02-12-2003 08:33									#31
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT Of the things you don't know, you can break those into 2 categories: a. Things you are aware of that you don't know. b. Things that you don't know, and are unaware that you don't know them.

John, you are not making any sense. Did Sophie hit you over the head with the dummy stick once too often?

Things you are aware of are by definition things you know.

	02-12-2003 08:35									#32
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Wouldn't the word "aware" imply the vague acknowledging of something, whereas the word "know" would imply a precise knowledge?

	02-12-2003 08:38									#33
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quote: Wouldn't the word "aware" imply the vague acknowledging of something, whereas the word "know" would imply a precise knowledge?

Yes, to someone who can speak English.

	02-12-2003 08:39									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten Yes, to someone who can speak English.

I'm sure I made at least one language mistake in my previous post, so it doesn't count

	02-12-2003 08:40									#35
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I would like to point out that, yet again, an American has confused British and English.

Would a moderator please correct the thread title.

	02-12-2003 08:43									#37
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And in plain English Rummies comments translate as:

"There are things we know, there are things we need to know more about, and there are things we are completely unaware of"

Which, on retrospect, is a statement of the obvious.

	02-12-2003 08:45									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Wouldn't the word "aware" imply the vague acknowledging of something, whereas the word "know" would imply a precise knowledge?

Knowledge, precise or not, excludes something from the unknown.

Besides, "aware" does not seem to carry the connotation of vagueness.

	02-12-2003 08:52									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Big Crunch I would like to point out that, yet again, an American has confused British and English. Would a moderator please correct the thread title.

But the British do speak English... as do the Irish, the Singaporeans, a great swathe of the peoples of the Indian sub-continent, and the inhabitants of this great southern land. However, nobody 'owns' English. And anyone who loves the English language should be on the look-out for dud prose... As George Orwell wrote:

" Language becomes ugly and inaccurate because our thoughts are foolish but the slovenliness of our language makes it easier for us to have foolish thoughts."

Perhaps Rumsfeld is subconsciously expressing a love of the Rolling Stones?

'...know know know know know know know...

know, I can't get know....

ah know know know know know know, that's what I say.... ah hey hey hey...

	02-12-2003 09:16									#40
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quote: Originally posted by molly bloom But the British do speak English... as do the Irish, the Singaporeans, a great swathe of the peoples of the Indian sub-continent, and the inhabitants of this great southern land. However, nobody 'owns' English.

Maybe my humour was too dry.

	02-12-2003 09:23									#41
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That's another thing I hate; British people saying their humor is "dry", instead of using the American term "not funny". Who do you think you're kidding!

	02-12-2003 09:27									#42
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Doesn't "dry" mean "funny except for the ignorant rednecks in the colonies"?

	02-12-2003 09:45									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten That's another thing I hate; British people saying their humor is "dry", instead of using the American term "not funny". Who do you think you're kidding!

Its a shame Americans need to have their humour served up to them with a big sign pointing at it saying "This is funny". I've even been to a 'recorded live in front of a studio audience' TV comedy show in America - they had to have signs that light up to let the bulk of the audience know when to "laugh" and "applause".

	02-12-2003 09:54									#44
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It's so humid in the colonies the rednecks are ignorant of the meaning of the word dry as it applies to weather or humor. "Dry" to us ignorant rednecks means we have to drive to the next county over to get beer.

This is to us a known known. The use of dry relevant to humor would be an unknown unknown, about which we wouldn't give a **** if we thought about it.

Women are a fine example of a known unknown, at least in the view of redneck men. We don't know what the hell is wrong with them and we know we never will.

Rednecks themselves are quite a fine example of an unknown known. We can't figure out why we are ignorant rednecks in the first place.

	02-12-2003 10:06									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger John, you are not making any sense. Did Sophie hit you over the head with the dummy stick once too often? Things you are aware of are by definition things you know.

Gotta tell you it makes sense to me. Clear sense? No, but sense. To give you examples:

a. I am aware that Sophie is with her mother, however I am unaware exactly where Sophie is. I know what I don't know.

b. If Laura was impregnated 4 nights ago, that's something I don't know that I REALLY don't know. Especially since we hadn't done it for over a week.

Otoh, I agree with the poster that of the award categories, this is the weakest of all - some years they didn't even bother to give it out.

	02-12-2003 11:19									#46
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quote: Its a shame Americans need to have their humour served up to them with a big sign pointing at it saying "This is funny".

Says the man from the country that gave the world Benny Hill.

	02-12-2003 11:31									#47
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I gotta tell ya, that Rumsfeld quote is fairly clear to me. Sure, it's not the best thing I've ever read, but it still makes sense.

Besides, why manipulate the rules to get a Rumsfeld quote into the competition, when the greatest quote of all time is obviously:

"A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven."
-Jean Chretien, when asked what kind of proof Canada would need to join America's war in Iraq

I'm going to miss that man.

	02-12-2003 11:48									#48
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I didn't understand what he was saying. Looks like him saying "We know" over and over again

	02-12-2003 14:15									#49
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quote: "A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven." -Jean Chretien, when asked what kind of proof Canada would need to join America's war in Iraq

Agreed.

However, they would have to dedicate the award to Chretien if they allowed Canadians to participate. Now, just to give you Americans a better idea of just how bad he speaks, my grandmother longs for the eloquence of Bush over Chretien.

As for Rummy, he comes through crystal clear. To understand where you are ignorant is a great deal different from being totally unaware of your ignorance.

	02-12-2003 14:57									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Doesn't "dry" mean "funny except for the ignorant rednecks in the colonies"?

Yes.

	02-12-2003 14:59									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten quote: Its a shame Americans need to have their humour served up to them with a big sign pointing at it saying "This is funny". Says the man from the country that gave the world Benny Hill.

Says the man from the country that still watches him.

	02-12-2003 15:23									#52
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quote: Says the man from the country that still watches him.

I have never seen Benny Hill in my life, nor have I ever seen it being played on any channel on the television. Nice try, you pseudo-gay, monarchist bastard.

	02-12-2003 15:33									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten quote: Says the man from the country that still watches him. I have never seen Benny Hill in my life, nor have I ever seen it being played on any channel on the television. Nice try, you pseudo-gay, monarchist bastard.

1. How do you know what its about then.

2. What is pseudo Gay

3.I'm a republican( not in the G W sense)

4. My parents were married at my birth.

	02-12-2003 15:34									#54
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No-one really watches Benny Hill in America, I refuse to believe that.

	02-12-2003 15:37									#55
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quote: 1. How do you know what its about then.

I can read.

quote: 2. What is pseudo Gay

A synonym for English (there you go BC ).

quote: 3.I'm a republican( not in the G W sense)

You guys sure have accomplished a lot in the last couple centuries. It only took us a couple decades to throw off the monarchist yoke; what's your excuse?

quote: 4. My parents were married at my birth.

There is more than one meaning for the word "bastard", you know. Honestly, learn the damn language if you want to keep calling it your own.

	02-12-2003 15:39									#56
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We keep the monarchy to make money from gullible American tourists who like to come and look at their palaces.

	02-12-2003 15:40									#57
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Touche.

	02-12-2003 15:42									#58
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I remember a quote from Rudyard Kipling, saying something to the effect that the UK and the US are the only two countries divided by the same language

Actually, in light of the replies here sympathising with Rumsfeld's comments, a sardonic British observer might go ahead and say "oh, the irony is lost on the Americans again!" (and of course, the Brits spare no country in their sense of humour, Americans come under fire more often because of their common language)

Seriously, take a look at this quote again:

quote: "Reports that say something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know," Rumsfeld told a news briefing. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns -- the ones we don't know we don't know"

Isn't that a VERY cumbersome way of stating the obvious? It's not a matter of whether you can wrestle some sense out of it or understand it, but rather this is really an ingenious way of saying nothing of note while expending some quite mouthful

I'm not British or a native speaker of English for that matter but I can't help but think this whole award thing (which is intended as a joke in the first place) is well placed on Mr. Rumsfeld in this instance

	02-12-2003 15:44									#59
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quote: but rather this is really an ingenious way of saying nothing of note while expending some quite mouthful

Well, to be serious for a moment, that is Rumsfeld's specialty.

	02-12-2003 15:54									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten quote: 1. How do you know what its about then. I can read. quote: 2. What is pseudo Gay A synonym for English (there you go BC ). quote: 3.I'm a republican( not in the G W sense) You guys sure have accomplished a lot in the last couple centuries. It only took us a couple decades to throw off the monarchist yoke; what's your excuse? quote: 4. My parents were married at my birth. There is more than one meaning for the word "bastard", you know. Honestly, learn the damn language if you want to keep calling it your own.

If you did know about english you would realise that any insult in the word bastard is derived from the fact that it means you are illegiteamate.

I don't want to call the language my own, it isn't mine just in the same way it isn't yours.

Oh and you can't get the full horror of Benny hill by reading about it, watch an episode and you will realise the absolute dregs us Brits can produce and the absolute dregs you will watch.