25-10-2003 08:40									#1
	Civ 3 Conquest -- Flat map? Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Hello

I am dying to know if the 9 scenarios in C3C are going to be on flat maps?

I used to play Roman maps in old Civ 3, and had seen Egypt attacking Spain by "going east around the world" ...... very annoying.

I trust C3C has taken care of this problem! Can anyone tell me?

Also, what are the 9 scenarios? I've never seen a complete list of it. I know about Mesopotamia, Rise of Rome, Middle Ages, Japan Shogun, South America, Age of expansion, Pearl Harbor. What are the other 2?

Regards,
Raymond

Raymond.Pun@mensa.org.sg

	25-10-2003 09:07									#2
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In the FAQ, it says:

quote: What are the Conquest scenarios? Unlike the Epic Game, each Conquest scenario focuses on a specific period of history, such as the Rise of Rome, the Middle Ages, or the Napoleonic War. Each Conquest has its own map, tech tree, specialized units, playable civilizations, and victory conditions. Several Conquests include predetermined starting city and unit placements so that you are placed immediately into the action.

So, you missed the Napoleonic Europe one.

	25-10-2003 11:27									#3
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You also missed 'Fall of Rome' which completes the list.


Edit: Also, as for the main question - seeing as the current build of the editor ( can't remember if it's due to PTW or a patch but as far as I remember, the former ) already supports flat maps I'd seriously doubt the good people at Firaxis would be daft enough to put round maps in their scenarios. The only exception to this would be 'The Age of Sail' which I'd imagine is a full world map.

	25-10-2003 14:46									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Faboba The only exception to this would be 'The Age of Sail' which I'd imagine is a full world map.

The 'age of Sail' plays on a map of the Atlantic. Even Europe doesn't figure in its entirety there.

	26-10-2003 00:21									#5
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PTW allowed flat maps, and C3C includes PTW, so they will all be on flat maps.

	26-10-2003 01:24									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor The 'age of Sail' plays on a map of the Atlantic. Even Europe doesn't figure in its entirety there.

So much for the colonies in India, the West Indies and China then....


Off the subject slightly - I'd be more interested to find out if they've corrected the irritating flaw in the maps at the moment. If you are playing on a map which fully stretches to the top and bottom of the grid you can't actually see - in the former case - the city names and - in the latter - the bottom one and a half squares. Hopefully someone at Firaxis has noticed it...

While we're at it a 'clear map of resources' feature would shave hours off my game set-up time.

	26-10-2003 01:26									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Faboba Off the subject slightly - I'd be more interested to find out if they've corrected the irritating flaw in the maps at the moment. If you are playing on a map which fully stretches to the top and bottom of the grid you can't actually see - in the former case - the city names and - in the latter - the bottom one and a half squares. Hopefully someone at Firaxis has noticed it...

Yeah, that is irritating.

	26-10-2003 02:31									#8
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See the developer update for the Age of Discovery Conquest.

They had too much trouble with the AI's wanting to colonize Africa & the far east instead of the New World when they tried the whole world, and so downsized the map so the European AIs basically had no choice but to colonize the new world.

quote: Originally posted by Faboba So much for the colonies in India, the West Indies and China then.... Off the subject slightly - I'd be more interested to find out if they've corrected the irritating flaw in the maps at the moment. If you are playing on a map which fully stretches to the top and bottom of the grid you can't actually see - in the former case - the city names and - in the latter - the bottom one and a half squares. Hopefully someone at Firaxis has noticed it... While we're at it a 'clear map of resources' feature would shave hours off my game set-up time.

	26-10-2003 03:04									#9
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quote: Originally posted by joncnunn See the developer update for the Age of Discovery Conquest. They had too much trouble with the AI's wanting to colonize Africa & the far east instead of the New World when they tried the whole world, and so downsized the map so the European AIs basically had no choice but to colonize the new world.

The way it _should_ have been then. No americans, and everyone´s happy! still, there would be native americans... what a silly thought

	26-10-2003 06:28									#10
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quote: They had too much trouble with the AI's wanting to colonize Africa & the far east instead of the New World when they tried the whole world, and so downsized the map so the European AIs basically had no choice but to colonize the new world.

That's a shame. Rather than fix the problem with their AI and have the scenario play as it was dreamed up they just downsized the scenario so it worked with the old AI from Civ3 and PTW. You would think they could have balanced it to provide for an interesting mix of African, Asian, and American colonization.

	26-10-2003 06:46									#11
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To teach the AI what to do in a scenario like that would have been an immense sinkhole of time and resources.

	26-10-2003 09:52									#12
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However, I've seen there is the African shore in the Age of Discovery. Don't the European powers colonize Africa?

	28-10-2003 02:58									#13
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Flat maps have been possible since PTW.

	28-10-2003 03:09									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor However, I've seen there is the African shore in the Age of Discovery. Don't the European powers colonize Africa?

My guess is that Africa won't have any colonizable land (The land literally isn't allowed to be settled)

Either that, or only the coast, because the interior of Africa wasn't settled by Europe. But any settling of Africa would probably take away from the point of the scenario.

	28-10-2003 03:25									#15
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quote: My guess is that Africa won't have any colonizable land (The land literally isn't allowed to be settled)

and they couldn't incorporate this idea in a world map?

	28-10-2003 05:37									#16
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Then why make the whole map if you only allow a very small subset to be colonized? All you would do it have the AI waste it's time exploring areas that you know aren't in it's best interest to go.

Either you make all the areas that the AI is likely to colonize be a good idea, don't let the AI go places you don't want it to, or improve the AI so it actually really understands the scenario (much harder than the other two).

	28-10-2003 10:36									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Saint Marcus and they couldn't incorporate this idea in a world map?

The problem is that Siberia is full of forests, and you can't simply forbid forests from being settled in a Colonization of America scenario.

I was a regular of Marla's map, and there was no turnaround to avoid the AI to settle massively in Siberia, unless I turned Siberia into a gigantic tundra devoid of trees and hills (and if I made Tundra impropoer to settle)