18-05-2004 07:13									#1
	Should Apolyton be a Nuclear Free Zone? Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

This is more for gameplay reasons than for realism. There's nothing worse than a flame-war degenerating into nuclear holocaust.

The first two options are self-explanatory. Either nukes work in our region, or they don't. The third one takes a little more explaining... it goes like this:

You can say you have them, but if you use them, you are "disappeared" from the region.

For you, think Mutually Assured Destruction: In your universe, we all die.

For the rest of us, your nation is just occulted, in the same way that nations in this game disappear all the time. Our universe survives intact, and we can roleplay your collapse, or just pretend you never existed in the first place.

	18-05-2004 07:45									#2
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I think that chemical weapons and some bio-weapons could be allowed, but nukes, on the other hand, are a bit of a no...

	18-05-2004 08:30									#3
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Most certainly not. The Holy Empire of Iguana Fire detests this unnatural limitation on the Capitalist model and will protest it to the natural extent of the lobbying powers it possesses in this humble council.

Without nuclear weapons for defense, many of our fine nations will be defenseless and provided without a viable option in the face of million man armies supported by economically-poor and backward dictator-led leftist war-farms. The Holy Empire of Iguana Fire believes in a small, tightly controlled force equipped with the latest technology and supported by a combined force with maximum firepower.

The Empire will consider any positive action toward banning nuclear weapons as a threat to its very security.

-Minister of Defense Ivan Rothmyenko-Powdakov

	18-05-2004 08:35									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

This is an Out-of-Character game mechanics thread, but I appreciate the spirit of your post.

None of the options require or preclude any nuclear treaties.

	18-05-2004 10:10									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

if this is OOC . Then the answer is no ;..


if this is IC: Then Yes , auldonina supports the full removal of al lweopons of mass destruction....

	18-05-2004 12:57									#6
	Suffering from ads?

Yes. How are you supposed to have a nice big war with the threat of nukes always hanging over your head?

	18-05-2004 13:10									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

We like a nuke free zone ! But what is "ICBMs" ?

	18-05-2004 13:12									#8
	Tired of ads?

An ICBM is an Inter Continental Ballistic Missile, usually used to fire nukes at very long ranges.

	18-05-2004 13:29									#9
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I vote the "Yes...but with erasure threat" option.

Unless both nations agree that nukes can be used against each other, then it should be this option. If I agree to be "nuked" and the other nation agree's on my retaliation, then I'm all for it.

But if one nation uses a nuke without the consent of the other, then Erasure should be the obvious sanction.

	18-05-2004 14:35									#10
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Frankychan I vote the "Yes...but with erasure threat" option. Unless both nations agree that nukes can be used against each other, then it should be this option. If I agree to be "nuked" and the other nation agree's on my retaliation, then I'm all for it. But if one nation uses a nuke without the consent of the other, then Erasure should be the obvious sanction.

I agree.

	18-05-2004 15:01									#13
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

nukes are not required to party

and party is what we do best

	18-05-2004 16:38									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

paddy, Audlonina need your transport ships and a small flotilla to protect them ...

	18-05-2004 20:57									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

No to poll, yes to nukes. Let MAD be the standard.

	18-05-2004 21:56									#16
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

The problem with MAD is that there is no game mechanism to bring about the destruction. Option 3 provides it. For the nuker, the region is detroyed. Good job, take a bow. The rest of us will play on.

	18-05-2004 22:05									#17
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by joncha The problem with MAD is that there is no game mechanism to bring about the destruction.

Well, I voted for option 3 myself, but I think many would argue that the whole point of MAD was that nobody ever did bring about the destruction.

	18-05-2004 22:10									#18
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

But with no destruction in the game (unlike RL) there's no deterent!

	18-05-2004 22:13									#19
	Support Apolyton

Good point.

Besides it is pretty stupid and pretty crazy to be spending billions and billions on weapons you hope you'll never use only to try to make sure they won't be used, now isn't it?

I mean, if that is your reason for having them, it would be a lot cheaper and a lot easier and a lot better for all concerned to just not have such weapons in the first place.

The problem is... once something is invented, it can never be un-invented, and potential enemies tend not to trust each other all that much...

	19-05-2004 06:10									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Well there should certainly be a game mechanism/rule to enforce the effects of nuclear war, but I think option 3 is not flexible enough. Firstly, what about the country that is attacked? Most countries that possess nuclear weapons won't respond to a nuclear attack by simply ignoring it.

It takes a truly devastating nuclear attack to actually destroy a country, most states with a reasonable amount of stability could pull through a limited nuclear assault. So, removing any country that uses nukes is silly. Simply account for the appropriate amount of damage inflicted on all parties in the exchange, taking into account the individual factors, such as numbers, yield, etc., determined by consensus if possible, by OOC court if necessary.

	19-05-2004 06:16									#21
	Support Apolyton

i think we allow the nukes and we role play the devastation casued by it, but the initiator is kicked from the game .. no longer allowe din apolyton..

	19-05-2004 06:25									#22
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Does that go for "x-bombs" too?

	19-05-2004 06:57									#23
	Got spare money?

well unless any rules get posted soon about that occurance the hive is about to be toast !!!!

	19-05-2004 06:59									#24
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Would this also outlaw EMP-Bombs?

	19-05-2004 13:32									#25
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Rasputin well unless any rules get posted soon about that occurance the hive is about to be toast !!!!

In that case, I suppose Auldoninna is about to be toast also...

	19-05-2004 18:03									#26
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

well if im toast for repsonding to a first strike, then what is the world coming tooo...

if you nuke me for nuking him then are you toast too >?>>>

	19-05-2004 18:48									#27
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Didn't say I was going to nuke you, but the Hive has a nuclear arsenal larger than yours, I do believe...

I'm afraid your little islands are about to get even smaller...

	20-05-2004 03:51									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by DarkCloud Would this also outlaw EMP-Bombs?

Not sure about that. Doesn't an EMP bomb just scramble electronic devices?

	20-05-2004 08:25									#29
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

and renders them unusable for ever.
Unless someone builds a shielded cage around it.

	20-05-2004 08:39									#30
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Don't worry, the Hive has a surplus of "x-shields" they might be willing to sell you.