22-04-2004 07:34									#1
	Massive Multiplayer Role Playing Games Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I have been searching the internet trying to find out what these are (MMPRPG or some similar acronym), but I have been having very limited success. The only game I have found that I recognize the title of is Everquest (which I know nothing about except the title).

Anyone care to point me in the right direction? (either with some links of with some names of good examples of the game?)

I am very intrigued by the concept, and would like to find out more, as my internet search has largely failed, I thought of Apolyton, as the most knowledgable group of gamers I know of

* Sparrowhawk looking for some help

	22-04-2004 08:16									#2
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MMORPG
Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Games.

http://www.mmorpg.com/ funnily enough should help you much in your search. Also, it links to various free or beta games, so you can get some first-hand experience of these types of games.

	22-04-2004 08:31									#3
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Thanks for the help Skanky

...though from what I have read so far....maybe better that I don't find out!!

	22-04-2004 09:02									#4
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Just remember to keep your addiction in check.

If you maintain your addiction long enough, you will be able to level up faster than the others and then get revenge for them killing you and looting you when you were a lower level.

	22-04-2004 12:48									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Yes, the main point of these things is that those who can play it about 40h per week tend to make the game suck for those who can't play much. Beware the addiction.

	22-04-2004 16:14									#6
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These games have ways to make it enjoyable for all, even the ones who spend less time. Granted if you want to be the galaxy's most powerful person you have to put the time in, but you can play if you don't. For example in Eve (quite popular space based game) you can set research for your character's skills which takes a set amount of time in real time. Thus the person playing all day has no advantage over you in that regard. You can also specialise in missions which your character can handle at a low level.

	22-04-2004 16:39									#7
	Put an end to popups!

Yes, the "addiction" is something to watch for. Alot MMORPGs are not so much played as invested in. But they can be alot of fun none-the-less.

I'd recomend DAOC, personally. I think it has a good mix of adventure, leveling, and PvPing. World of Warcraft is taking a similiar aproach, I think. Dark & Light (which is still in production) is looking to be perfect for the player who's interested in adventure and exploration. If you want to sit on your butt powerleveling all day, then Everquest is your game, and if you want nothing more than to PvP, Shadowbane is worth considering.

	22-04-2004 16:46									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

If you want a good idea of how crazy these games can get then please read this.
Some writer played mmorpgs for a year, and they were his only source of income.
He made a profit from selling imaginary stuff though.

	22-04-2004 16:46									#9
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I'm intrigued as to how PvP intensive games work. Do you just build a character and then fight other characters?

	22-04-2004 17:11									#10
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quote: Originally posted by DrSpike I'm intrigued as to how PvP intensive games work. Do you just build a character and then fight other characters?

The main differences are that 1) There's open PvP, of course. In games like everquest PvP is limited to special servers, which in turn end up having a much higher concentration of jerks and griefers.

and 2) character development is usually sped up. In Everquest, it takes somethign like 6 months for the average player to fully develop a character, but in Shadowbane it only takes a couple weeks, and less than that to get PvP ready since there's a curve in development where the higher you go the fewer returns you get. (In DAOC it takes about a month to get into the high-level PvP, but in the mean time there are special battlegrounds for mid-level characters to have fun in)

There's also some features added with the intention of encouraging PvP, like Shadowbane's much hyped Nation Building. But I think it was mostly a flop, since there really isn't much of a point to going to war outside of pissing matches. Cities only have one purpose - high level gear and trainers and only one requirement - gold. It just ends up making people camp monsters for gold to fund their cities (so that they can buy the high-end gear and camp monsters better) while their enemies try to tear it down and flush their hard-camped money down the toilet. Ends up being a pretty frustrating set up, i think.

	22-04-2004 17:26									#11
	Increase Your PM Length

So I can see why people would play these games, but exactly how the PvP works intrigues me, since I have never tried this genre in MP. Is the draw in skillful combat? I can see that doing quests and levelling etc is fun, but someone explain more about how a PvP fight works.

	22-04-2004 17:50									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

It varies from game to game. But just think about how combat usually works in an RPG and it's pretty much the same.


I'll use shadowbane as an example. The basics: You go into attackmode and target someone, your character starts swinging his weapon and doing his thing. How fast you swing, how often you hit, and how much damage you do are a result of your attributes and equipment. And then there are combat feats and spells, which add an element of "skill" or atleast player input to the combat. Warriros will have combat feats that increase damage, or powerblock (stoping their oponent from using any spells or feats) or stun, or reduce their defense or whatever. Well timed these can be devastating. Spells work in a similiar fashion, only their effects are more pronounced and they can be interupted if you are attacked during casting.

But things get much more complicated when there are groups of people, or sieges. In group vs. group co-ordination is key, and the side who focuses it's attacks most efficiently will usually win, even if outnumbered or out gunned. Voice chat is often use to call targets - they'll target certain classes first, like healers and 'nukers' and then run down the ladder of most threatening to least threatening. There are other sorts of tactics involved like warriors focusing on powerblocking the casters to prevent them from casting or assassins using their abilities to prevent a target from being healed while it's ganged up on. And then there are buffs and debuffs to take into account - a bard with the right group buffs up can swing the tide of battle.

PvP in shadowbane has turned into a sort of science... I personally liked it better when it was first released and everything was more easy going and ther was more roleplaying. Now there are rigoursly planned out character templates and horribly efficient methods of organization and powergaming that you have to adopt yourself if you want to compete.

	22-04-2004 18:00									#13
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In Dransik PvP was related to your stats (obviously), your weapon and your pots (healing potions). The draw is mainly from players who want to prove how "1337" they are by dominating lower-level players. Also, looting people is a very quick way to get better equipment.

	22-04-2004 22:42									#14
	Increase Your PM Length

The concept of Player versus Player doesn't interest me much, I am more interested in working with other players then fighting them.

It sounds like Dark Age of Camelot and Everquest are both in this mold, but what do those of you who have tried these games think are the best right now?

	22-04-2004 23:12									#15
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Personally, I'd avoid Everquest like the plague. Go for Dark Age of Camelot.



And if you want to try out some alternative MMOGs check out WW2 Online (A war sim) or Planetside (which is basically a gigantic game of Tribes).

	23-04-2004 00:43									#16
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I cant stand that "stand around, wait turns to whack each other and let random generator and stats decide how much to deal dmg" bullshit.

i mean where the hell is the fun in that. You already know whos gonna win before fighting cause theres absolutely no gameplay involved.... Oh my g0d, the creature is weak agst ice! t3h L337 strategy would be to use....... ICE!


Planetside was ok. I didnt like it too much, but it was enjoyable.

	23-04-2004 00:56									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I always wanted to try one of these. What's GOOD and FREE?

-Jam

	23-04-2004 01:04									#18
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Most of the good ones have a monthly subscription I think.

	23-04-2004 01:59									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Ok... what's ok and free?

I'm not paying a monthly sub, as I really can't afford or justify the cost

-Jam

	23-04-2004 02:13									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Sign up for a beta if you want to play free.


I think Lineage 2's open beta is still going. (It's made by an asian company and it's a bit of an anime style cute-fest. I couldn't stand it)

Ryzom has just started an open beta aswell, but I think you have to be a subsriber to fileplanet, or something.

Dark and Light is still in eary testing, and if you sign up now you should still have a chance of geting in later.

	23-04-2004 07:16									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Jam, the one I linked to has a whole list of games, many of which are in beta and all of which have been given ratings. Take a look there.

	23-04-2004 09:40									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Osweld... I just noticed the animation in your avatar!

*ahem* on topic, I kinda liked Lineage when I tried it out a while back... and every Korean I know swears by it.

	23-04-2004 11:49									#23
	Full PM-box? Change here!

just don't get Star Wars Galaxies.

They ****ed that game up.

Actually after many, many months and a lot of work, the game isn't too bad. But there's still nothing to do. There's no point to it. Just bash monsters and fight each other pvp.

but they finally got animal mounts and vehicles in it.

	23-04-2004 14:56									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Jamski Ok... what's ok and free? I'm not paying a monthly sub, as I really can't afford or justify the cost -Jam

Courtesy of duke translations inc

I couldn't take the chance of Mrs Jamski catching me paying to play mmorpgs.

	23-04-2004 16:46									#25
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Well considering I'd be using HER credit card...

Damm - you know me too well

-Jam

	23-04-2004 19:12									#26
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Any MMOG that has been out a while usually has a downloadable 1-2 week free trial. EVE, Horizons, Asherons Call 2, Anarchy online, Dark Age of Camelot, Everquest certainly did last time I looked.

	25-04-2004 01:18									#27
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I have now tried downloading the beta of Ryzom twice and both times been unable to complete the download (after several hours the first time downloading, and over an hour the second). A frustrating beginning, but I will continue to try.

	25-04-2004 01:51									#28
	Suffering from ads?

$10 a month isn't very expensive at all. It's only hard to justify when you have to pay full price to buy the game box & serial number, too. But I think some MMOGs might not be requiring that anymore... although I'm not sure.

	25-04-2004 08:20									#29
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The major problem is these types of games are only fun when you have massive amounts of free time, and you only have massive amounts of free time if you don't have a job. In that case, $10 a month is worth way more to you than to someone who works.

	25-04-2004 12:12									#30
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

$10 a month is too expensive.

Because in a rpg you want to keep your character around. You don't want him to die after you play just 2 months. You may want to pick him up again.

so in order to keep your character alive if you want to play him again, you have to keep paying.

compare this to Diablo2. Where it is free for them to store your character (just make sure to play once every 90 days). Often I take a few months off from the game, and can pick up my old character where he left off. And it's free!