14-10-2003 08:57									#1
	Wage Disparities between men and women do not exist Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

well that's not entirely true. They do exist to a certain extent. But as it turns out according to a wall street journal study is that women do not negotiate their salaries with their employer when they are hired. Women seemed to be turned off by haggling and negotiating their wages. Perhaps this explains why women do not like negotiating for the price of buying a new car- hence why Saturn dealerships are popular by offering a standard non-negotiable price for their vehicles.

So why is it women are afraid to negotiate their wages? Obviously this applies to professional jobs. As many non skill or low skill jobs offer income based on the hour, and those are non-negotiable and equal for women and men. So it is not true women make less money than men in those fields.

	14-10-2003 09:46									#2
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Cool -- they lump the individual-based behavior on whether or not a person negotiates onto a whole gendered group.

	14-10-2003 10:15									#3
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just going by the statistics here.

People say you shouldn't stereotype. But you can't ignore the statistics.

	14-10-2003 10:26									#4
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Well that is surely one factor, but I would hardly call it the only factor. Women tend to have lower wages in jobs with "fixed" wages, too.

	14-10-2003 10:38									#5
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Cool -- they lump the individual-based behavior on whether or not a person negotiates onto a whole gendered group.

if uget past the inanity of crying PC at everything. statistics can be effective(if not volatile) way to gain useful information.

	14-10-2003 10:40									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Hurricane Well that is surely one factor, but I would hardly call it the only factor. Women tend to have lower wages in jobs with "fixed" wages, too.

how can they have lower wage jobs if the wages are fixed?

It's just impossible. I have not seen it where I live. The women I work with make the same as me. Actually most of them make more than me. But I kind of got screwed when my company got bought out by another. They didn't raise my wages to what the other employess were making. They just figured if I didn't like it I could quit.

	14-10-2003 12:30									#7
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in physics women actually get paid better than women (on average)

it is just that there are a lot fewer women (and I mean a lot)

Jon Miller

	14-10-2003 13:13									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller in physics women actually get paid better than women (on average)

i don't know about your physics, but your math is seriously @#$'d up.

	14-10-2003 13:23									#9
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are you sure?

Jon Miller

	14-10-2003 13:25									#10
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I beleive there was an article in physics today or some other suc place

JOn Miller

	14-10-2003 13:27									#11
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Yes. How can women get paid more than women?

	14-10-2003 13:35									#12
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I meant, obviously, women get paid more than men

(not so obviously, I think it was median, not average)

Jon Miller

	14-10-2003 15:40									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident how can they have lower wage jobs if the wages are fixed?

You didn't notice the quotation marks I had put around fixed?

What I meant was that women often get a lower-paid job title, but exactly the same duties, as a higher-paid male (say for example that the man is a "purchaser", but the woman is "assistant purchaser", even though they do the same job in practise).

	14-10-2003 16:30									#14
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quote: Originally posted by MikeH Yes. How can women get paid more than women?

Well, there are women....and ....women

	14-10-2003 16:41									#15
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that's funny. all the women i know like to haggle when they're buying stuff.

	14-10-2003 16:49									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Hurricane What I meant was that women often get a lower-paid job title, but exactly the same duties, as a higher-paid male (say for example that the man is a "purchaser", but the woman is "assistant purchaser", even though they do the same job in practise).

Not in the UK they don't. We now have an entire legal industry built on equal pay legislation, job evaluation and comparison schemes, employment tribunals and, if that all fails, human rights legislation.

As far as employment goes we seem to be only a very short step from making it illegal to even notice what gender an applicant is at interview.

All great fun and work for the lawyers. Unless you happened to be a woman employed in the (former) UK coal mining industry in which case the NUM forgot to lodge your claim and it is now out of time.

	14-10-2003 16:58									#17
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The title is very confusing. That women on average should be less likely to negotiate their salary is a possible explanaition for the existance of wage disparities. That's a hint to quite the opposite to the titles statement.