06-11-2003 17:25									#1
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I have seen notes that the Maya Javelineers (or whatever) plus maybe some other units, have a chance of enslaving a unit they attack, including Barbs.

What exactly does this do? I know it gives you a worker, but is it an inefficient yet free slave worker belonging of other nationality or is it a genuine worker from your own civ?

And how does the enslavement process work? Do you have to successfully attack to enslave? Can you get promoted in battles where you enslave the opposition? Is there any units that can't be enslaved?

	06-11-2003 17:36									#2
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Enslavement works this way:

- You attack with a unit that has "enslave" ability
- If you win, you have 1/3 chance to get a unit specified in the editor (for javelineers, it means you have 1/3 chance to get a worker)
- Workers are slaves whose nationality is from the defeated unit. You can even have Barbarian workers.

	06-11-2003 17:51									#3
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor You can even have Barbarian workers.

Kick ass! Do you know this for a fact?

	06-11-2003 17:59									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Faboba Kick ass! Do you know this for a fact?

Yes

	06-11-2003 18:02									#5
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Units that have enslaving capabilties can choose if fighting or try for enslaving or is it automatic ?

Gunter

	06-11-2003 18:02									#6
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Cheers Spiffor. Did you get this from the game itself or am I just being lazy and missed a few threads where this info was posted?

	06-11-2003 18:08									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Gunter Units that have enslaving capabilties can choose if fighting or try for enslaving or is it automatic ?

Automatic with every attack. If you win you kill the unit 2/3s of the time and enslave 1/3 of the time.

	06-11-2003 19:15									#8
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quote: Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt Cheers Spiffor. Did you get this from the game itself or am I just being lazy and missed a few threads where this info was posted?

Catt mentions enslaving barbs in his "Best UU" thread.

	06-11-2003 19:20									#9
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Is there a complete list of all the units with the Enslave ability?

Are they all UUs or are there some available to all civs?

	06-11-2003 19:44									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor You can even have Barbarian workers.

That is truely awesome. Anyone remember slavery in the CTP series?

	06-11-2003 19:47									#11
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HOLY ****!!! I figured the Mayan unit was so-so at best, given my hatred of despotic GAs. But the special enslavement ability extends to Barbs, and a 2/2/1 unit is one of the best Barb killers around. So it becomes worth your while to invest some shields in those Javelineers.

-Arrian

	06-11-2003 19:55									#12
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This may cause me to reevaluate the civs I may want to play in the Team DemoGame.......

	06-11-2003 20:02									#13
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Well, it *does* cost 30 shields. That's nothing to sneeze at in the early game, when slave barb workers are most useful.

-Arrian

	06-11-2003 21:49									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Arrian HOLY ****!!! I figured the Mayan unit was so-so at best, given my hatred of despotic GAs. But the special enslavement ability extends to Barbs, and a 2/2/1 unit is one of the best Barb killers around. So it becomes worth your while to invest some shields in those Javelineers.

They are excellent barb hunters. When the end-of-era barb uprising comes, it's "worker farming" time. 2 Javs encountered eight horseman -- result was 2 elite Javs and 4 barb workers In another instance, 1 Jav encountered 4 horsies -- result was promotion and 3 barb workers . . . before the 4th horsie killed the Jav and slaughtered its newly domesticated cousins.

An additional pair of observations on the enslavement: (1) you can enslave even when your unit is defending (i.e., being attacked); and (2) you can generate both a unit promotion and an enslaved worker from the same victorious combat.

I am seeing something curious with worker speed, however. My industrious natives complete roads on flat terrain in 2 turns; slave workers need 6 turns (rather than the expected 4 turns) -- this appears to be true even with non-barb slaves (i.e., traded-for workers from another civ).

Catt

	06-11-2003 21:52									#15
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So slaves now work at 1/2 speed of non-industrious workers, regardless of whether or not the slaveholding civ is industrious.

Road for normal worker: 3 turns
Road for industrious worker: 2 turns (50% bonus)
Road for slave: 6 turns

Makes a certain amount of sense. I'd always wondered why industrious civs got more out of their slaves...

But it is another hit on the industrious trait.

-Arrian

	06-11-2003 21:55									#16
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Catt,

Oooooh, can you try something for me? Add a barb worker to a city and see what the new citizen is called. Is it given Mayan nationality?

-Arrian

	06-11-2003 22:00									#17
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb Is there a complete list of all the units with the Enslave ability? Are they all UUs or are there some available to all civs?

In the Epic Game:

Man o War -> Man o War
Privateer -> Privateer
Javelin Thrower -> Worker

	06-11-2003 22:09									#18
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb This may cause me to reevaluate the civs I may want to play in the Team DemoGame.......

Sorry, we're only playing for fun, and the Mayans were nothing close to Feudal.




Dominae

	06-11-2003 22:10									#19
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Slaves look like slaves (i.e. have their own animation) now too.

	06-11-2003 22:11									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Arrian Catt, Oooooh, can you try something for me? Add a barb worker to a city and see what the new citizen is called. Is it given Mayan nationality? -Arrian

Very strange! (I wonder if this is an intended effect)

Adding the barb worker makes a citizen with a race identified as "A Barbarian Chiefdom." Now the strange thing: my city took a happiness hit and the cause is listed as "Stop the aggression against our mother country."

Catt

	06-11-2003 22:14									#21
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Makes sense, right? Barbs are people too!

	06-11-2003 22:18									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Dominae Makes sense, right? Barbs are people too!

Except they don't have a mother country! (i.e., not even a named tribe -- just a barbarian chiefdom).

I'm not complaining, BTW, I just didn't anticipate a happiness hit. How do you "stop the aggression" against barbs, anyway? Genocide?

Catt

	06-11-2003 22:27									#23
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I think this is an intended effect to discourage adding these slaves to your cities. Otherwise, this could easily turn into an exploit.

Motown

	06-11-2003 22:36									#24
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Wow. Thanks for that, Catt. That's pretty useful info.

Fascinating [/Spock]

-Arrian

	06-11-2003 22:38									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Catt Except they don't have a mother country! (i.e., not even a named tribe -- just a barbarian chiefdom).

Think of a bunch of backward nomads being forced to work in mines or shelve books in libraries, all the while your expansion is encroaching their homelands. The only way to make them happy again is to let them go free (and like that's going to happen!), or way until they've been fully assimilated.


Dominae

	06-11-2003 23:05									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Dominae Sorry, we're only playing for fun, and the Mayans were nothing close to Feudal.

Right! Back to the Dutch.

	07-11-2003 00:00									#27
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what happens when you join barbo workers to a city? do they effect war weariness? do they impact culture flips in any way?

	07-11-2003 00:11									#28
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Joining barb slaves into your city must be exactly the same as joining slaves of any other civ with which you are at war.

Assuming that's the case, there is no effect on war weariness, as this is not nationality-specific. It affects all your citizens equally.

There is no also effect on flips to other civs, and I'm sure your cities can't flip to the barbs, as barbs have no capital and no culture.

	07-11-2003 02:59									#29
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Sounds like what happened to the Roman Empire in RL....

	07-11-2003 04:24									#30
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barb farming for workers is great fun. especially as the aztecs in the discovery scenario, great for culture boosts. in that scenario, all 3 am civs, az, inca, maya can do this.