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cavebear
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of the Pleistocene
Oct 1999
time: 00:31
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Tale of the Years 1806 to 1824
1806 – Adjusted Workers and city production per City-Planner (with some changes for SMC), moved units to implement SMC plans, adjusted Taxrate to 50-50-0 per poll. Fanatic kills German Dragoon at Cannae. Capture Swazi without injury (Dragoon kills a Pike, Knight occupies, 14G. Zulu gov overthrown. Attack Turin with Dragoon, kills single Musk. Find Zimbabwe. Kill Zulu Cannon at Bipedi. Find Hlobane.
1808 – Barbs near Cretaceous. Barb Knight kills an exploring Knight. Zulus become Monarchy and are immediately overthrown (guess their people didn’t like that idea).  German Salsburg builds Adam’s. Bribe Ulandi for 1037G, get 34G, sell Granary 60G, and start Temple. Zulus become Monarchy again. Destroy Turin, get 2G, but Dragoon gets healed. Kill Barb Elephant near Apolonia, get Vet. Kill Greek Cannon at Argos. Bribe Barb Knight at Outpost 82G. 
1810 – Lose a Dip to a German Dragoon near Ulandi.  Greeks get Conscription from Zulus, Americans get Conscription from Germans. Lose a Cannon to a German Dragoon. 2nd Cannon kills that Dragoon.  Many units moving according to SMC plans… I won’t mention that each turn, but there is a lot of moving going on.
1812 – Bribe Ngome 705G, get 23G. Kill 2 Barbs at Baltimore, there are Barbs all over the place. Preparing to bribe Stuttgart when found, I rush a Dip in Cannae. 
1814 – Americans get Explosives from Germans, Greeks get University from Zulus. Barb Musk dies attacking Philadelphia. Find Kansas City east of Bombay.
1816 – Russians discover Medicine. German Dragoon kills Fanatic seeking Stuttgart. Find Issus north of Cannae. Rush Dragoon in Cannae to accompany Dip, I’ve had it with 1-move escorts.
1818 – Greek gov overthrown. Barb Elephant attacks Havok, dies, Rifle gets Vet. Germans and Zulu sign pact against us. Zulus get Steam from Germans. Trade Caravan arrived in St Louis from Nuremberg. Greeks get Steam from Germans. Bribe Greek Dragoon 197G at Cannae to kill a German Dragoon. Destroy Kansas City get 3G but Fanatic healed and fortified at spot (German Dragoon appeared). Bribe Greek Cannon and use it to kill troublesome German Dragoon near Ulandi. Lose a Fanatic at Ulandi to American Cannon but kill Cannon. Kill 2 German Cannons threatening Madras.
1820 – Greeks become Republic. Bribe Mpondo 460G, get 28G. Cannon near Ulandi kills German Cannon (everyone is helping the Zulus). Rifle kill Zulu Legion near Zimbabwe, gets Vet. Cannon kills Zulu Dragoon at Bipedi, gets Vet. We kill a Zulu Phalanx near Zimbabwe. Find Islandhlwana. Move Dip to escape German Cannon (would have cost 1125G to bribe,  and had to bribe Zulu Musk for 297G to survive. Move units into place to attack Atlanta after using Dip to investigate city (no Cannon, but has Rifle and 3 Musks). Bribe wandering Barb Knight 82G (dip now has a 2-move escort). Kill American Dragoon with Fanatic healed at Kansas City. Find Rhodes and bribe it 450G, get 25G, sell Gran for 60G. Greek gov overthrown.
1822 – Lose a Cannon near Ulandi. Greeks become Monarchy. Rus get Steam from Greeks, Greeks get Medicine from Rus. We discover Tactics!  Musk become Rifle, Phalanx, Pike, and Legions become Musk, Knights become Dragoon, Elephants become Crusaders, Settlers become Engineers.  We are offerred to research Amphibious Warfare or Industrialization. I chose Industrialization. Attack Atlanta. We have 9 Rifle, 4 Cannon, 3 Cavalry, a Fanatic, and a Dip. We capture the city at a cost of 4 Cannon and 3 Cavalry, get 42G and sell Granary 60G.  Find Stuttgart! Bribe it for 3437G,  get 315G, Magnetism, and Mike’s! All Dragoons become Cavalry, Crusader becomes Dragoon, Musks become Rifle. Sell Granary for 60G. Getting Mike’s gains us an additional 300 gold per turn. Move taxrate to 80-10-10. This nets us almost 1200G per turn. 
1824 – For opening AI and city-production moves only. Zulu are overthrown.
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Sparrowhawk
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Canada CST
Apr 1999
time: 23:31
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Looks like a good sequence of turns . I am not clear how many cities the American still have left  , but if we took Atlanta and destroyed Kansas City  , I think they are down to 5? Three of which we have located? 
As for the Zulus, it looks like you also successfully depleted their cities, and with their level of gold, I suggest we continue bribing all but Zimbabwae, as we need to get a sizable army (of Cannons or Calvary and Dips there in order to take their capital with walls and many improvements). By the time we get that force there, I expect the Zulus will only have their capital left (and Islandwanda with the railroad connection looks like a good place to attack from).
As for the choice of Industrialization over Amphibious Warfare  , I must say I am dissappointed, not over your choice, but rather that I did not have the opportunity to choose . It may well be that we will not get another opportunity to choose a tech, and that it won't matter if we would have gotten any more tech choices, but I still would have liked to have seen a science poll giving the options to the citizens.  
You mentioned we were able to steal Magnetism from the Germans when we bribed Stutgart, but didn't mention (anywhere that I can see :hmm: ) that the Germans got Magnetism. Was that this sequence of turns or last? And did they or anyone else get any more techs?
The last question I have (for now  ) is about the decision to change the tax rate to 80-10-10. Which Minister (if any) gave that suggestion ? I thought we were going to try to get our cities celebrating (and maybe now that we have taken Mike's we can more easily) but don't we need a higher luxury rate then 10%? And if we don't truly want any techs now that we have tactics , why didn't we reduce science to 0? (10% in fundamentalism has to be near 0 anyhow  ) I would have thought that initially (after tactics) we would have a Tax rate of 50-0-50, to get our cities celebrating and then lower luxuries (and increase tax) to a level when they will maintain the celebration.
All in all looks like a good sequence of turns  , we are still dishonourable , even with the Eiffel Tower  which in a military campaign can't be a bad thing
* Sparrowhawk 
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Six Thousand Year Old Man
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Ad Rock
Aug 2000
time: 00:31
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Na na na na, na na na na, hey hey hey, goodbye...
The AIs are done for. Well done everyone.
Now that we have Mikes, celebration becomes more feasible - not because we get less unrest due to Mike, but because we get more income, and we can set the luxury rate higher and still have more income than we did, pre-Mike.
However, I'm still torn about whether celebrating Fundy is worthwhile. The main benefit, IMO, is more base trade which helps make Freight delivery more profitable, and that won't apply in this game.
Be careful not to lose Stuttgart to German bribes... they can bribe it cheaply, and ought to try, at least.
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cavebear
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of the Pleistocene
Oct 1999
time: 00:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Sparrowhawk
Looks like a good sequence of turns. I am not clear how many cities the American still have left, but if we took Atlanta and destroyed Kansas City, I think they are down to 5? Three of which we have located? |
The Americans have 5 cities left.
quote:
As for the choice of Industrialization over Amphibious Warfare, I must say I am dissappointed, not over your choice, but rather that I did not have the opportunity to choose. It may well be that we will not get another opportunity to choose a tech, and that it won't matter if we would have gotten any more tech choices, but I still would have liked to have seen a science poll giving the options to the citizens. |
I was hoping for some guidance on the next tech as well. However in the discussions this time and last, some techs were mentioned, and I could not recall Amphibious Warfare being one of them. As I looked at Industrialization, I chose it for two reasons. First, it leads to Communism and we could *really* use Spies to protect our own cities from Diplomats, and to target City Walls of cities we attack. Second, the Zulus are researching it, and if they happen to get it, we could steal it and be freed to make a different tech choice.
I think there was the perception that we would not be getting a tech this session *or* that we didn't really need any others so it didn't matter.
quote:
You mentioned we were able to steal Magnetism from the Germans when we bribed Stutgart, but didn't mention (anywhere that I can see) that the Germans got Magnetism. Was that this sequence of turns or last? And did they or anyone else get any more techs? |
The Germans got Magnetism in the previous session, in 1794, it appears. I don't think they researched it themselves. All the techs that were announced as discovered or traded during the session are in my report. Perhaps the Foreign Minister would like to summarize the techs of the various civs...?
quote:
The last question I have (for now) is about the decision to change the tax rate to 80-10-10. Which Minister (if any) gave that suggestion? I thought we were going to try to get our cities celebrating (and maybe now that we have taken Mike's we can more easily) but don't we need a higher luxury rate then 10%? And if we don't truly want any techs now that we have tactics, why didn't we reduce science to 0? (10% in fundamentalism has to be near 0 anyhow) I would have thought that initially (after tactics) we would have a Tax rate of 50-0-50, to get our cities celebrating and then lower luxuries (and increase tax) to a level when they will maintain the celebration. |
No one recommended the 80-10-10 taxrate. I merely put it to that on the *last* turn to maximize our gold supply for use in planning the next session. Bribing Stuttgart really took most of our gold (left us below 1000), and I didn't want people to panic. Plus, I wanted people to see what our pure income-producing potential is at the moment.
I have my doubts about the value of celebrating in Fundie while trying to build a more modern army (Cavalry). To get much benefit, we would have to build a lot of Aqueducts and/or Sewers, and many of our cities cannot support much population growth because of the unimproved terrain (because so many have *no* water around for irrigation).
I'll set the taxrate to whatever division the Citizens desire, but it will need a clearly identified poll to determine that. My own inclination is to live off 50-50-0 for tech and gold and the heck with celebrating, but I'll play whatever cards I'm dealt (through the polls).
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cavebear
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of the Pleistocene
Oct 1999
time: 00:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Now we just need Pharsalos and our set of wonders will be complete. |
Sun Tzu's is a very good Wonder most of the time. But I don't see the value of it for us. Sure, it makes new units and any unit that wins a fight Vets, but we have barracks, and most of our attacking units die breaking through the City Walls. The last survivor (1 per city) would become Vet (if not already one). That's only 1 Vet unit per 4-6 turns at best. If Sun's was in a fringe city, easier to protect from counter-bribe or attack, sure, I'd say get it. But Pharsalos is in the middle of the Greek civ and I don't think we could hold it for more than a few turns. If we, in the meantime, sold our Barracks for the gold because we had Sun's we would have neither when it was taken back.
quote:
As for the 80-10-10 why don't we try to celebrate? 40% luxuries with Mike's Chapel ought to get every city celebrating. |
The 80-10-10 taxrate was only a last turn change to rebuilt a gold supply; I don't expect to leave it like that (though it is an option). We should have a poll to discuss 80-10-10, 50-50-0, and 60-0-40. As taxrate does not seem to fall completely under any one Minister, I hereby request that the Foreign Minister establish such a poll based on his interest in the matter. Or the Science Minister may do it. Whoever wants to first, I guess. 
I really *do* want us on the best taxrate, of course, but the taxrate effects our strategies (grow cities, build units, bribe, research, etc)
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