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JohnT
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Capitalist
Mar 1999
time: 00:34
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Laura and I were at a restaurant today and the usual 2 year-old shenanigans were going on:
grabbing salt-shaker "MINE!!!!"
grabbing salt-shaker "No, Sophie."
unthwarted, grabs pepper shaker "MINE, DADA! MIINE!!!"
grabbing pepper-shaker "Sophie, No!"
grabs menu "Dis is mine, Dada. Pweeee?"
resigned "OK, Sophie, the menu is yours."
So, do this for about 20 straight minutes and you start to wonder (well, I do, anyway): How can any person argue that Communism can be a natural state of man? Given that even a 2 year old knows that something must be hers before it can fully benefit her, how can 22 year olds not understand this?
In short: how would've Marx handled the above scene?
grabbing salt-shaker "MINE!!!!"
grabbing salt-shaker "Child, the acceptance of the ideology of private property just plays in the hands of the capitalist oppressors."
unthwarted, grabs pepper shaker "MINE, DADA! MIINE!!!"
grabbing pepper-shaker "There is no property but what society allows you to have. The society I wish to raise my child in is just, one that has no property. Rather than it being *your* pepper shaker, Sophia, you'd be better off saying "Mine, Dada, by the good graces of the Neighborhood Soviet of pepper shaker manufacturers."
grabs menu "Dis is mine, Dada. Pweeee?"
resigned "Sophie, due to the fact that you seem to accept the communal role of property, you may play with the menu until a needier child comes along."
The point is that children are greedy, needful things who don't like to be thwarted. But Communism is all about the denial of personal wants and the unacceptability of private property, programs your child will not care for. Loudly. Vocally. For years.
So, how do you raise a kid to be a "natural" Communist? How do you get rid of the instinct of private property, of ownership? Assuming that the rest of the world is with you (so you can't counterargue that "society will screw with 'em"), how exactly can you eliminate the "need" to have?
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Comrade Tassadar
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We can't just assume the world is with them because the world isn't.
I've tried on my two children to raise them to be nice communistchildren. It failed in my oldest, but it seems to be suceeding in my youngest 
In my oldest I tried teaching him about collective ownership, industrialisation, etc however that failed. He's a capitalist 
However in my younger one I taught him about private property and (more importantly) about morality. I didn't force the ideology on him, instead I taught him about it.
I taught him that private property can be a good thing, but that collective ownership can also be a good thing and that greed indeed is one of the basic human emotions that must be fulfilled if one is to achieve higher thinking, however that this need must only be fulfilled ot the extent in which it is required: After that it is wasteful and immoral.
But one cannot expect results at 4  At that time children are not capable of higher intellectual reasoning and as such, you can't expect them to embrace any form of "utopian communism" (As impossible as it is).
I also taught him that educated men recognize their failings, however they also seek to overcome them whether those failings be a skill or whether they be dependence on the more basic emotions.
Thus he now realizes that true utopian communism wil take many thousnads of years in order to even be possible, however that all people must endeavour to achieve this state and propagate this idea. As more of the peoples become educated, this becomes more and more possible and we distance ourselves away from capitalism 
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Comrade Tassadar
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Perhaps its a revolutionary act against you, the capitalist, for denying the people what they rightfully deserve.
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Spiffor
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CPA - Evil Clone brigade
Nov 2001
time: 06:34
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Those commies who don't share the idea of utopic communism (on these boards, at least Azazel and myself) want to create a working system that takes human greedy nature into account. I suggest you to look at Az's and my posts in the latest Communism vs. Capitalism thread to see how we intend to work it out.
Last edited by Spiffor on 22-03-2004 at 04:22
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22-03-2004 02:22
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