21-01-2004 04:55									#1
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This is a discussion thread for what PEACE base should we attack last.
This is an important question as due to a bug in MP games a human player must obliterate his last base himself, instead of letting it be captured by his conqueror. So there will always be one base we can't get.

IIRC Impaler proposed we should leave Atlantis to be obliterated. I can't recall his arguments, but I assume he would want to tell them later himself.

A proposal I made in the past was to let Calico Island be obliterated. My arguments for that proposal are that Calico is located away from the rest of our bases, and thus it would be more difficult to defend. Also it is located far away, so it would cause inefficiency.
The same can be said about Atlantis. However Atlantis can have one other use: acting as an airbase where our aircraft can land before being sent onwards to attack the Angels or - if they decide to co-op with the Drones and attack us or PUT - the Hive.

What would others propose to let be the last PEACE base standing? And why do you propose so?

	21-01-2004 05:12									#2
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I follow your drift in this except for one thing:
You say Atlantis can have a future use as an airbase, but the same counts for Calico Island (to the University). Unless off course the're plans to colonize the land just east of Calico.

	21-01-2004 05:21									#3
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quote: Originally posted by GeoModder You say Atlantis can have a future use as an airbase, but the same counts for Calico Island (to the University).

Indeed. Though we already have many other bases that are in range of PUT: DBTSverse Portal, Zetaris and And/Or Gate.

	21-01-2004 05:23									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Maniac Indeed. Though we already have many other bases that are in range of PUT: DBTSverse Portal, Zetaris and And/Or Gate.

Um, to make sure: PUT means the University?
And now that I'm at it IIRC? IMO? And another few like that?

	21-01-2004 05:30									#5
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PUT = Planet University of Technology
IIRC : If I Recall/Remember Correctly
IM(H)O: In My (Humble) Opinion

Here are a few others.

	21-01-2004 10:29									#6
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Is there any chance that we could explore some of the area around each before having to decide? We may find that the terrain/sea around one is worth having a near presence to more than the other. Otherwise Calico should go - it is way distant North from the other PEACE bases.

	21-01-2004 15:17									#7
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I'm with MWIA on this one.

However, if we get PEACE to capitulate, they can transfer their bases to us, can they not? I'll write up the 3D now, for the Pact and surrender.

	21-01-2004 15:58									#8
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And about this last base bug thing for MP - was there a rule made about it at the start of the game, or will we just have to rely on Googlie to enforce a capitulation?

	21-01-2004 16:25									#9
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I proposed to Googlie that we send out plans to take it, he looks at PEACE defenses and sees if it's possible to defend it. If it isn't, he enforces capitulation.

However Tass is in charge now.

	21-01-2004 19:10									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue I'm with MWIA on this one. However, if we get PEACE to capitulate, they can transfer their bases to us, can they not? I'll write up the 3D now, for the Pact and surrender.

Isn't there the possibility that PEACE transfer bases to another faction instead of us, go over to that faction, and influence a war against us from their new home faction?
Or are their rules against that in this game?

	21-01-2004 19:23									#11
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They could. We just hope they don't know they could, or have more integrity than that.

	21-01-2004 22:30									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue They could. We just hope they don't know they could, or have more integrity than that.

The rules only disallow base-trading with the AI

PEACE could gift a base (or bases) to the AI, (that is permissible) or could empty a base(s) and invite a human player to invade and capture it (the only way of "gifting" a base to another human faction.

G.

	22-01-2004 00:31									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Googlie The rules only disallow base-trading with the AI PEACE could gift a base (or bases) to the AI, (that is permissible) or could empty a base(s) and invite a human player to invade and capture it (the only way of "gifting" a base to another human faction. G.

What is it now?

First line you tell that base trading with the AI is disallowed according to the rules, and in the second paragraph you tell that PEACE is permitted to gift to the AI?

And if gifting a base to another human faction can't, is SELLING then possible?

	22-01-2004 00:47									#14
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We can't trade bases to the AI in exchange for something else, but we can gift for nothing. There's a difference. And to humans we can both gift or trade bases.

MWIA:

quote: Is there any chance that we could explore some of the area around each before having to decide?

We've assimilated the PEACE map this year. So we know all the surroundings.

	22-01-2004 01:05									#15
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GeoModder, base-trading is a term used for bug when you can tried a level one colony in a middle of no-where for a level 15 base with all secret projects -or so to say exchange New York for a village in middle of sand desert. This is an exploitable bug not allowed for obvious reasons, because for example Peace would exchange bases with Angels.

	22-01-2004 02:24									#16
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The reason I feel Atlantis is a more promising "last base" is that our Amphibius forces will need to capture it as its a land base. The only remaining Ocean bases are Lair and Calico so very soon our navy will have nothng to do and might as well take Calico. Marines will likly take a bit longer to mop up PEACe land bases though so it makes sense to make the last base a land base.

Ofcorse we will likly play the whole thing by Ear.

I also porpose we build some land bases on the southern tip of the land mass that Calico is bordering, simply for the purposes of laying claim to that island and expanding our territory.

Also note that Atlantis is much to far away from the Hive to lauch air units their, and the 2 bases of Little Accident and Henry Morgans Boot make better points of attack vs the Angels.

	22-01-2004 02:41									#17
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I agree with Impaler - seems Atlantis shall be a lost city again.

	22-01-2004 03:43									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Impaler[WrG] Also note that Atlantis is much to far away from the Hive to lauch air units their

Indeed. But with Atlantis we would only need to build one more base 8 squares NW of Atlantis if we wanted to create an air bridge to the Hive. Without Atlantis, when we feel the need for such an air bridge, it would take us two bases that we'd have to build.
Btw, this argument is no longer valid if we should attack the Angels (with Monsoon Jungle ) after we finished PEACE, as Angel bases are even closer to the Hive.

	22-01-2004 04:35									#19
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I'll go for Atlantis as the last base. IMHO the ease of capture and ability to colonise the nice little area around Calico seems worth it.

	22-01-2004 05:38									#20
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I guess that's settled then.

	30-01-2004 17:57									#21
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Copy from my post in the EAF Office:

quote: Alternate use of the Mammoth task Force might be to Capture Pampalona as that would prevent a Barq from being completed

I would have preferred that as well. But (IMHO) unfortunately a majority seems in favour of keeping Atlantis instead of Calico as the last base to attack. So if we would now attack Pamplona, we couldn't attack Atlantis the turn after. Henry Morgan's Boat would have to be captured first. That means an extra two turns to move back CCS Mammoth from Pamplona to HMB, and then again three turns to move Mammoth Task Force from HMB to Atlantis. Very inefficient.
This would not be a problem if we designated Calico as the base to be obliterated. Then the task description would be much easier: CCS Mammoth goes for Pamplona and Atlantis, CCS Impaler goes for HMB and Little Accident, and Calico will be obliterated. The war would be over much sooner, possibly in three years.

	30-01-2004 21:15									#22
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Hmm, I am willing to reconsider my vote if you are sure that it will shorten the war.

	31-01-2004 21:01									#23
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What ever gets the war over ASAP gets my vote, just be shure their are no slip ups