17-03-2004 15:02									#1
	Axis & Allies: European Front Beta Increase the size of your Attachments

This is my latest effort for the community: A classic WW2 scenario, starting on 1 September 1939, ending in August 1945.

The nations: Germany, Italy, France, Great Britain (& later the US) and the Soviet Union.

The map: Borrowed from John Ellis' Bonaparte II.

Have fun! And report everything!

EDIT: Added that bloody *.scn file

Attachment: axis & allies part 1.zip
This has been downloaded 49 time(s).

Last edited by jim panse on 17-03-2004 at 19:13

	17-03-2004 15:08									#2
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Files Part 2

Attachment: axis & allies part 2.zip
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	17-03-2004 15:11									#3
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And to make some appetite ... the title which will be included in the release version! Another outstanding work by sarsstock!

Attachment: title.gif
This has been downloaded 321 time(s).

	17-03-2004 15:13									#4
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And a little screenie ...

1 September 1939, 4:45 CET: The Wehrmacht is ready to attack Poland

Attachment: september 1939 - fall weiß.gif
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	17-03-2004 16:10									#5
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Steph know what it would be really cool?

If you had actually included the scenario file in the zip.

Looking good at first sight i must admit.

Last edited by Palaiologos on 17-03-2004 at 16:25

	17-03-2004 16:27									#6
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And i am glad you ignored that pompus Brit's choice of Mk1 helmets for the Greek army.

	17-03-2004 17:00									#7
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Erm, when I run the .bat file there isn't showing up a .scn file, HOW ON EARTH CAN I PLAY THE SCEN?!

	17-03-2004 17:48									#8
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WOW!

Looks damned good, Jim!

Please fix the scn file!

	17-03-2004 19:14									#9
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Ok pals, the zipped files are updated now! Enjoy

	17-03-2004 22:20									#10
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At last someone had the idea to make a civ2 scen about WW2! (sorry, couldnt resist being ironic)

nice pic

	17-03-2004 22:27									#11
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That's not irony, that's sarcasm.

	17-03-2004 23:24									#12
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you are absolutely right!

"and isnt it ironic, dont you think?"

	18-03-2004 02:46									#13
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Okay first impressions.

1.Units are extremelly powerful on the defence.Main reason is the stackable terrain.Most units have 6a 6d but that actually translates into 6a9d due to the forts.Its easier to kill units in cities than in open ground!
The invasion of Poland turned from a walk in the park to a nightmare!

IMO all unit's def should be lowered by 2(so a 4d would actually be 6d).

2.The objective count is wrong.

3.The intro prompts to a readme file but alas i couldn't find any...

4.The background gfx is too dark.Coupled with the black letters makes reading the events etc. difficult.

	18-03-2004 14:43									#14
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I definetively agree with the units having too low attack and the background being too dark.

	18-03-2004 14:54									#15
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Thanks for the feedback, Pericles! I am releasing this because it is a beta version, not the release one.

* I will change the pop-up background colour!

* I had no problems attacking & destroying Poland. Maybe you should take a look into your general´s offices I will change the unit stats though

* What´s the problem with the Objective count?

	18-03-2004 18:54									#16
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Its reversed.

You need 20 points for a decisive victory, 30 for a marginal, 100 for a marginal defeat and a grand 120 for a decisive defeat.As the scenario is currently the Krauts start with a decisive victorry on their hands having 35 objectives.

	18-03-2004 21:09									#17
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@ Pericles: Ooooops oop: I will take care of that Thank you for pointing that out

@ all: Anything else?

	19-03-2004 16:01									#18
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I took a look at the rules files, played a couple of turns and tried a few other things.

1. All the dark backgrounds and borders etc do make play a bit difficult.

2. The first turn money bug is alive and thriving. Germany starts the game with 21000+ gold after easily capturing Reims. A very obvious first move.

3. Phase III does not seem to want to load. I get "Label not found" message.

4. Agree 100% with others' comments about defenses being too strong. The only German unit that does not commit suicide when it attacks is the He-111. IMO, the only way non-vet Wehrmacht units can be useful in this scenario is to disband 3 of them to IRB an He-111.

5. There seems to be no consistent unit naming convention in rules:
Hawker Hurricane and Fairey Swordfish but Mosquito and Spitfire.
Junkers Ju-87, Heinkel He-111 but FW-190 and Me Bf-109
Somua S-35 but Char 1-bis, and so on.
Why not skip the company names?

Also, I wonder why "Ausf" is included in German unit names. Why not omit it and simplify "Junkers Ju-87 Ausf B" to "Ju-87 B"? Long unit names cover up unit specs in the Defense Minister window.

6. Was the Shturmovik actually available in 1939???

7. In rules3 there are archaic units like the Char bis-1 and Somua S-35 while the widely used Panzer V is absent? There also seem to be none of the more advanced German units like the Me-262.

8. The only artillery in this scenario is the Soviet Katyusha. I think there should be a generic artillery or howitzer unit. The Soviets were not the only ones who had powerful units that could ignore city defenses.

9. Do you intend that freights be a part of this scenario even if there is no information on what cities produce or demand?


Good looking scenario.

Last edited by AGRICOLA on 20-03-2004 at 07:07

	20-03-2004 07:57									#19
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Just a few quick notes:

1) I agree with every point raised by AGRICOLA, especially the concerns over the dark background.

2) Good choice of map!

3) The British didn't have specific 'motorised infantry' units in 1939 - all their infantry units were fully motorised with trucks and bren carriers (Bren carriers weren't APCs BTW - they were normally used as all-terrain trucks to move support weapons and reaction forces). British APC/Halftrack mounted units only began to appear in 1943 onwards, and only a tiny number of these were ever formed - one was assigned to each armoured brigade.

	20-03-2004 20:43									#20
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um, jim, no offense intended, but hav u actually played said game? there are quite a few discrepancies you might want to address:
1. Battleships are entirely undefeatable by other ships (there defence of 20 is made into 30 because of the stackable terrain)
2. submarines are useless, they cant even kill destroyers!
3. techs are still gained from conquest.
4. the battle system needs serious work, as i think was mentioned b4, only a heinkel seems to be able to attack without commiting suicide.
5. how do you intend a realistic invasion of norway when transports can only carry 1 and germany only has one of them? my advice, scrap the generic transport and give BB's and cruisers the ability to carry units.

BUT, these points are outweighed by the look and more importantly the "feel" of your scenario, the comintern are hastily invading eastern europe, italy has begun to invade yugoslavia with the minor axis, and the graphics! marvellous! have you played marko urms the struggle for europe? maybe you should look at it to get some ideas on multi-events ww2 europe scens.
keep going with this one please, it looks very promising!

	21-03-2004 00:04									#21
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@Lft Marks

quote: how do you intend a realistic invasion of norway when transports can only carry 1 and germany only has one of them? my advice, scrap the generic transport and give BB's and cruisers the ability to carry units.

There are two recent scenarios (Appeasement & Aggression is the other) where transports can only carry 1. I'm guessing that in both cases the author has tried to make an invasion of Britain very difficult for the Germans, in keeping with with what actually happened.
But, as you point out, it causes problems in Norway and, later, in north Africa. Paratroops are too far down the tech ladder to be available in 1940.

Where can I download Marko Urm's "The struggle for Europe"?

	21-03-2004 03:45									#22
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quote: Originally posted by AGRICOLA There are two recent scenarios (Appeasement & Aggression is the other) where transports can only carry 1. I'm guessing that in both cases the author has tried to make an invasion of Britain very difficult for the Germans

Yep, as well as making the Invasion of anywhere very difficult for the Allies. As the units in A&A are divisions, moving them around Europe should require a lot of shipping - moving 6 invasion divisions across the channel to Europe on D-Day took the best part of year's worth of British and American naval construction, and Opertion Sea Lion would have required something like half of Germany's entire fleet of barges and merchant ships (including those captured in 1940).

Quite simply, amphibious operations in WW2 weren't something which could be launched either quickly or 'on the cheap' - they required months of planning and preperations and vast numbers of ships. The only reason the Germans were able to pull of the Norwegian operation was that they achieved near total suprise. Had the Norwegians and/or British anticipated the attack, the Germans would have been slaughtered.

	21-03-2004 08:23									#23
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I was just browsing the units and I was noticing that the MC 202 Folgore graphic is uncorrect since it has a radial engine, while the DB 601 was an inline engine. You can use my MC 202 if you like.

Attachment: macchi-202.gif
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	21-03-2004 20:56									#24
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Marko urms "the struggle for europe 2" can be downloaded from his website http://www.hot.ee/markourm2/ , and is in my opinion the most comprehensive ww2 in europe scenario. it's a shame he hasnt updated it in a while, fairlines graphics would really suit the variety of units involved.

	21-03-2004 22:34									#25
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Wow, how come this scenario never is talked about and isnt at the spanish bestonet? Seems huge!

	22-03-2004 01:32									#26
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@ Jonash: That´s because I am still working on it

@ Unit stats: I am using the unit stats of 2194 giga v1 by Pap1723 and I am seriously wondering why you are against those stats in this scen and not against those stats in Pap´s scen :dknow:

Anyway, I will update the posted BETA when I am no longer sick, hopefully this week somewhen!

Stay tuned!

	22-03-2004 02:20									#27
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Hehe Jim, sorry but I was refering to Marko Urms Struggle for Europe. I KNOW yours isnt finished and WILL become one of the bestonets scenarios.

	22-03-2004 04:14									#28
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Never played Pap's 2194 Giga.

If it has the same stats AND stackable terain then it doesn't have good balance either.

Sick you said? Perastika!

	22-03-2004 05:18									#29
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I think 2194 is pretty well balanced. i've never heard anyone complained about it.

	22-03-2004 14:56									#30
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Me too ... anyway. Today I feel way better than yesterday I think you can expect some major update tomorrow (maybe this day ....)

@ Lft Marks: The invasion of Norway takes place ... with some decent help of the events ... mind a hint? Not only Norway was invaded but also Denmark ...