28-01-2004 07:01									#61
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

It is time for Lieberman and Clark to drop out.

	28-01-2004 07:03									#62
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

From cnn:

quote: Candidate Vote % NH Del Total Delegates Kerry 39% 14 95 Dean 25% 8 112 Edwards 13% 0 36 Clark 12% 0 30 Lieberman 9% 0 25 Kucinich 2% 0 2 Sharpton 0% 0 4

	28-01-2004 07:07									#63
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Bizarro World:
Everyone drops out and endorses Carol Mosely Braun, who comes back to the top of the pack and surprise landslides Bush in November.

Ideal World:
Everyone drops out and endorses Edwards who makes an Edwards-Kerry ticket which kicks ass and results in global peace and prosperity.

Real World:
Kerry wins. The future after that is vague, but Bush causes a nuclear accident before Election time that wipes out most of the mostly-Democrat states.

	28-01-2004 07:08									#64
	Tired of ads?

There should be a Dean surge later on. Lieberman will fall behind a bit.... According to CNN at least. Still at least Herman Munster's won. Best candidate, he'll lose against Bush though.

IIRC Clark's said he won't accept the VP on the ticket. So he's out. He should drop out really. Edwards still has a chance, especially in the south.

	28-01-2004 07:15									#65
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Clark has pulled in to third place (13% to Edwards 12%)with 56% reporting.

	28-01-2004 07:24									#66
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Edan Clark has pulled in to third place (13% to Edwards 12%)with 56% reporting.

Noooooooooooo!

	28-01-2004 07:28									#67
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior Noooooooooooo!

Well, with 3rd place, the race is tight enough, so it might flip again.

Personally, I don't think either Edwards or Clark will drop out before next week, anyway.

	28-01-2004 07:30									#68
	Remove this text

quote: I'd sooner do a "Kenobi" and slip Mariah Carey a length than touch that moronic, whining slag.

Ouch!

Unlike Shi, I think I'd support Kucinich if I had to pick a democratic nominee. He's more lefty than some of the other wannabe Republicans.

He's also honest about his campaign in trying to pick up a date.

	28-01-2004 07:31									#69
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Edan Well, with 3rd place, the race is tight enough, so it might flip again. Personally, I don't think either Edwards or Clark will drop out before next week, anyway.

Clearly. I just hate Wesley Clark.

	28-01-2004 07:42									#70
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I predict that every place that hasn't reported will report 150% Edwards victories, because they are enlightened and have realised the best candidate.

	28-01-2004 07:47									#71
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by mrmitchell I predict that every place that hasn't reported will report 150% Edwards victories, because they are enlightened and have realised the best candidate.

	28-01-2004 07:59									#72
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

At www.cnn.com on the primary scorecard it shows the total delegates for each canidate. Can someone explain that to me, it refers to them as unpledged delegates, but what does that mean? I thought that only Iowa and New Hampshire had voted, and that Kerry had won both, but the scorecard shows Deam leading with over 100 delegats.

	28-01-2004 08:00									#73
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

http://customwire.ap.org/dynamic/fi...ON=POLITICS#TOP

Some notes:

--Kerry got 700 write-in votes in the GOP primary, Dean another 554. Kerry's 700 actually puts him second in the GOP primary.

--Gephardt finished 30 votes ahead of Sharpton.

--No votes for Vermin Supreme.

	28-01-2004 08:02									#74
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by solar At www.cnn.com on the primary scorecard it shows the total delegates for each canidate. Can someone explain that to me, it refers to them as unpledged delegates, but what does that mean? I thought that only Iowa and New Hampshire had voted, and that Kerry had won both, but the scorecard shows Deam leading with over 100 delegats.

I'm guessing that this includes the "superdelegates" not affiliated with any particular state-- i.e. Gore, Bradley, etc.

	28-01-2004 08:02									#75
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

George W Bush (WI) (i) GOP 62 0.0% 0
Carol Moseley Braun Dem 59 0.0% 0

	28-01-2004 08:03									#76
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: quote: Originally posted by solar At www.cnn.com on the primary scorecard it shows the total delegates for each canidate. Can someone explain that to me, it refers to them as unpledged delegates, but what does that mean? I thought that only Iowa and New Hampshire had voted, and that Kerry had won both, but the scorecard shows Deam leading with over 100 delegats. I'm guessing that this includes the "superdelegates" not affiliated with any particular state-- i.e. Gore, Bradley, etc.

Thanks for the explanation.

	28-01-2004 08:22									#77
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

KERRY'S THE MAN!!!!!!

	28-01-2004 08:25									#78
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Can anyone explain to me why Joe Lieberman hasn't dropped out yet? Kucinich and Sharpton I can understand--they are flagrantly psychotic. But Joe seems a reasonable man.

	28-01-2004 08:58									#79
	Support Apolyton

Joe wants to make a deal. He ain't gonna give up his 9% till he gets something for it.

The CNN pundits and blowhards threw any semblence of proper conduct out of the window today. First of all, these folks are selling the notion that it's all over, that in a nation of 300 million John Kerry has won because 70,000 New Hamshire yanks voted for him.

Second, gosh, they let Bob Dole continue his savage attacks, last week on Clark, this week Clark again and also Lieberman. I like Bob Dole but they are letting this purely partisian politician influence the outcome of a rival parties nominating process!

Dole and most Republicans figure Kerry is a slam dunk for Bush and I concur.

Blitzer, Paul whatshisface, and just about everyone on the air were clearly pushing their opinions. What ever happened to the idea of an objective media.

Good night for Edwards. Next week he has to win somewhere or his and his party's go down the tubes. Most of you are not old enough to remember how brutal it was for Humphrey, McGovern, Dukakis, and Mondale. It will be very, very ugly.

	28-01-2004 09:44									#80
	Remove this text

Dole is just angry because he hasn't been allowed into any Pepsi commercials lately.

	28-01-2004 09:51									#81
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Final Numbers

N.H. Primary
Updated 11:37 PM ET Precincts:95%
Candidate Votes %
Kerry 81,223 39%
Dean 55,120 26%
Clark 26,241 12%
Edwards 25,386 12%
Lieberman 18,188 9%
Other 4,519 2%
Full Results Source: AP

	28-01-2004 09:54									#82
	Remove this text

quote: Dole and most Republicans figure Kerry is a slam dunk for Bush and I concur.

They consider ANY democrat as a slam dunk for Bush, so that isn't surprising. Remember when they were licking their lips that Dean may win? Who ever is the front runner will be said to get whipped. It doesn't mean anything.

quote: Blitzer, Paul whatshisface, and just about everyone on the air were clearly pushing their opinions. What ever happened to the idea of an objective

The objective reporting was done, they were offering their political punditry.

	28-01-2004 09:59									#83
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

With almost 40% of Dems favouring Kerry, that's a pretty good plurality.

	28-01-2004 10:13									#84
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Anybody check out the Exit Poll data? Some very interesting numbers.

Here's the ones I found particularly interesting.

Exit polls

Can't get the graphs.

Category / Percentage / Clark / Dean / Edwards / Kerry / Kucinich / Leiberman / Sharpton


18-29 14 11 34 10 33 2 8 0

DEAN OUTSCORES KERRY!

High school graduate: 15 17 16 12 43 1 9 0

DEAN AT 16 %

No matter how you voted today, do you usually think of yourself as a:

Republican 4 10 8 9 29 0 26 0

LOOK AT THE JUMP FOR LEIBERMAN!

On most political matters, do you consider yourself:

Very liberal 15 13 41 9 30 4 3 0
Somewhat liberal 32 11 33 10 39 1 7 0
Moderate 45 13 18 15 43 0 10 0
Somewhat conservative 8 13 14 13 32 0 23 0

Interesting. Look at Dean's numbers. Highest for the Liberals, and lowest for the conservatives.


------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lumping together Liberals, same pattern. Look at how low Dean's numbers compare to Kerry's for the Moderates!

Liberal 46 11 35 10 36 2 5 0
Moderate 45 13 18 15 43 0 10 0
Conservative 9 11 14 11 33 0 23 0

------------------------------------------------------------------------


-----------------------------------------------------------------------

How often have you visited any of the Democratic candidates' Web sites?

Frequently 10 14 35 10 32 2 7 0

Again, Dean scores well.

47% of Catholics voted for Kerry!

Protestant/Other Christian 34 12 25 15 37 1 10 0
Catholic 36 12 19 12 47 0 9 0

How often do you attend religious services?

INTERESTING FIGURES. Especially for the once a week crowd, more supported Leiberman than Clark.

Look at how much Kerry's numbers take a hit with the crowd who never go to church!

Once a week 15 8 22 8 41 2 16 1
A few times a month 10 19 22 13 43 1 2 0
A few times a year 35 11 22 14 43 1 8 0
Never 27 14 30 12 34 1 8 0

...................................................................

Church attendance by Religion • Back to Top

Protestant/Attend weekly 12 8 25 5 33 2 23 1
Protestant/Do not 36 11 25 18 39 0 6 0
Catholic/Attend weekly 16 9 15 11 49 0 15 1
Catholic/Do not attend weekly 36 12 21 12 47 0 6 0

Look at the Catholic / Protestant divide. 23 of the Protestants that go weekly voted for Leiberman, while the Catholics all like Kerry.

When did you finally decide for whom to vote in the Presidential primary? •

In the last week 19 10 15 14 52 1 8 0
Before that 26 8 40 8 31 2 7 0

Look at the difference. In the last week, 52% of the voters liked Kerry. Before 1 month 40% of the voters liked Dean.

You can find this stuff on the front page of www.msnbc.com

	28-01-2004 10:21									#85
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: No matter how you voted today, do you usually think of yourself as a: Republican 4 10 8 9 29 0 26 0

Btw, Kerry is the 29 and Dean is the 8. Kerry has much more cross-party appeal than Dean. Dean has painted himself as a liberal, and if he isn't, then he has TOTALLY made a political miscalcuation.

	28-01-2004 10:27									#86
	Remove this text

Thanks Ben. I'd sure would like a site or sites where I could get tracking polls for next week's primaries.

Well, we now have a real frontrunner. Dean has no choice but to go negative on Kerry. He has the money to keep this thing muddy for a bit. Clark has to get negative also. I expect we will see some fireworks this week.

What does ole Joe want out of this anyway? Is he just pissed off at Al Gore and hanging around to take shots at Dean out of spite?

	28-01-2004 10:29									#87
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Only half done. Plenty more questions to go through.

Most of the rest I left out made very little difference in the outcome.

	28-01-2004 11:01									#88
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

He can defeat George W. Bush in November 33 16 14 11 56 0 2 0
He agrees with you on the major issues 57 12 29 14 29 1 13 0

Seems pretty indicative os the difference between Dean and Kerry.

How do you feel about the Bush Administration.

Angry 46 13 35 9 37 2 4 0
Satisfied, 14 13 13 16 32 0 22 0

Tax cuts instituted by Bush should be:

Left entirely in place 10 12 18 10 24 1 26 0

Do you favor or oppose allowing homosexual couples to form civil unions,
giving them some of the same legal rights as married couples?

Oppose 24 14 12 12 44 0 14 0

Dean's numbers drop to the pack.

Does Dean have the temperment to be President?

Yes 56 12 43 9 29 1 5 0
No 39 14 1 15 54 0 14 0

Opinion of Wesley Clark.

Unfavorable 33 0 32 16 34 1 15 0

Opinion of Howard Dean.

Favorable 56 9 47 8 27 2 5 0
Unfavorable 40 15 1 19 48 0 14 0

Opinion of Edwards:

Unfavorable 22 16 33 1 30 1 14 0

Dean beats out Kerry.

Opinion of Kerry:

Favourable 72 8 20 11 51 1 7 0
Unfavorable 25 19 44 16 1 2 14 0

Lightning rod Lieberman:

He polarises the Deaniacs. Look at these numbers!

Favorable 56 11 18 14 39 1 15 0
Unfavorable 39 12 40 10 32 3 0 0

War with Iraq

Strongly approve 10 10 11 15 27 0 29 1

Dean still cannot beat Kerry, even with the anti-war folks favouring Kerry more than Dean.

Lumping all the approvals together,

Approve 30 12 12 16 37 0 20 0

Safer from terrorism due to the war in Iraq?

Yes 25 11 12 15 36 0 21 0


How worried are you that there will be another major terrorist attack in the United States?

Not too worried 18 14 35 11 30 2 4 1

Finally Dean wins a round.

Lumping the complacent.

Not too/Not at all worried 19 13 35 12 30 2 4 1

Economy:

Good 22 11 17 14 35 1 18 0

Lieberman beats out Dean.

Even with the worst economy, Dean cannot beat Kerry.



What do you consider the most important issue of the election?

The war in Iraq 19 17 37 3 33 2 8 0

Dean's doing well...

Economy/Jobs 22 10 18 17 48 0 6 0

Eh, that's not good.


What do you like most about the candidates?

He cares about people like me 12 13 22 24 37 1 3 0
He has a positive message 13 6 20 27 32 1 13 1

Edwards finishes second again!

He stands up for what he believes 29 7 47 5 21 2 17 0
He would shake things up in Washington 7 14 46 14 13 9 0 2

Dean's best number.

Has the right experience 12 21 9 3 58 1 8 0
He can defeat George W. Bush 20 13 10 12 62 0 4 0

Kerry comes roaring back.

	28-01-2004 20:13									#89
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

some thoughts on last night....

Joe LIEberman needs to go away... he claimed he was "split" at third with Clark and Edwards. Sorry Dopey Joe... 18,000 to 24k and 25k isn't a split. He then used the excuse that Dean and Kerry were "neighbors" and that's why they scored high. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Connecticut pretty close to New Hampshire? Joe's speech was lame. He tried his hardest to pander to the right. He even said, "We're one nation under GOD!" Give me a break Joe. How the hell do you expect to win the nomination when you act like a Republican?

I also saw Joe on Larry King and his words spoke volumes about his views. Joe didn't say "We are still vulnerable" to terrorists... he said "People still feel vulnerable" and that's why his strong "defense" record would be good against Bush. Joe is trying to play off of people's fears. He made somewhat of a Freudian slip.

Lieberman needs to drop out. He won't win the nomination, and he certainly has no chance of beating Bush. I wouldn't even vote for LIEberman. We don't need a Bush-lite.

Dean's speech was very good. I was hoping for a repeat of his psychotic performance, but he surprised me by delivering a good speech to his troops. Comparing the Kerry crowd and the Dean crowd, you would have thought Dean won last night. According to most polls, the Kerry voters believe he's electable over Dean, which may be true, but speaks volumes about Kerry-supporters. They don't stand behind Kerry on the issues, they just want a Bush beater. While Dean's supporters are motivated and passionate about their candidate.

Edwards and Clark should not drop out, despite a few people believing they should. South Carolina is coming up, and those two expect to do well. I doubt Kerry is going to translate well into the South, but he's been playing the Veteran angle, so you never know. I'm hoping Edwards does well because he's the guy I'm rooting for now. Clark has some great policies, but he's simply not getting the message out. Nobody knows much about Clark except he's a general, and that's a testament to the ineptitude of his campaign.

One thing about Bob Dole that I love... on MSNBC's Hardball, they played a clip from the 1988 New Hampshire Republican Primary. George Bush just won and Brokaw asked Bush if he had anything to say to Dole. Bush responded, "Yes, I wish Mr. Dole luck and hope to see him down South."..

Brokaw turned to Dole and said, "And do you have anything to say to Mr Bush?"

Dole looked into the camera, quite angrily, and said, "Yeah, stop lying about my record!"

	28-01-2004 20:48									#90
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Agathon There have only been two primaries so far. Dean has a lot more money than Kerry. That matters.

Somehow I figure money will not be a big problem for Kerry


"Kerry is married to Teresa Heinz Kerry and has two daughters by a previous marriage. His wife is the widow of GOP Sen. John Heinz of Pennsylvania and has an estimated fortune of $600 million."


I know its his wife that has 600mill but that type of money means you run in circles where big cheques can be written.