04-10-2003 06:33									#1
	What's the deal with GoW's "offering" peace to RP? Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I've noticed in the Allies thread that GoW (Aggie and GF) have said somethings to the effect that they will give peace to RP. Is there anything to that? Is that in exchange for attacking us? EXchange for attacking ND? Is this also peace between them (ND) and RP? Anybody heard anything from the RP'ers about this?

There might be an opening here for some interesting moves.

	04-10-2003 07:17									#2
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I think they're just ****ing around.

But that's just me.

I ingore GF on general principle.

-Arrian

	04-10-2003 07:25									#3
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This is Aggie as well. Aggie is not usually a bullshit artist.

	05-10-2003 18:39									#4
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Maybe they realize they're not going to get anywhere, and will get zero return from their millitary. As millitary is all they have that would effectively put them out of the game.

If they were to see past they're grudge against RP they could get alot more benefit from attacking lego land than from continuing the RP offensive.

This kinda reminds me of the GS3 pbem, should China attack the real threat and just see their armys cancel each other out or should they make an offensive against the badly defended weaker nation.

The only way they can get a return for their army is to attack the badly defended Legos, rather than continue in a war that will likely result in a stalemate.

	05-10-2003 22:26									#5
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You dont' think we could get maintain the appearance of this war while all three (excepting RP) attacks lego?

	06-10-2003 14:53									#6
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Heh heh. Yeah, settle our differences then all go and jump Lego. Then GS must surely win

	06-10-2003 22:20									#7
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RP peace offering: only some ruse IMHO... GoW is trying to get some discussion going amongst us. They have been provoking us the whole thread long, and got quite a bit of info out of it. They must think their propaganda is working again

DeepO

	07-10-2003 01:39									#8
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The problem with trying to get ND & GoW interested in a hit on Lego is ensuring Lego doesn't hear about it.

There is almost no chance of that, IMO. In order to negotiate a joint operation, there must be trust between teams. I think we all agree that we could trust ND. I don't think many here would trust GoW. I don't think many in GoW would trust us. Therefore, I see an impasse.

-Arrian

	07-10-2003 04:04									#9
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If RP have not heard anything from GoW thru their diplomatic channels, then maybe it is just a ruse. Also, if it were serious, wouldn't ND have an opinion about it?

	07-10-2003 04:55									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Cort Haus If RP have not heard anything from GoW thru their diplomatic channels, then maybe it is just a ruse. Also, if it were serious, wouldn't ND have an opinion about it?

Right, there can't really be a bilateral peace treaty unless they allied to defeat ND. (Or us)

	07-10-2003 15:03									#11
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I've PM'd our two RP contacts asking them if they've heard from GoW via official channels about this. Sorry if I jumped the gun, Octavian.

	08-10-2003 01:27									#12
	GoW's 'peace' offer to RP Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

From Togas of RP - Details of the 'offer' from GoW :

(also posted in the RP Diplo log - this is the discussable version)

quote: This was sent to us last month. We didn't even consider it and told Aggie that we would never consider peace with GoW until Spain was free. quote: Aggie wrote on 25-09-2003 14:40: We are hereby offering a10 turn cease fire effective immediately. During this cease fire NO troops can enter the other’s territory and all invaders must withdraw. Additionally no galley movement is to take place. Aggie

Speaks for itself, I think. End of Story.

	08-10-2003 02:03									#13
	Re: GoW's 'peace' offer to RP Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Cort Haus From Togas of RP - Details of the 'offer' from GoW : (also posted in the RP Diplo log - this is the discussable version)

Speaks for itself, I think. End of Story. [/QUOTE]

What a joke.

Sure we'll give you a ten turn cease fire so that you can move the next rider wave into position

haha

	08-10-2003 03:08									#14
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What it does suggest is that GoW is not quite as strong as it would like to be right now.

Bit of a feeble effort at buying time though.

	20-10-2003 04:29									#15
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A couple of thoughts occur to me:

* I concur, GoW is not as strong as they would like to be right now. This is a result of their crap production, even in a GA.

* What does that mean though, really? To me, it means that they do not have the capability to present sufficient Riders for both their southern campaign and their homeland defense.

* The latest delay was for an ROP problem, clearly on GoW's behalf. If we assume that they HAD been trying to balance offensive / defensive needs... doesn't it make sense that the needed ROP was for passage south?

* This is further confirmed by the Lego report that they and ND are amassing troops north of Spain.

So?

1) The friggin' north is vulnerable, and it will take two turns for the Riders to return on defense.

2) Even with all their Riders in the south, they are clearly at their 'minimum' required strength (else why take the risk in the north?).

I think this means that Operation Yellowknife should be a go.

Further:

I think that this can be the 'stick' in our negotiations with GoW. Let's say we initiate discussions re a mercenary backstab of ND, with all appropriate caveats that nothing is done till it's done. In the midst of this, we show up at Yellowknife. Assuming we can reach a deal, easy enough for us to re-embark, and head south to attack ND across their eastern hills / mountains.

* Theseus thinks: Does MZ really have 'Evil Plan' trademarked?

	20-10-2003 14:41									#16
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I'm really into turning up at Yellowknife. If we don't do something soon they'll have Muskets.

	21-10-2003 02:54									#17
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Would anybody have a problem if I PMed Un0??

I want to:

1) Apologize for Aeson going off, even though he is not in GS anymore.

2) Explore, uh, possible 'relationship enhancements'.

	21-10-2003 04:37									#18
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Theseus1: So, whaddya think, contact Un0?

Theseus2: Weeelllll, shouldn't you wait for the rest of team to chime in?

Theseus1: Huh?

Theseus2: You know, the rest of Gathering Storm!

Theseus1: Hmmm... interesting idea.

Theseus2: Uh, the consensus thing, remember?

Theseus1: You think they're around? Checking out the private forum?

Theseus2: Yeah, you know they are... I bet even alexman and Nathan read this.

Theseus1: NO WAY!! (?)

Theseus2: WAY!! (!)

Theseus1: Alright, we can wait a bit I guess.

__________________________

Fair Warning:

If I need to, the second that it is posted in the public PTWDG forum that the save has been sent to us, I will be posting "GATHERING THE STORM" threads in the General and Strategy forums.

(which actually could be kinda fun and devious )

	21-10-2003 08:23									#19
	Put an end to popups!

OK, just did one of my few ever chats (thanks sleepy and nye!)...

I want to send a PM to Un0, as follows:

"Un0:

Sorry, man, I don't know what got into Aeson in the public forum...

At the same time, please remember it ain't a GS thing... he is not GS, although most of us Strat guys (me included) automatically side with him. Bad hair day, or something.

I'm not sure how you are feeling about the PTWDG these days... I am still into it, even given the many obstacles to it being FUN.

Anyway... I have a question for you: Are you guys really Mercs?

MERCS??!!

If you are, name a price... A price for ceasing attacks on RP, and cooperating with us in dismantling ND. We may or may not be able to meet it... but we'd like to know.

I covenant here and now that we will not disclose this discussion, at this risk of forfeiture (i.e., if we, GS, disclose to the PTWDG world that this discussion has taken place, without your written approval, we will forfeit.).

Be aware, however, that we have discussed this communication with RP.

Further, in the reverse, disclosure of a confidential communication such as this will be taken most negatively.
_________________

Aaahhhhh, screw it: Don't tell anyone, but we want you to backstab ND... possible?

[Sidenote: Yes, it's true, a little known fact, but Theseus (nee Richard Podos) was born in Salt Lake City, so I'm SSN 499.]
__________________________

{I'm not a great diplo... speak my mind as I see things}

	21-10-2003 11:33									#20
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Please do not apologise for anything, Theseus. I like UnO and all, but I think his skin is a bit too thin, and one way. Where the hell has he been when *******s like HE have been running their mouths? And how the hell could any sane human step forward and proclaim that their negotiating position with us was all his idea, and be offended that we thought it was the product of a moron?

I'm sorry, but the whole 'hurt UnO' shtick simply has a funny feeling to it.

Do I like what Aeson did? No. Do I understand why he might wanted to inflict some misery? You freakin' bet! Besides, I think he said enough to UnO on that topic, himself.

As for the rest of your message, good. I hope a new introduction is possible, though.

	21-10-2003 16:08									#21
	Put an end to popups!

Yeah UnO can be a bit funny alot of the time. He personalizes stuff way too much.

Whether it's "taking full responsibility" for something or getting upset about something or letting everyone know how mean someone else has been.

Trying to get GoW to switch sides is still good avenue to follow, I don't know what happened in the chat, but I recall lego were hoping GoW would attack ND?

	21-10-2003 18:23									#22
	Put an end to popups!

What the hell did Aeson do? I saw some good shots against Ghengis, and I couldn't approve more.

Aeson

-Arrian

	22-10-2003 00:38									#23
	Remove this text

OK, forget about the Aeson stuff...

And forget about Un0 too.

Should I (or someone) try to contact MZ?

	22-10-2003 01:26									#24
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Sure, it's worth a shot at least.

-Arrian

	22-10-2003 07:03									#25
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What is the deal with Aeson anyway?

Does he just really not like MZ and Farb?

I wish he hadn't left us. Clearly he's getting some enjoyment out of playing with GoW.

	22-10-2003 07:26									#26
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

DRAFT

MZ,

I have a question for you: Are you guys really Mercs?

MERCS??!!

If you are, name a price... A price for ceasing attacks on RP, and cooperating with us in dismantling ND. We may or may not be able to meet it... but we'd like to know.

I covenant here and now that we will not disclose this discussion, at this risk of forfeiture (i.e., if we, GS, disclose to the PTWDG world that this discussion has taken place, without your written approval, we will forfeit.).

Be aware, however, that we have discussed this communication with RP.

Further, in the reverse, disclosure of a confidential communication such as this will be taken most negatively.
_________________

Aaahhhhh, screw it: Don't tell anyone, but we want you to backstab ND...

Possible?

Theseus (bringer of maaaany goodies)



How's that?

	22-10-2003 07:48									#27
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Send it.

	22-10-2003 08:12									#28
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why the hell not

	22-10-2003 08:15									#29
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On its way...

	22-10-2003 08:22									#30
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I know this should go in the GoW diplo log, but I can't find it (and doesn't that say something?!):

MZ,

I have a question for you: Are you guys really Mercs?

MERCS??!!

If you are, name a price... A price for ceasing attacks on RP, and cooperating with us in dismantling ND. We may or may not be able to meet it... but we'd like to know.

I covenant here and now that we will not disclose this discussion, at this risk of forfeiture (i.e., if we, GS, disclose to the PTWDG world that this discussion has taken place, without your written approval, we will forfeit.).

Be aware, however, that we have discussed this communication with RP.

Further, in the reverse, disclosure of a confidential communication such as this will be taken most negatively.
_________________

Aaahhhhh, screw it, here's the plain language: Don't tell anyone, but we want you to backstab ND...

Possible?

Theseus (bringer of maaaany goodies)

ps: I don't know if this has ever come up in GoW, but you guys might want to check out one Sir John Hawkwood... he would be your patron saint (courtesy of Gordon Dickson and the Dorsai series in science fiction, which is also an ultimate mercenary anthem).