11-03-2004 16:46									#211
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Speaking of Darren Lehmann. He got to 129 and was chasing runs for a declaration. He took an almighty swipe at Murali, knocked it two miles straight up in the air, eventually to be caught. They don't turn down the pitch microphones on cable TV. Lehmann watched the ball sailing into the air and was heard to utter a weary: "Awwwwwwww f********cckkk me".

	11-03-2004 19:15									#212
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Which kind of says it all really. I would expect nothing less from a Headingly alumni.

After the first day I just cannot believe the target Australia have been able to set!

quote: I'm not sure what not touring there will achieve. It won't get rid of the lunatic. It worked against apartheid but only in concert with a massive number of other measures.

I don’t really care about change in Rhodesia. They made their bed and they can now lie in it for me – it’s the safety of our boys whilst over there that’s worries me. Far better they didn’t go - and sod the ICC.

quote: Mental strength, belief in themselves. That which, unfortunately, manifests itself in unpleasant ways from time to time.

Are we talking your lot – or Clive?

quote: So who is there?

With Charisma? Not Vickery that’s for sure - and he seems likely to be the next skipper. Wilko? Naaaa!

If he ever recaptures form maybe Ben Kay – he is very quiet but then so was Jonno at a comparative age. The Lions tour of 97 produced the Jonno we came to love (or hate?). Maybe Lions 05 will make Kay the man for four years or so?

A long shot could be Chris Jones – I don’t think he is ready yet for the side even but he is a very smart, humble and polite young man just like Martin was at 20 (yes I am serious).

It’s a difficult thing to try and guess – when Jonno became our club captain at 26 he replaced the most revered skipper we had ever had to that point (Richards) and we all said “I’m not sure about this”. Shows what we knew doesn’t it?

quote: I know Telstra were happy to stump up very big money without wanting the jersey

A dream of a sponsor then – O2 definitely wanted our shirt fronts (and ruined them).

I have incidentally bought a few choice shirts from the RFU in preparation for visiting Paris and meeting Tamerlin’s and LDiCesare’s countrymen. They are subtle understated things for the most part – perhaps referring in modest lettering to a certain RWC win. I plan to enjoy the weekend whatever happens you see.

	12-03-2004 04:09									#213
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quote: Originally posted by finbar I suspect they weren't ready for the overtly satirical tone of it. At the same time, they probably hadn't realised that all his films to that point had been satirical to varying degrees. They hadn't seen past the gentle humour.

I think you are right, I have always considered every Tati's movie to be a kind of chronicle about time passing by, changes and values thrown out by the windows in the process. But in every Tati's movie you can find a poetry and an incredible tribute to those that can stay true to themselves... even if the price to pay is really hard. But I suppose it is easier to say now that those movies are fourty years old or more. Some could say they are old, but they are still very modern, including Jour de fête.

quote: I love Traffic. Though I think his tiredness - sadness, whatever - is plainly obvious in it.

I would say that Traffic seems a bit more fatalistic or more disenchanted, as if progress would sign the end of all hope. But this movie is also telling us that adventure is never far away and that you can have a great and yet simple life if you take the time to or if you just look at a few things in a different way... which is still very optimistic.

quote: Apparently he also did something for television after Playtime that also failed.

Yes , he made a Téléfilm for the Belgian television called Parade, this is the only movie I have never seen.

Check this website: www.tativille.com

	12-03-2004 04:28									#214
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Which kind of says it all really. I would expect nothing less from a Headingly alumni.

It was nice to see Lehmann's success, particularly under such circumstances, for another reason too. He was the late David Hookes' best mate. He was on the spot when the killer punch happened. The whole thing traumatised him very severely. Apparently he's still not over it. The knockabout boofhead was seen to take a long look at heaven when he got to his ton.

quote: After the first day I just cannot believe the target Australia have been able to set!

They let us back in with negative tactics that backfired. Mental toughness, discipline and self-belief carried the day.

quote: I don’t really care about change in Rhodesia. They made their bed and they can now lie in it for me – it’s the safety of our boys whilst over there that’s worries me.

Fair point. Though I think they're perfectly safe. The thugs are on Mugabe's side, and Mugabe isn't going to let them loose on visitors who are, he would claim, legitimising him by being there. Which they're not.

quote: With Charisma? Not Vickery that’s for sure - and he seems likely to be the next skipper. Wilko? Naaaa! If he ever recaptures form maybe Ben Kay – he is very quiet but then so was Jonno at a comparative age. The Lions tour of 97 produced the Jonno we came to love (or hate?). Maybe Lions 05 will make Kay the man for four years or so? A long shot could be Chris Jones – I don’t think he is ready yet for the side even but he is a very smart, humble and polite young man just like Martin was at 20 (yes I am serious). It’s a difficult thing to try and guess – when Jonno became our club captain at 26 he replaced the most revered skipper we had ever had to that point (Richards) and we all said “I’m not sure about this”. Shows what we knew doesn’t it?

You see, I think back to that match last year against the ABs when you were a couple of men down. J**** almost singlehandedly lifted you and drove you. Physical skill, mental strength, and whatever it is that lifts others and carries them. It can't have arisen from nowhere overnight in 1997. I think Wilkinson probably has it in him, but whether his game needs the extra burden is another matter. It's been fascinating watching George Gregan playing without captaincy matters distracting him. The clock has been wound back.

quote: I have incidentally bought a few choice shirts from the RFU in preparation for visiting Paris and meeting Tamerlin’s and LDiCesare’s countrymen. They are subtle understated things for the most part – perhaps referring in modest lettering to a certain RWC win. I plan to enjoy the weekend whatever happens you see.

There are some very amusing bits and pieces circulating after the Ireland win. I watched the F1 Grand Prix on Sunday. Eddie Jordan, Irish team owner, did some last minute painting on his cars. On the back wing: the Ireland-England score, and "For Sale: One Chariot". Luckily Eddie has a sense of humour, acknowledging that if his cars failed, the joke would be on him. They did, and it was.

There's also the job lot of merchandise now available: "FOR SALE: 100,000 Grand Slam T-shirts, ties and scarves - unused (choice of 1998/99, 1999/2000, 2000/2001 and 2003/2004)".

Last year it was our turn, this year it's your turn. And the ABs are still awaiting their turn.

	12-03-2004 04:36									#215
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin I think you are right, I have always considered every Tati's movie to be a kind of chronicle about time passing by, changes and values thrown out by the windows in the process. But in every Tati's movie you can find a poetry and an incredible tribute to those that can stay true to themselves... even if the price to pay is really hard. But I suppose it is easier to say now that those movies are fourty years old or more. Some could say they are old, but they are still very modern, including Jour de fête.

They might be forty years old, but they remain relevant. I think that's the key. They're dealing in human nature, which never really changes.

quote: I would say that Traffic seems a bit more fatalistic or more disenchanted, as if progress would sign the end of all hope. But this movie is also telling us that adventure is never far away and that you can have a great and yet simple life if you take the time to or if you just look at a few things in a different way... which is still very optimistic.

True. I just find a greater degree of melancholy than in the others. Who could blame him?

quote: Yes , he made a Téléfilm for the Belgian television called Parade, this is the only movie I have never seen.

No, I haven't seen it either. I wonder if it has ever been released on video.

	12-03-2004 04:39									#216
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin Check this website: www.tativille.com

What an amazing site!

	12-03-2004 04:50									#217
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quote: Originally posted by finbar True. I just find a greater degree of melancholy than in the others. Who could blame him?

Certainly not me!

quote: No, I haven't seen it either. I wonder if it has ever been released on video.

Yes, it has... at least in France. I don't know if it can still be found though.

quote: What an amazing site!

Isn't it?

	12-03-2004 14:06									#218
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And in the end an easy win for Australia has been sealed.

quote: Mugabe isn't going to let them loose on visitors who are, he would claim, legitimising him by being there. Which they're not.

The problem is I doubt his sanity these days. A rational man would behave as you say – but the current Mugabe?

quote: It can't have arisen from nowhere overnight in 1997

It clearly didn’t – but until the matter was tested the qualities were not evident. Our hope is that there is a young player in the mix who is yet to be tested. I think Wilko would suffer hugely under the pressure – he lacks the iron shell that J has about what other think of him.

That 13 man period against the ABs comes across as even more remarkable on repeated viewings – there simply isn’t anyway we should have kept them out.

It’s good to see George on form – the world game can only benefit from it. I’d have moved mountains to get the pre-skipper Gregan come to Tigers.

quote: Luckily Eddie has a sense of humour, acknowledging that if his cars failed, the joke would be on him. They did, and it was.

Eddie is a great bloke I am reliably told. And the Irish deserve to make the most of last weekend – it was a deserved victory. I’m cool with the whole thing.

quote: Last year it was our turn, this year it's your turn. And the ABs are still awaiting their turn.

Well they slammed the tri-nations last year – but so what as that really just means beating Australia twice now and they are going to do that every so often? Apart from that I would say they are much larger under achievers than either of us? I’d be interested to hear what the Kiwi’s think?

The tri-nations will be interesting. You know what I think of Henry and even with him gathering Smith and Hansen back into the fold I still think he is a backwards step – I suspect Eddie will be the one laughing this year?

Oh and those T shirts – did you know about the ones saying “World Champion Wallabies 2003” entered into the same sale?

Now on a different note – are France totally dismissing Scotland as a threat? Not only are they playing the worrying Yachvilli at scrummie but his cover is actually the Fly Half Michelak (nothing on the bench). Can we cling to the small hope that this backfires on them? Some loose forwards can do a job at scrummie but it isn’t the strength of the rampaging French back row right now.

	12-03-2004 19:08									#219
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quote: Originally posted by Havak And in the end an easy win for Australia has been sealed.

The Sri Lankans took one look at the cold steel and didn't like what they saw. There was some fine bowling from Warne and McGill, but it was the same pitch on which we made 500+. Impressive mental and physical effort from us, but the Sri Lankans aren't a top team. A couple of handy bats and one bowler on whom they rely too much. I want to see the Australians do the same thing in India before I'm convinced about our merits in the sub-continent.

quote: The problem is I doubt his sanity these days. A rational man would behave as you say – but the current Mugabe?

I think he knows exactly what he's doing. And he wants touring teams there because he can claim it legitimises him. Which it doesn't.

quote: That 13 man period against the ABs comes across as even more remarkable on repeated viewings – there simply isn’t anyway we should have kept them out.

And if you look back to the early World Cup matches where you struggled, J**** wasn't firing in those matches. Yes, I know you won those matches, but that was more the failings of the oppo than England coming to any mid-match realisations and acting upon them.

quote: It’s good to see George on form – the world game can only benefit from it. I’d have moved mountains to get the pre-skipper Gregan come to Tigers.

You never know what he might do at the end of this season. Although he has burgeoning business interests here - if you can call a chain of coffee shops a burgeoning business interest.

quote: Well they slammed the tri-nations last year – but so what as that really just means beating Australia twice now and they are going to do that every so often? Apart from that I would say they are much larger under achievers than either of us? I’d be interested to hear what the Kiwi’s think?

On the world stage, they have to be the under achievers of all time, I'd've thought.

quote: The tri-nations will be interesting. You know what I think of Henry and even with him gathering Smith and Hansen back into the fold I still think he is a backwards step – I suspect Eddie will be the one laughing this year?

The Tri Nations will be very interesting. The Kiwi S12 teams are all struggling and now, to ice the cake, the injuries have hit. How long will it take Henry to implement whatever plans he has?

I'd also be very interested to see the results graph for teams that have turned over coaches every couple of years.

quote: Oh and those T shirts – did you know about the ones saying “World Champion Wallabies 2003” entered into the same sale?

All one of them. John O'Neill's.

quote: Now on a different note – are France totally dismissing Scotland as a threat? Not only are they playing the worrying Yachvilli at scrummie but his cover is actually the Fly Half Michelak (nothing on the bench). Can we cling to the small hope that this backfires on them? Some loose forwards can do a job at scrummie but it isn’t the strength of the rampaging French back row right now.

Face it. Tamerlin and LDiCesare could take on Scotland together and beat them. If Tamerlin ever passed the ball to LDiCesares.

	13-03-2004 01:01									#220
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quote: Face it. Tamerlin and LDiCesare could take on Scotland together and beat them. If Tamerlin ever passed the ball to LDiCesares.

Well, if the 13 other players were those who played last week, it might even be true. Scotland are at their lowest. The pack is too weak to be a problem, and they have lots of difficulty in the backs department too.
About Michalak being the backup for Yachvili, that's not really a problem. Dominici once played 9 when he played in Toulon, and I think he was better than Dimitri tends to be with France. But then Dimitri behind a strong pack might play well. I didn't check who is the fly half replacement, I guess it is Peyrelongue?
It's a real pity for Elissalde, though. He showed great skill, but, surprisingly, his passes to Michalak weren't very good.

	13-03-2004 03:24									#221
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Now on a different note – are France totally dismissing Scotland as a threat? Not only are they playing the worrying Yachvilli at scrummie but his cover is actually the Fly Half Michelak (nothing on the bench). Can we cling to the small hope that this backfires on them? Some loose forwards can do a job at scrummie but it isn’t the strength of the rampaging French back row right now.

After Jean_Baptiste Ellissalde wound I suppose Bernard Laporte does not want to imperil Frédéric Michalack's health.

Be that as it may Frédéric Michalack would be better than Dimitri Yachvili even if you tied both of his hands in his back.

	13-03-2004 05:18									#222
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Finbar, I have just downloaded an album I have tried to find for almost ten years, a vinyl I bought something like twenty years ago and that I had not listen for ten years... a pure gem. It's called What's Next and the band is Frank Marino and Mahogany Rush... fourty minutes of extasy.

	14-03-2004 07:18									#223
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Mmmm. Never heard of it or them. I'll look into it and them.

	14-03-2004 09:41									#224
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Well they slammed the tri-nations last year – but so what as that really just means beating Australia twice now and they are going to do that every so often? Apart from that I would say they are much larger under achievers than either of us? I’d be interested to hear what the Kiwi’s think?

About Ireland's win? ****ing sweet!

	14-03-2004 09:44									#225
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I can't remember which year it was, but when the Brumbies won the Super 12 no NZ teams made it to the playoffs. Hopefully this is not another one of those years.

	14-03-2004 15:53									#226
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Two years ago?

	14-03-2004 21:23									#227
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Three. I looked it up, it was 2001. What a strange year for Super 12 that was. The only year a non-NZ team won and none of the NZ teams made the playoffs.

	15-03-2004 04:35									#228
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It's obviously going to be a triennial thing!

	15-03-2004 14:22									#229
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quote: but the Sri Lankans aren't a top team. A couple of handy bats and one bowler on whom they rely too much

And now he is an injury doubt for the second test as well.

quote: And if you look back to the early World Cup matches where you struggled, J**** wasn't firing in those matches

That is true. The transition was always going to be difficult given the reliance on the man – but it could have been managed better. All indications are Clive will make the same selection errors that lost the game to Ireland. But he knows best – he is the Knight of the game after all.

quote: Although he has burgeoning business interests here - if you can call a chain of coffee shops a burgeoning business interest.

Ah but will he be able to resist the Saracens antipodean pension scheme?

quote: I'd also be very interested to see the results graph for teams that have turned over coaches every couple of years.

See Wales, results thereof.

Actually they continue to bemuse and amuse in equal measure. After interviewing two candidates for the head coach position they then gave it to a third guy instead. It has caused all sorts of grief in Wales.

quote: All one of them. John O'Neill's.

I guarantee they sold more than that – having met a fair cross section of your countrymen I am sure some of those bought one very early on (1999 probably).

quote: Tamerlin and LDiCesare could take on Scotland together and beat them. If Tamerlin ever passed the ball to LDiCesares.

Depends how much ‘pain reliever’ Tamerlin had before the match too?

Unfortunately I think LDiCesare is right – the selection of cover at nine will not matter because Scotland could not beat Uruguay right now. It’s a shame as we could do with France losing before we face them – but no realistic chance now exists. What a shame that Ireland turned up only against us.

quote: About Ireland's win? ****ing sweet!

The boys from the Emerald Isle thoroughly deserved it – I have no problem losing when the better side on the day wins.

So the Super 12 is interesting right now then – did I see the Blues destroyed by the reds this weekend? And the other two Aussie sides losing in South Africa?

Of course it all pails into insignificance besides the main news of the weekend (no not Tigers winning 18-5 at Saints!) – the decline of West Indian cricket. Did you catch any of it Finbar – it was a batting display worthy of England at their worst but actually committed by the opposition for once!

	15-03-2004 16:24									#230
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quote: Originally posted by Havak And now he is an injury doubt for the second test as well.

Is he? Oh dear. In his home town, too. Not surprising. He's overbowled to buggery. He got through something like 65 overs in our second innings.

quote: That is true. The transition was always going to be difficult given the reliance on the man – but it could have been managed better.

How? As I see it, the problem is that there isn't another one of him within cooee. Fair enough, I suppose, given that he was one of those once-a-generation chaps.

quote: Ah but will he be able to resist the Saracens antipodean pension scheme?

I thought you had Larkham lined up with Saracens. Leicester will probably offer him a motza.

quote: Actually they continue to bemuse and amuse in equal measure. After interviewing two candidates for the head coach position they then gave it to a third guy instead. It has caused all sorts of grief in Wales.

Yes, I read about it. Put aside your Taffy-phobia for a second and tell me which of the three would have been the best bet.

quote: So the Super 12 is interesting right now then – did I see the Blues destroyed by the reds this weekend? And the other two Aussie sides losing in South Africa?

The Blues were utterly abysmal without their four ABs. I had people over for dinner but taped the match. Had a fast-forward trip through the game later. They were incompetent.

The Waratahs actually did well, coming from 20-0 down to hit the front in the second half, losing to a Paulse try in the last minute. The Brumbies, stricken by handling errors, were simply steamrolled by the Bulls' gargantuan pack in appalling weather. Still, the Brumbies struggled the week before, so maybe they need a serious reality check.

quote: Of course it all pails into insignificance besides the main news of the weekend (no not Tigers winning 18-5 at Saints!) – the decline of West Indian cricket. Did you catch any of it Finbar – it was a batting display worthy of England at their worst but actually committed by the opposition for once!

Yes, I saw the, um, highlights. The Windies are in terrible trouble and have been for a couple of years. Two batsmen - Lara and Chanderpaul - and not once decent bowler. Sadly, I can't see a future for them. They missed the boat when they didn't plan for the future while enjoying their heydays.

On the bright side, though, the baddies lost in the Spanish general election.

	15-03-2004 18:50									#231
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quote: How? As I see it, the problem is that there isn't another one of him within cooee.

The key with change is to make it in manageable amounts. Where I think it went wrong is that Clive threw the baby out with the bath water. Too much change in one go, too many good players sidelined at once and too much youth thrown in too quickly. Apart from that he got everything right of course. ;-)

quote: I thought you had Larkham lined up with Saracens. Leicester will probably offer him a motza.

*Scratches head* That is an Aussie colloquialism?

quote: Put aside your Taffy-phobia for a second and tell me which of the three would have been the best bet.

That is a hard thing to ask me to do. Purely based on coaching ability it had to be Gareth Jenkins of Llanelli. The guy they appointed came from Gwent Dragons – the same team rolled twice by Tigers in our worst season ever.

As for Jenkins he might be the man who should have got it but I detest him – he is the most ungracious loser Tigers have ever beaten. His lack of class after their semi-final defeat in the 2002 H Cup will never be forgotten by me. You see I couldn’t put it aside for long!

quote: Two batsmen - Lara and Chanderpaul - and not once decent bowler

Wheras England finally seem to have a little more depth in the batting and the young bowlers seem able to mix it with second tier sides at last.

quote: On the bright side, though, the baddies lost in the Spanish general election.

Any party that actually names itself “Popular” is just asking to lose.

We are just kicking into election gear here ready for next year – Blair and Prescott both tried to play up the Tories as a credible threat at the Labour conference this weekend.

	15-03-2004 19:55									#232
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quote: Originally posted by Havak The boys from the Emerald Isle thoroughly deserved it – I have no problem losing when the better side on the day wins. So the Super 12 is interesting right now then – did I see the Blues destroyed by the reds this weekend? And the other two Aussie sides losing in South Africa?

Yes, well, the Blues were without Carlos and Xavier Rush due to injury which really seemed to take the spark out of them. Despite the scoreline I wouldn't say the Blues were destroyed. They came very close to scoring tries on a number of occasions and managed to put the Reds under a lot of pressure for the majority of the game. Still, there are no excuses for not winning. The Reds got a yellow card at the end of the first half yet still managed to run in a try. Interestingly, the Blues have never beaten the Reds on their home turf.

At this point I think we will be lucky to have one NZ side make it to the playoffs. If I had to guess I'd say Stormers v Waratahs for the final. Who was that who was saying the Super 12 is too predictable?

	15-03-2004 20:01									#233
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quote: Originally posted by finbar On the bright side, though, the baddies lost in the Spanish general election.

I thought they won? The socialist party fits my definition of "baddies".

Also, the only reason they won was because of the recent terrorist attack. Before that they were way down in the polls. Looks like Spain will be following the path of appeasement along with the likes of France, Germany, and Belgium.

	15-03-2004 20:30									#234
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Oh I'm sure I have said it was predictable once or twice maybe?

Follow through your logic on the Spanish election - we have here a terrorist attack that has succeeded - it has changed the result of an election and taken a member of the alliance out.

Our politics aren't the same - but that fact still worries me immensely.

Strangely enough I was talking to a guy last night who did six months there (the poor sod was called up off the reserve list over three years after coming out) and his opinion was this - "they don't want us there and they certainly don't want democracy - they want the clerics in charge". It will be difficult to fight that as if this is true they never can and never will emapthise with US/Uk ideals.

Just food for thought.

	15-03-2004 20:46									#235
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Oh I'm sure I have said it was predictable once or twice maybe?

Yes, yes you did.

quote: Follow through your logic on the Spanish election - we have here a terrorist attack that has succeeded - it has changed the result of an election and taken a member of the alliance out. Our politics aren't the same - but that fact still worries me immensely.

Me too. I'm afraid that this event will embolden the terrorists into trying to influence the outcome of other elections in this manner.

quote: Strangely enough I was talking to a guy last night who did six months there (the poor sod was called up off the reserve list over three years after coming out) and his opinion was this - "they don't want us there and they certainly don't want democracy - they want the clerics in charge". It will be difficult to fight that as if this is true they never can and never will emapthise with US/Uk ideals. Just food for thought.

I'm starting to wonder if the Iraqis want democracy myself. I thought the country was educated enough to handle it. We'll just have to wait and see I suppose.

	15-03-2004 23:39									#236
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Also, the only reason they won was because of the recent terrorist attack. Before that they were way down in the polls. Looks like Spain will be following the path of appeasement along with the likes of France, Germany, and Belgium.

And less supporters for the Bushmen...

	15-03-2004 23:45									#237
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia I'm starting to wonder if the Iraqis want democracy myself. I thought the country was educated enough to handle it. We'll just have to wait and see I suppose.

First, they would have to know what Democracy is... that which I am sure they don't as they have never known it.

Second, they certainly need a Democracy... but certainly not a Democracy based on our occidental values.

I am a bit in a hurry and I can't stay here any longer. I will try to come back here later tonight.

	16-03-2004 00:39									#238
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Tamerlin and Havak-

The first scientific poll of the Iraqi public (performed by Zogby international survey researchers) has a few positive things to say about what is happening in Iraq. Here's a summary of the results as published in the Wall Street Journal:

• Iraqis are optimistic. Seven out of 10 say they expect their country and their personal lives will be better five years from now. On both fronts, 32% say things will become much better.

• Asked to name one country they would most like Iraq to model its new government on from five possibilities - neighboring, Baathist Syria; neighbor and Islamic monarchy Saudi Arabia; neighbor and Islamist republic Iran; Arab lodestar Egypt; or the U.S. - the most popular model by far was the U.S. The U.S. was preferred as a model by 37% of Iraqis selecting from those five--more than Syria, Iran and Egypt put together. Saudi Arabia was in second place at 28%...Interestingly, Iraqi Shiites, coreligionists with Iranians, do not admire Iran's Islamist government; the U.S. is six times as popular with them as a model for governance.

• Our interviewers inquired whether Iraq should have an Islamic government, or instead let all people practice their own religion. Only 33% want an Islamic government; a solid 60% say no.

• Perhaps the strongest indication that an Islamic government won't be part of Iraq's future: The nation is thoroughly secularized. We asked how often our respondents had attended the Friday prayer over the previous month. Fully 43% said "never.”

• You can also cross out "Osama II": 57% of Iraqis with an opinion have an unfavorable view of Osama bin Laden, with 41% of those saying it is a very unfavorable view.

• And you can write off the possibility of a Baath revival. We asked "Should Baath Party leaders who committed crimes in the past be punished, or should past actions be put behind us?" A thoroughly unforgiving Iraqi public stated by 74% to 18% that Saddam's henchmen should be punished.

• Evidence of the comparative gentleness of this war can be seen in the poll. Less than 30% of our sample of Iraqis knew or heard of anyone killed in the spring fighting. Meanwhile, fully half knew some family member, neighbor or friend who had been killed by Iraqi security forces during the years Saddam held power.

• Perhaps the ultimate indication of how comfortable Iraqis are with America's aims in their region came when they were asked how long they would like to see American and British forces remain in their country: Six months? One year? Two years or more? Two thirds of those with an opinion urged that the coalition troops should stick around for at least another year.

	16-03-2004 04:20									#239
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quote: Originally posted by Havak The key with change is to make it in manageable amounts. Where I think it went wrong is that Clive threw the baby out with the bath water. Too much change in one go, too many good players sidelined at once and too much youth thrown in too quickly. Apart from that he got everything right of course. ;-)

Yes, ideally you'd gradually introduce the up and comers, but sometimes circumstances work against it. Now Neil Back is retiring. So, in the space of three months, you've lost J****, Leonard, Neil Back and, for what he was worth, Bracken. How many caps - how much experience - are you losing with the first three? In one hit? It's an accident of timing, just about impossible to counter. England had to win the WRC. It was their best team ever, but a team - or a unit - very near its use-by date in key areas, and it could be a while before such a unit comes around again. But I think it comes back to J****. Relying so much on one man is ultimately so dangerous. Unless, of course, there's another one on the way up.

quote: *Scratches head* That is an Aussie colloquialism?

Actually, I should have spelled it motzer or motser. It means buckets of money.

quote: That is a hard thing to ask me to do. Purely based on coaching ability it had to be Gareth Jenkins of Llanelli. The guy they appointed came from Gwent Dragons – the same team rolled twice by Tigers in our worst season ever. As for Jenkins he might be the man who should have got it but I detest him – he is the most ungracious loser Tigers have ever beaten. His lack of class after their semi-final defeat in the 2002 H Cup will never be forgotten by me. You see I couldn’t put it aside for long!

So they got it wrong on several counts, the most important of which was that they could've appointed a coach who gives you the irrits!

quote: Wheras England finally seem to have a little more depth in the batting and the young bowlers seem able to mix it with second tier sides at last.

Harmison has a lot of potential, as does Jones, the chap who injured himself in the first Test out here. As to the batting - who knows until they meet a top bowling outfit? It's people like Trescothic who are the problem - flattering to deceive against ordinary bowling, found out against top bowling because of fundamental technique problems.

quote: We are just kicking into election gear here ready for next year – Blair and Prescott both tried to play up the Tories as a credible threat at the Labour conference this weekend.

We have a fascinating situation here. Howard has largely been unchallenged for the last five years. The Labor Opposition has been impotent, with unimaginative leaders lacking the guts actually to differentiate themselves from Howard and his policies, as if afraid of alienating the electorate. Now, Labor has Mark Latham in charge. Maverick-ish, famous for calling Howard an arse-licker in relation to George Bush, and so on. And the electorate is responding to him. Howard, after so many years of Labor impotence, doesn't know how to respond. Now, with the bombing in Spain, and the change of government there, Howard is very, very scared. The next election is due for the end of the year. Intriguing times ahead.

	16-03-2004 04:28									#240
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Caligastia Also, the only reason they won was because of the recent terrorist attack. Before that they were way down in the polls. Looks like Spain will be following the path of appeasement along with the likes of France, Germany, and Belgium.

The gap between the parties had narrowed as the election approached. What has to be remembered is that 90% of the population opposed Spanish involvement in Iraq. There were massive protests. And the government's immediate reponse to the bombings - blaming ETA, denying al-Qaeda (or whomever else), when the complexity of the atrocity was not only obviously way beyond the capacity of ETA, but also completely at odds with ETA's practices - was what tipped the scales, IMHO. The government politicised the atrocity and suffered for it.