25-10-2003 07:50									#1
	How could the ex-Confederates vote? Suffering from ads?

Either the confederates were traitors and should at the very least not have been allowed to vote or they were individuals who murdered Union soldiers. Either way, I'm not seeing any basis for the restoration of voting rights in the south following the war. maybe reconstruction would've worked if it weren't for ex-confederate suffrage.

	25-10-2003 08:26									#2
	Re: How could the ex-Confederates vote? Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer Either the confederates were traitors and should at the very least not have been allowed to vote or they were individuals who murdered Union soldiers. Either way, I'm not seeing any basis for the restoration of voting rights in the south following the war. maybe reconstruction would've worked if it weren't for ex-confederate suffrage.

Little late to argue about this, don't you think?

	25-10-2003 08:27									#3
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Try studying your American history. At the end of the Civil War the U. S. Congress set up the Reconstruction Administration, a set of laws establishing requirements which the ex-Confederate states had to meet in order to become completely rehabilitatedand also a group of agencies overseeing the rehabilitation of those states. During Reconstruction the rebel states had to set free their slaves, more or less guarentee the ex-slaves rights, and re-write their state constitutions in such a manner deemed sufficient to prevent the re-appearence of a secessionist movement. During Reconstruction Confederate veterans were indeed barred from voting. Once Congress was satisfied that a former Confederate state was fully rehabilitated it became fully restored to the Union and the Rebel vets regained their voting priviledges. Any serious student of history knows that the guarentee of rights to ex-slaves obviously recieved little more than lip service by the end of Reconstruction.

	25-10-2003 08:28									#4
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Who's to say reconstruction didn't work? What were its goals? (Yeah, yeah, yeah, in 5 minutes MtG will pull up the specific text of the law) But was it to simply restore the Union? Was it to enforce rights for freed slaves as well?

Assuming it was...Lincoln didn't want us to continue the regional infighting even after the war was over. A quick restoration of Southern rights would be a damn good way to pacify them, at least, if not show that even after that we've "forgiven" them.

	25-10-2003 08:31									#5
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Strangelove:

and therein was the problem. The federal gov't may have put requirements on Southern states in order for confederates to regain suffrage but these with too little and were ultimately useless as re-enfranchised southernors had a large enough voting bloc to combat reconstruction laws hence that back-room election where Hayes barely won... the ex-confeds bascially undid reconstruction.

	25-10-2003 08:32									#6
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They had to swear an oath of loyalty before being allowed to vote again.

	25-10-2003 08:37									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer as re-enfranchised southernors had a large enough voting bloc to combat reconstruction laws

Actually, they didn't. It required terrorism in most states to drive away enough freedmen and poor white farmers for the Confederates to retake the state governments.

The reason why the North turned its back on the South has to do with the Panic of 1973 and the rising tide of worker militancy in the North. The North cut a deal with the South in order to be able to focus on keeping down the workers' movement.

	25-10-2003 08:59									#8
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The Reconstruction failed to establish equal rights for all throughout the land. Bigotry and prejudice continued to plague the land for ages yet. Well Geeeee! It's not like the US was the exception to the rule among nations of the nineteenth century.

	25-10-2003 09:16									#9
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chegitz:

yet in 1869, Hiram Revels was senator and there were more black men in both the US Congress and state legislatures than there ever was again even today. the fact that there were no ex-confeds with the ability to vote allowed for considerable black representation, despite angry white racists. voter intimidation wouldn't have worked if the State gov'ts were dominated by Blacks and the confeds had no way of getting back into power.

	25-10-2003 09:32									#10
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The rise of the KKK raised the spectre of guerilla warfare in the reconstructing south. The US was more interested in getting back to business as usual. Within a few years after the wars end there really wasn't that much interest in the welfare of freed slaves. No one wanted to raise the money for an army big enough to thoroughly occupy the south. To the rescue comes not the US cavalry, but instead actually the Confederate cavlary, or more precisely the military leadership of the former confederacy, the only people the average white Southern had any real respect for. Men like Lee spoke out against the KKK and other groups disturbing the peace, and the former Confederate states resurrected their militias in order to quash the riff raff. Once peace was restored the US congress felt justified in giving full citizenship back to the veterans of the South. Really they were more interested in getting back to business as usual.

	25-10-2003 09:42									#11
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Generally, by going to their polling place on election day and marking a ballot like mos' ever'body else.

Was it really that hard of a question you couldn't figure it out?

	25-10-2003 09:53									#12
	Re: Re: How could the ex-Confederates vote? Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Verto Little late to argue about this, don't you think?

My thoughts exactly.

	25-10-2003 10:15									#13
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat Generally, by going to their polling place on election day and marking a ballot like mos' ever'body else. Was it really that hard of a question you couldn't figure it out?

Darn it! I was just coming back to make that point.

	25-10-2003 10:21									#14
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Dr. S., the Confeterate soldiers had all of their voting rights restored after the retook the oath of loyality but anyone who held high office in the Confederacy was perminently disallowed from holding Federal government office elected or other wise. They also perminently lost the right to vote.

	25-10-2003 10:50									#15
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The definition of "high office" was very limited, if you look at the number of former CSA generals and elected officers who held or were elected to Federal offices.

	25-10-2003 10:58									#16
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quote: maybe reconstruction would've worked if it weren't for ex-confederate suffrage.

Yeah, that would have worked

Reconstruction was tough enough to accomplish without adding more daggers...

	25-10-2003 15:48									#17
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Jeff Davis was effectively the only person "barred" from Federal office, not that it mattered. IIRC Alexander Stephens, CSA Vice-President, went back to the same seat in Congress that he had occupied before the unpleasantness.

	25-10-2003 18:53									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer voter intimidation wouldn't have worked if the State gov'ts were dominated by Blacks and the confeds had no way of getting back into power.

Are you daft? Okay, let's make it easy for you. If the voters who put the Reconstruction government are too scared to go vote, then what happens to the governments? They get replaced by the intimidators.

	25-10-2003 20:50									#19
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Chegitz:

2 things... all the intimidators would be disenfranchised and not be able to vote in their people... secondly, the success of intimidation was due to the gov't turning a blind eye to it or even supporting it. The initial black gov'ts of the South immediately after the war would have tried everything possible to stop intimidation but even if it continued to go on, it wouldn't have harmed the black gov't as very few whites would have been able to vote.

	25-10-2003 20:58									#20
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Albert: There was never a "black" post war government in any of the southern states. Not even in South Carolina where blacks made up a majority of the population. There were more blacks participating then ever before and the lives of the majority of blacks had never been better but at all times whites continued to make up the bulk of the governming class. Of course during reconstruction many of these white politicians came from the north and that pissed the southerners off to no end.

They called them carpet baggers & scally wags and one of the first goals of the post reconstruction state governments was to chase those guys out of office (and often out of the south).

	25-10-2003 21:45									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer Chegitz: 2 things... all the intimidators would be disenfranchised and not be able to vote in their people.

not all

	25-10-2003 21:47									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin They called them carpet baggers & scally wags

Scallawags (scallywags) were Southerners who cooperated with the Union occupation.