07-04-2004 14:14									#31
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I think this'll be the last patch.
There are 2 bugs left over that are after all minor (eventhough some will say it's huge)

Mark my words.

	07-04-2004 14:26									#32
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Yeah, I remeber stories were people are trying to persuade me that 1.15 is last patch.

	07-04-2004 14:45									#33
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy I think this'll be the last patch. There are 2 bugs left over that are after all minor (eventhough some will say it's huge) Mark my words.

It's not just the bugs though..........experienced players will remember the tweaks made to PTW, ones that have been inexplicably lost in C3C. This in conjunction with a few balance tweaks would make the game what it should be.

	07-04-2004 14:46									#34
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....which has not yet been disproven.....1.22 is merely the official version of 1.15b. 1.20 was the abortive form that was finalised as 1.22.

At least, that's the way it seems to me. So now 1.22 is out, all bets are off and we need to convince them that another patch is warranted....or else 1.15/1.22 will indeed be the final patch.

[EDIT...I was responding to player1, but doc squeezed in before me )

	07-04-2004 14:50									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Doc It's not just the bugs though..........experienced players will remember the tweaks made to PTW, ones that have been inexplicably lost in C3C. This in conjunction with a few balance tweaks would make the game what it should be.

Agreed!

	07-04-2004 15:32									#36
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the changes to the tech tree is at least new

	07-04-2004 17:50									#37
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What tweaks (as opposed to bugfixes) are lost in C3C? I can't think of any offhand.

	07-04-2004 17:55									#38
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Barbs. AI city spacing. AI improvement behaviour. AI army use. Those are the main ones.

	07-04-2004 19:03									#39
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So why play conquests vs. PTW???

	07-04-2004 19:07									#40
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More traits. More civs. No RCP. No palace rank bug. Other successful tweaks.

	07-04-2004 23:24									#41
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Has anyone noticed whether the AI is once again using Armies with the latest patch? I'm not sure if I want to play the game if they aren't, it makes it to easy for me.

	07-04-2004 23:31									#42
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There's nothing about in the readme they released, and no talk of it. I'd presume not.

	07-04-2004 23:57									#43
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No RCP??? Dam, I kneed to keep poking around the forums....is there a quick reference on that somewhere?

	07-04-2004 23:58									#44
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Well it's not quick but Alexman's C3C corruption thread tells you all you need to know.

	08-04-2004 00:04									#45
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William I am sorry I haven't made my Mod available yet, I believe I promised sooner to someone than I am yet doing. I agree with you, however. In my mod I believe I have completed creating a very intense early-mid game experience. Replete with AI Armies crisscrossing back and forth with wide front etc. I have on more than one occasion been attacked on one city by two AI Armies each stacked with defensive units and many others round about. Great fun, good challenge. I am fine tuning tech and unit availability along the tree and moving toward seeing if I have succeeded in getting the AI's to use Siege units. Will see, takes time.

Of course all this would be a lot more straight forward if Firaxis got their act together and starting being a little more helpful. I hate to end again with any negativity, I seem to spill plenty about, however using something 'so close' yet... is also so frustrating.

	09-04-2004 06:39									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Antrine William I am sorry I haven't made my Mod available yet, I believe I promised sooner to someone than I am yet doing.

Well I know how you did it so I can always add it to my own game. Even still I'd have the advantage since I'd know it's better to use a Military Leader to create an Army rather than rush build a Spearman. I don't understand why they felt it necessary to tamper with that routine, it wasn't like the AI was going crazy building them before Conquests.

I really feel that the AI has become crippled now because of that. Awhile back I was playing the Middle Ages scenario and had 9 Armies in the field, after losing 2, and I didn't encounter a single one from the AI. After awhile it wasn't much of a challenge for me.

	09-04-2004 07:23									#47
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If anyone is interested. I'm part of several PBEMs, some are compatible with V1.22, but three of them are not. So I did some testing toinight and I'm including what I did to still be able to play in both v1.15 and v1.22 by interchanging.

Before upgrading to v1.22, make a folder called V1.15 in the Civilization directory (not the Conquests). Copy (not cut) EVERYTHING in the Conquests folder over to the V1.15 folder. Then use the patch upgrade to v1.22. Then make a folder called V1.22 in the Civilization directory. Copy (not cut) EVERYTHING that is now in the Conquests folder over to the V1.22 folder.

EDIT: If you have separate folders for 1.15 and for 1.22 then all you need to do is hit the .exe for 1.15 to go back to 1.15 to play that version. Then click on the 1.22 .exe file to go back to 1.22 Thanks to UnOrthOdOx for that.

Anyway, that seems like the easiest way to me to be able to switch between versions for now. If anyone has an easier way please say so.

Last edited by Rhothaerill on 09-04-2004 at 08:04

	09-04-2004 09:30									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Antrine ...Replete with AI Armies crisscrossing back and forth with wide front etc.

What did you do in the editor to make the AI build more armies?

	09-04-2004 10:01									#49
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Seen my thread? AI Armies in the Field really!

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...threadid=109636

In summary, which is better detailed there, however, the major points.

Set the Palace improvement to 1 Army every 15 turns.
Set good offensive units to come from at least these two city improvements, Barracks, and Arena or Collosiem.
I have Barracks put out Longbowman and Arena the Legionaire.
And I up the costs a lot, so it not feasible for Human or AI to build one in every city.
The next point also critical, but also changes game play a lot. Down grade all Great Wonders to Small Wonders. And they can all spit out units of course according to taste.
WHY THIS extreme change, because the AI's are doing to much, with too many victory conditions! Their powerful cities are wasted for ages, literally competing to build Great Wonders. And this in the very critical Capitol where the AI builds all its Armies. See the problem. Even when you give the AI Armies, it will move them to the Capitol, so save problems use the Palace for same. Additionally there must be offensive units in the capitol to stuff the Armies with. Well here again we have a problem, the AI favor 'defensive' units in the capitol, even to bring them there from all over it's empire. And lastly all is for naught so far as concerns early major wars when so much is wasted on Wonder building.

Well I hope I have been clear. But once these conditions are satisified, wahla, aggressive, offense unit packed AI Armies are used consistently and with a great deal of finese. So underneath it all the programming is sound concerning Armies.

Now with all this, it seems to me that Firaxis could at a CODE level that I of course am not privy to, adjust at least some of this. This would better preserve the Vanilla flavored game. For with these changes (which I very much like) the game plays much differently as one might imagine. And this requires a bunch of 'other' needful tweaks.

Sincerely,
Antrine who really cares, come on Firaxis, get your axis straight!!