10-12-2003 18:40									#1
	Kerry wants to ban NRA tv channel Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Kerry Seeks Block of NRA Channel

Tuesday, December 09, 2003

WASHINGTON — Democratic presidential hopeful John Kerry (search) doesn't want to tune in to a National Rifle Association (search) channel anytime soon.

The Massachusetts senator sent Federal Election Commission (search) Chairwoman Ellen Weintraub a letter Tuesday asking the commission to block any attempt by the NRA to get a media exemption to campaign finance rules.

The gun-rights lobby is considering acquiring a television or radio outlet and seeking the same exemption from campaign finance rules that news organizations have. If the group won a media exemption, it would be free to say whatever it wanted about candidates at any time and spend unlimited amounts doing so.

"We urge you to prevent the NRA from hijacking America's airwaves with the gun lobby's money," Kerry's letter said. "If the NRA has something to say, it can play by the rules, just like the millions of people in America who do every day."

The NRA, financed in part with corporate money, is banned by the campaign finance law from running ads identifying federal candidates close to elections in states where they are on the ballot. It contends the rules violate free-speech rights (search), and is among several groups asking the Supreme Court to strike them down.
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http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,105281,00.html

I know a lot of you probably hate the NRA, but don't they have the right to start a tv channel and say whatever they want. What about free speech?

This kind of attempt to regulate free speech just because you don't like it, is really disturbing!

Kerry

	10-12-2003 21:31									#2
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quote: This kind of attempt to regulate free speech just because you don't like it

everything that is banned, is banned because the majority of people dont like it

example: most people dont like murders

	10-12-2003 21:33									#3
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG example: most people dont like murders

Except in Greece.

	10-12-2003 21:34									#4
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG quote: This kind of attempt to regulate free speech just because you don't like it everything that is banned, is banned because the majority of people dont like it example: most people dont like murders

We are talking about free speech. As far as I know, murder is not free speech.

	10-12-2003 21:36									#5
	Remove this text

Dean already beat Kerry to making one of these claims, he won't catchup any time soon.

	10-12-2003 21:39									#6
	Suffering from ads?

this guy tells it better than i could ever imagine

quote: This just in: NRA channel brings us the news By Betty Cuniberti Published: Wednesday, Dec. 10 2003 I think everybody agrees that the biggest problem in America today is not enough television stations (with the possible exception of people who believe the problem is not enough guns). Because the station shortage is a threat to our general well being and safety, what took the National Rifle Association so long to look after us? Last weekend, the NRA said it was looking into buying a television or radio station and declaring itself a news organization - to circumvent the new limits on campaign spending and advertising. If the "I love guns" people become a news organization, they could get around the new ban on running ads just before elections that mention federal candidates on states' ballots. They could fund the "news organization" with corporate gun-maker money. Forget all that. They could run a fun father-son sitcom about John Allen Muhammad and Lee Boyd Malvo. "We're looking at bringing a court case that we're as legitimate a media outlet as Disney or Viacom or Time-Warner," the NRA's executive vice president, Wayne LaPierre, told The Associated Press. "Why should they have an exclusive right to relay information to the public, and why shouldn't the NRA be considered as legitimate a news source as they are?" Let's see. "Legitimate news source." "Gun lobby." You're right. I don't see any difference. Stay tuned for the totally unbiased nightly news show, "Wayne's World." Just imagine: "Crime wave brought on by gun control causes Australia to sink to the bottom of the ocean. Meanwhile, 5 million Americans saved their own lives today by waving handguns at would-be attackers in churches, day-care centers and other crime-ridden areas. Tomorrow: Five million more Americans successfully save their own lives with guns. Friday: Exclusive interview with 10 million would-be attackers, who tell us, 'I give up!'" A good many folks think mainstream news outlets are one, big, liberal lobby. Many of the people yearning for totally unbiased news coverage say they can find it only with Rush Limbaugh. Rush had better watch his back. Sundays, on NRA's "Meet the Second Amendment," prominent journalists from across the political spectrum will discuss why the word "militia" means every adult with a pulse and $100. They will do this over and over until it almost starts to make sense. We'll even tune in during deer-hunting season, when "Meet the Second Amendment" will suspend normal programming and air "Bambi," furthering the common confusion between the NRA and Disney. Campaign finance laws have been nothing if not flexible. Post-Watergate reforms led to the soft money nightmare that the McCain-Feingold law was designed to beat back. The big guys always find their way around campaign finance limits, but usually not this quickly. Or this creatively. The NRA, a news organization? What next? Cloned aliens from outer space sent by God? Because the second biggest problem in America is not enough guns on TV, an NRA channel would be the answer to many of our prayers. I, for one, am so tired of seeing people on TV stabbed, strangled, poisoned, suffocated with pillows and bashed on the noggin with a Ming vase. I'm a busy woman. I don't have all day to wait for people to die. Give me a quick Glock through-and-through and get on with the story. If the NRA is able to go ahead with its plan, we will have "news organizations" we never dreamed of. The Tobacco News Network. The Pharmaceutical News Network. Anheuser-Busch could be an interesting news organization. For all we know, there may be a severe Bud Light shortage in Iraq. The time for the AARP Golden Girls News Network has come. (Ahem.) With any luck, we'll never have complete public financing of campaigns; elections will continue to be bought and sold, and news will never again be reported by news people. I just worry about how all these news organizations are going to find time to lobby.

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/li...the
+news

	10-12-2003 21:41									#7
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Um, isn't this is about the NRA wanting an exemption on arguably dubious grounds, rather than Kerry trying to "ban" them?

	10-12-2003 21:42									#8
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Except in Greece.

there are not enough zeroes in the universe to rate this post

	10-12-2003 21:43									#9
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by MarkG this guy tells it better than i could ever imagine

You do realize that the main cause of that is the ludicrous rules regarding what groups can and can not say in an election, don't you?

	10-12-2003 21:45									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Jaakko Um, isn't this is about the NRA wanting an exemption on arguably dubious grounds, rather than Kerry trying to "ban" them?

he is just trying to save the nation from the "if you want to keep your gun, vote this man" ads

	10-12-2003 21:46									#11
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG there are not enough zeroes in the universe to rate this post

Agreed. But I never expected anything better from moneypenny (dino)

	10-12-2003 21:46									#12
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc You do realize that the main cause of that is the ludicrous rules regarding what groups can and can not say in an election, don't you?

any ban on those NRA lunatics is a good ban

	10-12-2003 21:47									#13
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I'm relieved to see that Apolytoners are still doing their old schticks, despite my lengthy absence.

	10-12-2003 21:48									#14
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG there are not enough zeroes in the universe to rate this post

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?postid=2542045#post2542045

	10-12-2003 21:49									#15
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG any ban on those NRA lunatics is a good ban

Nice to see that you care about free speech.

	10-12-2003 21:51									#16
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quote: Originally posted by MarkG he is just trying to save the nation from the "if you want to keep your gun, vote this man" ads

And what;s wrong with an ad like that? If there is free speech, then groups should be able to run whatever ads they want.

	10-12-2003 21:53									#17
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quote: Originally posted by The diplomat And what;s wrong with an ad like that? If there is free speech, then groups should be able to run whatever ads they want.

Eh. They can still do that, but without exemption as a "news organisation" (unless of course they get that exemption despite Kerry). Read the article.

	10-12-2003 21:54									#18
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Guns 'r bad mmmmkay?

	10-12-2003 22:00									#19
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...045#post2542045

This has been already answered. However the praising yells of some of your compatriots when bombs were falling to Bagdat still haven't.

	10-12-2003 22:25									#20
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Just because NRA has a TV channel doesn't mean anything. Most people who'd watch it be voting for them anyway.

	10-12-2003 22:27									#21
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quote: Originally posted by The diplomat And what;s wrong with an ad like that? If there is free speech, then groups should be able to run whatever ads they want.

Yeah, I agree. There's a lot of crap out there worse than an NRA station. Heck, if the Ku Klux Klan started a networks, that's their right, despite their abhorrent viewpoint. Free speech isn''t limited to happy, feely speech.

Edit: I love to hunt and fish, too. So, they'd probably have a lot of good hunting and fishing shows. Bring it on, I say

	10-12-2003 23:13									#22
	Re: Kerry wants to ban NRA tv channel Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by The diplomat I know a lot of you probably hate the NRA, but don't they have the right to start a tv channel and say whatever they want. What about free speech? This kind of attempt to regulate free speech just because you don't like it, is really disturbing! Kerry

I don't like the NRA's politics, although I have no problems with guns. Gun control is using both hands, and all that.

This isn't really a "free speech" issue though - the NRA has a huge number of other communications outlets, but it is a corporate/political lobby looking for a loophole around campaign and lobbying rules that restrict every other campaign contributor and lobbyist.

This is an issue of being able to manipulate elections with completely unaccountable media access, and no possibility of a level playing field for all parties. If the NRA has unrestricted access, it's own channels, and unlimited funds beyond FEC accounting, it will be the only organization in the US with that privilege, and there is no effective counter with equal time or equal access rules.

We already have enough problems with obscene campaign costs and corporate/lobbyist whoring by our elected officials, so granting one PAC or lobbying organization this sort of exemption will undoubtedly lead to ALL well heeled lobbying organizations doing the same thing. Being able to saturate the media with false or misleading last minute ad campaigns, without any restriction, and with public figure immunity from defamation is a great advance for democracy, don't you think?

	11-12-2003 00:10									#23
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quote: This isn't really a "free speech" issue though - the NRA has a huge number of other communications outlets, but it is a corporate/political lobby looking for a loophole around campaign and lobbying rules that restrict every other campaign contributor and lobbyist.

quote: We already have enough problems with obscene campaign costs and corporate/lobbyist whoring by our elected officials, so granting one PAC or lobbying organization this sort of exemption will undoubtedly lead to ALL well heeled lobbying organizations doing the same thing. Being able to saturate the media with false or misleading last minute ad campaigns, without any restriction, and with public figure immunity from defamation is a great advance for democracy, don't you think?

I MtG

	11-12-2003 00:24									#24
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{Clint Eastwood voice from Heartbreak Ridge}

Don't think that this means we'll be taking long hot showers together.

{/Clint Eastwood voice from Heartbreak Ridge}

	11-12-2003 00:26									#25
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What these people have to say sucks, but they still have the right to say it. If those who disagree wish to resort to back-handed tactics to suppress them, then it is a bad day for liberty.

	11-12-2003 00:28									#26
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat {Clint Eastwood voice from Heartbreak Ridge} Don't think that this means we'll be taking long hot showers together. {/Clint Eastwood voice from Heartbreak Ridge}

yeah, we'll see how you feel after I get a fifth of peppermint schnapps in you

	11-12-2003 00:29									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Whaleboy What these people have to say sucks, but they still have the right to say it. If those who disagree wish to resort to back-handed tactics to suppress them, then it is a bad day for liberty.

sure, they can go out in public and march and say whatever they want... but purchasing PUBLIC AIRWAVEs that are REGULATED BY THE GOVERNMENT is not a guaranteed right in the US Constitution. And as MtG basically said, it's in the public's interest to not let such special interest groups pollute the airwaves with their propaganda.

	11-12-2003 00:30									#28
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The thread title is misleading:

quote: The Massachusetts senator sent Federal Election Commission (search) Chairwoman Ellen Weintraub a letter Tuesday asking the commission to block any attempt by the NRA to get a media exemption to campaign finance rules.

He isn't banning an NRA channel, he just does not wish for them to get an exemption to the rules. I mean, would you really want an ACLU channel (knowing your political persuasion?)

	11-12-2003 00:31									#29
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forgive diplomat... he's a victim of faux news and rush limbaugh propaganda... and he's a Packer fan.

	11-12-2003 00:32									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Sava and he's a Packer fan.

STRING THE BASTARD UP!!!!