's happening, and it's humanity's fault, and the other 2% are employed by power companies, it's a relatively safe bet that the 98% are the ones who are correct.

	01-10-2003 01:19									#21
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara It's those opposed to Kyoto that believe in junk science. When 98% of scientists in the field say, global warming is real, it's happening, and it's humanity's fault, and the other 2% are employed by power companies, it's a relatively safe bet that the 98% are the ones who are correct.

Junk stats.

	01-10-2003 01:20									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Junk stats.

Junk reply.

	01-10-2003 01:20									#23
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My Air Pollution professor says that he isn't sure. But he was always very certain to point out that the vast majority of scientists do see global warning as a very real threat.

	01-10-2003 01:21									#24
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Indeed, far less scientists disregard the link between greenhouse gases and massive global warming.

	01-10-2003 01:24									#25
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Junk reply.

Somehow, I find it hard to believe that the only scientists who don't believe global warming is our fault all work for power companies. I also find your claim that 98% of scientists see things your way a bit of a stretch, to say the least.

Better?

	01-10-2003 01:26									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel My Air Pollution professor says that he isn't sure. But he was always very certain to point out that the vast majority of scientists do see global warning as a very real threat.

But do the vast majority say it's caused by humans? I seriously doubt it.

	01-10-2003 01:27									#27
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Yep.

look, the readings are very clear. The amounts of CO2 have grown dramatically, in the last century.

	01-10-2003 01:28									#28
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quote: Somehow, I find it hard to believe that the only scientists who don't believe global warming is our fault all work for power companies. I also find your claim that 98% of scientists see things your way a bit of a stretch, to say the least.

Believe it. The man happens to be right.

	01-10-2003 01:30									#29
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quote: But do the vast majority say it's caused by humans? I seriously doubt it.

quote: look, the readings are very clear. The amounts of CO2 have grown dramatically, in the last century.

As has the rise in global temperatures. This century has seen rises consistent with a time period of a few millenia! A further 2 degrees C would be disastrous, this century we could well be looking at 5.

	01-10-2003 01:35									#30
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quote: Originally posted by elijah Believe it. The man happens to be right.

Sorry, but I don't think I'll take his word for it. I'm sure he is sincere and believes what he is telling me, but I'd like to hear some comments from the other side first.