19-03-2004 20:23									#1
	Some news Put an end to popups!

I've applied to join the CPU, if they'll have me. Anyone want to object to this?

I don't want to go over the reasons again, I just want to be buried in a ACDG grave with the other ACDG players.

* Jamski gets his AAA impact rifle ready to defend innocent CPU vs evil Hivedrone aggression *

-Jam

	19-03-2004 20:29									#2
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I'm sorry to hear that you've had some... issues... Jamski.

Also sorry you don't want to try and join PEACE

I think, though, that there needs to be some time or something... Tass and Goog need to talk with Hive and CPU about it, though I know I don't have a problem with it.

	19-03-2004 21:29									#3
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I have decided to leave my beloved Hive for Jamski. It is a heartrending decision for me. But I have to keep my promise. Jamski has tried all he could do (even include some dirty tactics that I do not approve of) for what he believed to be the right thing. I do not agree with him. But I admire his courage.

If it is decided that Jamski could join CPU, then I would apply to the PEACE. I hope the brave captains would be kind to accept me, even after I have ruined their chances many times because of my inexperiences and imcompetance.

	19-03-2004 23:25									#4
	Put an end to popups!

* Jamski gives HongHu a flower *

Any chance of Tass or Googlie popping by to give some input?

-Jam

	19-03-2004 23:51									#5
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Sure:

No.

	20-03-2004 00:09									#6
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Thanks god tass. I will abey your rule.

	20-03-2004 00:27									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar Sure: No.

Wasn't a turn wait limit installed anyway, or is this the first actual instance of something like this popping up?

Sorry to see that everything is degrading like this

	20-03-2004 00:29									#8
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Actually, the faction I joined first was the University however then I defected to the Hive
After I did that the people voted to not allow defections. They have a pretty good reason for doing so

	20-03-2004 00:38									#9
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Does this mean you are going to be with us to the end of days!?


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

* laurentius swallows the cyanide

	20-03-2004 00:40									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar Actually, the faction I joined first was the University however then I defected to the Hive After I did that the people voted to not allow defections. They have a pretty good reason for doing so

And now you're one of the gods anyway, so what's your point?

There was an official vote already? Would you mind digging up the thread, I'm at work or I'd do it. It's not that I don't doubt you, but I'd like to read what the 'official' question was, since I recall a lot of talk about there being a set amount of turns and then them having the option of joining a team.

You just seem to special of a case, Tass, that's all.

	20-03-2004 01:07									#11
	Increase Your PM Length

I'm not defecting to the CPU. I've left the Hive, now I've been invited to join the CPU. Simple.

If you're worried I'll give all the Hive plans to the CPU, I can do that anyway without you knowing about it. At least you could monitor what I post in the CPU forums, while anything else is out of your hands.

This is a ridiculous argument.

If the CPU are happy to accept me, then you should allow it Tass.

-Jam

	20-03-2004 01:42									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Jamski I'm not defecting to the CPU. I've left the Hive, now I've been invited to join the CPU. Simple.

Soviet intelligence officers never defectedp to America....They simply left the Soviet Union and were invited by the United States

quote: This is a ridiculous argument. If the CPU are happy to accept me, then you should allow it Tass. -Jam

Not relly.

And heres the poll which ironically was created by Jamski http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=86402

	20-03-2004 01:57									#13
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I can't remember if I voted for or against.

And without avoiding my point, Tassadar, what's stopping me telling the CPU everything I know anyway? I don't see how allowing me to join the CPU will be a "security risk" for the Hive.

-Jam

	20-03-2004 01:58									#14
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There's nothing to stop you from your own conscience.
However if I allow you to join CPU, it starts two things:

1. Anyone can join anyone else at any time regardless of where they are at now - It creates chaos
2. Psychologically it opens doors: Well I'm loyal to this factino now, so I guess it's ok to tell them....The Hive password!!!!

Not going to happen. Sorry

	20-03-2004 02:06									#15
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I'll tell them the Hive password anyway I mean, of course I'm not going to blatantly cheat.

-Jam

	20-03-2004 03:08									#16
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I will not comment on the issue at hand but in truth I think it should be a matter for the Human Hive to decide, Jamski poses a security risk if allowed to join another faction (and he does so regardless), since he was a member of the Hive it is fair to ask the Hive if they are willing to let him join another faction. That being said, I personally have no great objection, though my opinion does not count.

	20-03-2004 03:14									#17
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Perhaps time for a 3th trial, chairman?

IIRC people who pose a security threat in a police state are simply shooted...

	20-03-2004 03:19									#18
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quote: Originally posted by GeoModder Perhaps time for a 3th trial, chairman? IIRC people who pose a security threat in a police state are simply shooted...

Good point, time to dig up the People's Supreme Court.

	20-03-2004 03:24									#19
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And as an aside to HongHu - if Tass were to reconsider, we'd be happy to have you

...thought you'd have to stay with me just to ensure your safety among the crews....the captains are civil enough but our lads are easily er, excited

	20-03-2004 05:02									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Jamski If you're worried I'll give all the Hive plans to the CPU, I can do that anyway without you knowing about it. At least you could monitor what I post in the CPU forums, while anything else is out of your hands. -Jam

I fear you will really do so, Jam. In fact, I don´t have any objections against your plan to join the CPU, but I ask you not to disclose any of the Hive´s secrets to them.

Imagine something goes terribly wrong for us, and we don´t win the war that easily. The game might go on for another 20 to 30 turns, so it might then well be you who ruins the game for the rest of us.

Ok? Please try not to share Hive passwords, forum locations, plans and maps with those who are now enemies of our people, even if they´re not your people anymore...

Regarding HongHu:
It´s a double-strike for us to lose you, too. I am truly sad about this...
But then, there may be another DG soon

	20-03-2004 05:14									#21
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quote: Ok? Please try not to share Hive passwords, forum locations, plans and maps with those who are now enemies of our people, even if they´re not your people anymore...

Crazy I may be, but worry you not, I am no cheater. When are you joining us anyway, Micha?

-Jam

	20-03-2004 05:57									#22
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Jamski, HongHu...

You really did it??

You left the Hive!!
I'm compared to you guys, I have to admit.

I almost decided to make that step as well earlier this week, but you guys really did it. Well, but someone needs to play the last CPU turns.

But I can imagine this must have been a hard decision for both of you. I salute you and look forward to be in the same team if and when a new ACDG or whatever likewise game starts.

* GeoModder orders a double order for HongHu and Jamski desired drinks in the rec commons.

, comrades...

	20-03-2004 06:01									#23
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Well I had to really. I said I would leave if the Hive joined this meaningless dogpile war on the CyCon, so I did.

Call me stubborn, but I stick by things like that. And before some smartarse drags up a case where I changed my mind, don't bother, I know them all already .

-Jam

	20-03-2004 06:15									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Voltaire You know what, this is unfair. There seems to be this assumption that I am being some tyrant imposing my will on the Hive, fine frankly I really do not care what the perception is but it is just that, a perception. I merely follow the orders of the Hive, and yes I have my opinions as well and in this case they are in line with the majority, but I would follow the wishes of the Hive even if I were to disagree with them.

You misunderstood me, chairman. I did not refer to your RP in the forum, just to the animosity you and Jamski seem to have lately. You are a good roleplayer, if a bit too elaborate to my tastes.

quote: Originally posted by Jamski Well I had to really. I said I would leave if the Hive joined this meaningless dogpile war on the CyCon, so I did.

A gamer of his word...

Edit:

Drogue: Better this way

	20-03-2004 07:04									#25
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Geo: that was psted by Jamski, not Voltaire Scared me for a second

quote: Originally posted by Jamski If you're worried I'll give all the Hive plans to the CPU, I can do that anyway without you knowing about it. At least you could monitor what I post in the CPU forums, while anything else is out of your hands.

Actually, I would have to ask that you don't. I'd love for you to join us, but I don't condone cheating, and as such, I'd rather you didn't give us information, now you are no longer a Hive member.

As Tass said, defections are banned, for good reason. I'd love to have you in CPU, but alas, it cannot happen.

	20-03-2004 07:37									#26
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This issue was actually raised a while back, before I realised it was wrong to bring it up until Jamski asked for it himself. Also it just wouldn't be the same without Jamski.

Personally, I still think that Jamski should be allowed to join the CPU if he wants to. Things have changed since when allowing Jamski to join the Cycon was first raised and now there's actually secret information that shouldn't be leaked.

So make him wait 2 more turns so he doesn't have uptodate information, ask that he doesn't share things such as password and maps, and have buster post the hive turn in a private forum that only hive players can access.

Jamski has alot to offer, but unfortunately he really has been surpressed in the Hive and I could see a long time ago that wasn't likely to change.

I think this ACDG has really gone fairly badly.

First sign of trouble was when people laid down rules that made the CMN into a strictly policing role and hence nolonger fun for Googlie. He was a great personality and contributed to non-game discussions, but after the rule was laid down he had to shut up and be quiet.

Then to make it worse the arguing and recriminations of CMN rulings and wild accusations of cheating that started spreading between factions.

This was followed by teams falling apart, the University and the Hive. I'm still trying to get over a certain grudge over certain PMs that were directed at me that I felt were uncalled for.

This game shouldn't have been so rule oriented, and perhaps the winning objection should be balanced with some comprimises so the game is more fun. So I request that the original ruling of defections be overturned and replaced with a case by case decision.

quote: Jamski, HongHu... You really did it?? You left the Hive!!

Well if I remember correctly they've been talking about it almost as long as I had. *smirk*

*sigh* it won't be the Hive without you guys, at least for me. Strange that you two leaving would basically make me lose so much interest in the Hive as a faction.

	20-03-2004 07:41									#27
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Hey remember that time I was trying to explain that industry game I had come up and you two were busy spamming my rule discussion. I had an headache from reading something like 300 posts in 2 hours and I was shocked to find I had made over 100 posts in those 2 hours.

Happier DG days

	20-03-2004 07:58									#28
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Makahlua, thanks! I will remember to stick with you if I have a chance.

Geomodder, thanks too. But please remember unlike Jamski, I love my Hive. It is a team that I am proud of. Even if I can take refugee at PEACE I will not forget I am a Hiverian.

Micha, Voltaire, and all of my dearest comrades, I am as sad as you all are. My heart is bleeding. I had to leave you, but my heart always belongs to you. And who knows, maybe I will have a chance to join you again. I have been, and will always be your HongHu.

Kody, you are so pessimistic about this game. For me this game has been the greatest. I see so much interractions among people, each person has different personality, his ways of treating people and solving problems, I feel I learnt so much, and I feel blessed to know all these people, to love all these hearts. I see passion, I see persistence, I see kindness, I see nobleness. It is like the real life, only better. This just can't be matched from a game where all people gang together against some stupid AIs. I love this game. I love all people in this game. I love the Hive.

	20-03-2004 08:04									#29
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quote: Kody, you are so pessimistic about this game.

Yeah it's true isn't it.

But you love me as a pessimist so I don't feel the need to change.

	20-03-2004 08:15									#30
	Inflate your Upload Space

I don't see the problem with Jamski joining CPU, nor with HongHu joining PEACE. Both sides would be richer for the change. I do realise that - even without meaning to - they could inadvertantly let slip some information they are carrying from having been former Hive members, so the two-turn cooling down period is also a good idea.

Let us just hope they both have a faction to join in two turns...