28-04-2004 18:51									#511
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Double post

Last edited by Drachen on 28-04-2004 at 19:01

	28-04-2004 20:21									#512
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875BC is the best I have done and still do a bit of rexing. If you could get contacts and trade for masonary for a prebuild and had really prime land you could do a bit better.

All of that would cause other problems, such as a faster tech race, not good. To me the biggest hurdle is the end of the GL.

You can get a real bad beating on the tech pace at that point. I have often had the KAI run off a bunch of techs on me and show up with calvs while I am not even working on the prereqs for MT.

They also will slap out the remaining wonders for the whole age in nothing flat.

	28-04-2004 20:36									#513
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vmxa1: SirPleb solved the GL depreciation by giving away that city to a weak faraway civ just before education gets discovered. then, after saving dozens of turns, he "reacquired" it later on catapulting him into the industrial age.

it's a huge exploitation, but i guess at sid, that's allowed

ps: sorry, if you knew this already...

	28-04-2004 20:42									#514
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On my first attempt at SID level, I got a message by 3000 BC that the Bab's had finished the colossus.
That is when I gave up.

	28-04-2004 23:13									#515
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quote: Originally posted by sabrewolf vmxa1: SirPleb solved the GL depreciation by giving away that city to a weak faraway civ just before education gets discovered. then, after saving dozens of turns, he "reacquired" it later on catapulting him into the industrial age. it's a huge exploitation, but i guess at sid, that's allowed ps: sorry, if you knew this already...

I just read that last night. A great idea that's going into my bag of tricks for my next start. Too late now as my Cavs are are on the march in my current Sid game A.K.A Hardscrabble.

	28-04-2004 23:30									#516
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I am aware of the idea, but I would not use it. In any event it is not always available. The biggest problem with it to me is that the city that has the GL will be one of my strongest cities. May even be my capitol.

Not to mention that it would not do anything to prevent the KAI from jumping out ahead. One of the issues is if the KAI is close to you. If it has to come from a long distance, it will not be so bad.

	28-04-2004 23:41									#517
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quote: Originally posted by Flandrien On my first attempt at SID level, I got a message by 3000 BC that the Bab's had finished the colossus. That is when I gave up.

Yeah that is not funny, but you get use to the AI annoucing its latest wonder.

One thing I would recommend is to not use random civs for Sid. Choose your opponents and do it carefully. Lots of expansion and military types. Best to not have any that will have Alphabet to start. A good idea is no Sea, no Sci as well.

Use fewer than the standard number of civs for the map size. The real pain is that you end up with only a few civs to use yourself for the best shot.

If the civ can get a GA from the lib, it is no good either. You do not want a GA with only a few cities up and running. I can live with a despotic GA if I have lots of cities and mines.

This is why Iroq is so strong for this game. You can use the MW to bust barbs and upgrade to Knights. Hold a few back to trigger a GA when you are ready. You start with Alpha and the AG is great. Commerce allows a large OCN and more gold for upgrade and research.

I fooled aroun with Mayan and the French among others, but the French do not have Pottery, so you need a trade right away or suffer.

	29-04-2004 14:08									#518
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quote: Originally posted by sabrewolf vmxa1: SirPleb solved the GL depreciation by giving away that city to a weak faraway civ just before education gets discovered. then, after saving dozens of turns, he "reacquired" it later on catapulting him into the industrial age. it's a huge exploitation, but i guess at sid, that's allowed ps: sorry, if you knew this already...

Yea, I also just read it it. Brilliant
Of course, in my game, I did the reverse, I researched Education (owning the GL!) in order to stay ahead in the tech race

	29-04-2004 14:10									#519
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quote: Originally posted by Flandrien On my first attempt at SID level, I got a message by 3000 BC that the Bab's had finished the colossus. That is when I gave up.

Turn that bloody thing off and have faith in your skills....

	29-04-2004 14:25									#520
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in his thread he also wrote about the AI civs not really having money as they probably kill themselves with upkeep costs.

have you experienced the same or similar? and if so: how can you sell your techs to get enough money for your full-out research?

	29-04-2004 19:52									#521
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Even the top dog has no money by the middle ages in all the games I have played. I can't wait to see how you out researched the AI before they got trimmed.

I have to steal techs to stay close, except for a rare trade. China was 4 techs ahead the moment I got Ed from the GL. They declared soon after and I got all other civs to ally with me, but I can't research worth a crap. I am putting 20% on lux and using one scientist. The cash is for upgrades and steals.

Yes I am slapping Unis in the good cities and have Libs in most. I still have my GA to use, but China built the wall and Suns so they must have burned theirs.

They also had one war with the Zululand earlier.

Last edited by vmxa1 on 30-04-2004 at 05:10

	30-04-2004 03:17									#522
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You may visit my 'Sid level' thread...

	05-05-2004 23:18									#523
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Ok today I finally launched my ship.

Attachment: space.jpg
This has been downloaded 121 time(s).

	05-05-2004 23:34									#524
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Funny thing was that as it got to the end, China got Robotics and I stole it (safely). I then switched my ICBM to the last part. It needed two turns. I investigated China and found it was not making the last part, but was building a manufacturing plant?

I sweated them luanching nukes, but they were getting two luxs and some cash from me and were at war with the US.

I had nearly 16K in my cap and was getting 74 culture per turn there. I never went out of Monarchy.

Not that many wars, other than the one with Aztecs and Arbaia most were fairly short. I suspect that the issue of getting troops over seas was the issue.

The Aztecs and Arabs I stayed at war until I eliminated them, I needed the land. I have a number of wars with China. The first were over the starting island/contient. I kicked them off and a few others that tried to grab land there.

Mongols were another target I could have went for, but did not want to do the effort. My last war with the US was just me bombing their land and troops in the open. They had about 1200 troops and I just did not want to face that much work.

I had a bunch of armies and could make more, so it was not a problem. They had 234 medieval inf, 324 infantry, 162 pikes, 158 knights, 70 swords and scores of other units. No ships or planes.

I had everything, execept stealth and armies of MechInf. I had already cut many of their roads. I just did not want to watch 100's of battles and have to send in countless arties and planes.

I had had enough of watching 80-150 units die at the hands of my MI or Inf armies forted in a city on a hill. Sometimes close to 100 units would die and never get the MI armies into the yellow.
Three MI armies are a tough nut to crack. They often never even went into any of the other half a dozen armies backing them up. Not to mention I may have 40 or 50 elite tanks there.

	06-05-2004 17:00									#525
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and then we were two...

	06-05-2004 20:10									#526
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Congratulations Vmxa. You worked hard for this win. Could you post the game settings for us?

	06-05-2004 22:02									#527
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I am looking at my notes and I have written only the number of civs 9, wet, warm, 5b yrs, no barbs, 80% water. I know it was on a huge archipelago though, not sure why I did not note that.

Even though I wrote warm and wet, I am not sure I actually used those setting. I think what I wrote was the setting SirPleb used. I just cannot say that I actually used them all.

I wish I had noted the day I started, but have 14 pages of notes. The time is of no use as I leave the game up all day, most of the time.

Once in a while I will take it down to do something else and maybe when I go to bed.

Anyway the key settings are lots of water, huge map and only 9 civs. Maybe no barbs, as that means no huts for the AI. This is of course an attempt to slow the tech race. The tech was very slow for the first half of the game. After GL expired, CHina just ran at 4 or 5 turns for tech. After they went to Fascism they slowed for a bit, then picked the pace up to about 5 or 6 turns at the end.

	06-05-2004 23:11									#528
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Thanks Vmxa;

If you haven't started a new game your settings should be intact or perhaps in the ini file.

	07-05-2004 02:03									#529
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I have loaded a number of games from here already. In fact they keep nailing my preferences. You would think I would remember to check them by now.

Anyway the only ones I am not sure of is the Wet annd maybe the warm. I had a huge swath of jungle in my start location, but I have seen that in none wet maps. I did not see a lot jungle else where, but the AI may have cleared it.

The only purpose of the wet and warm (I think) is to slow the game down.

	07-05-2004 04:45									#530
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yup. I'm using cold, arrid, 3 Billion, and 80% water on an Archepelago map and it definately helped slow the AI down. My constant pillaging hasn't helped them much either.

	07-05-2004 05:17									#531
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What I was a bit surprised at was late in the game America declared on me and I did not want to bother fighting them.

So I used two carriers to chop roads and improvements and kill a few troops. Anyway the US was no making troops as they could not afford more, they had about 1200. So I expected a few troops to be disbanded with the loss of the road and such, but that did not happen.

They finally made peace and then declared on china who was the largest?

	08-05-2004 09:02									#532
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Very impressive vmxa1

I have never attempted Sid at all. I might just try now that I'll have lots of spare time in summer though admittedly I'll have to greatly unbalance the settings in my favor

The funny thing is that I just don't find the higher difficulty levels in SP play as a real challange. It's basically just the AI cheating more than before. I wish that in Civ4 Firaxis actually bothers in improving the AI from each level so you that you can at least say that the AI REALLY beat you, rather than out-cheat you.

* Master Zen will stick on demigod for most of his games

	08-05-2004 10:12									#533
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I know you will crush it Master Zen. I fought it fun for awhile, but it does get tedious, especially if you go with the conquest/dom like Nathan and Aeson. So many units to deal with.

	08-05-2004 11:51									#534
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"crush it" makes it sounds like it'll be a cakewalk...


this reminds me, I really need more C3C experience. I started playing AU501 and was doing quite well - then I accidentally formatted my hard drive and lost the saves...

Right now I am playing an emperor pangea C3C game in the Spanish Forum which is turning into a mass warmonger spree. Unfortunatelly it is with the 1.15 patch and that very annoying FP bug. I think I will set up a dual boot with the latest patch and play some SP next week. Nevertheless this will likely be my first finished C3C game since around August of last year.

	08-05-2004 21:27									#535
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None the less I know you are very skilled and will be able to win.

	10-05-2004 15:59									#536
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Master Zen,

Play it the PP way. Instead of 100 hours to win, you'll use up only 25 hours, or, for the same amount of time, you can get 4 wins!

	10-05-2004 21:45									#537
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quote: Originally posted by Mountain Sage Master Zen, Play it the PP way. Instead of 100 hours to win, you'll use up only 25 hours, or, for the same amount of time, you can get 4 wins!

I'm not sure if "the dark side" will let me do that!

	10-05-2004 22:00									#538
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MS you can ignore the time on my game as I often leave the game all day even if I am not home. Sometimes I shut it down to do something else, sometimes not.

So all it really tells me is how many hours I had the game load. I run without using the CD, so it is not a problem with wear and tear.

	11-05-2004 15:23									#539
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 MS you can ignore the time on my game as I often leave the game all day even if I am not home. Sometimes I shut it down to do something else, sometimes not.

Why don't you get lost?

I was trying to convert an evil player to the 'Peace & Sid' side...

Master Zen: be sensible, at least this time. Either you play it PP, and win, or you play it Arrian's style ( ) and you'll lose. Losing with dignity is very noble, but it's still not a victory...

	18-05-2004 15:47									#540
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I am undefeated on Sid level. I played it once, at the peak of my CivIII-prime, when Conquests was released, and beat it by one-city culture victory. I proved I could do it, and I don't think I will ever try it again.


The civ: Byzantium, small map, continents.