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Drake Tungsten is offline Drake Tungsten
Prince
Knee deep in alien womyn...
Oct 2001
time: 14:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:10
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OK, I need people more skilled in economic matters than me to help me sort through the BS sometimes...

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:13 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Argos65987


You can live next door to Alec Baldwin.


DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
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AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:13
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GePap seems to be fighting for Roland's now vacant position. We just need to get him frothing at the mouth about Greenspan and we could start calling him Roland 2.0

Drake Tungsten is offline Drake Tungsten
Prince
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Oct 2001
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  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:14
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Eh, why bother?

DanS is offline DanS
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Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
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  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:14 Visit DanS's homepage!
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Another good sign is that productivity of American workers is holding up fairly well also. 3.8% growth annualized in the 1st quarter.

That will hit American workers' pocketbooks favorably soon.

JohnT is offline JohnT

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Capitalist
Mar 1999
time: 00:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:16
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Yeah, I don't get it either Drake. We have seen, felt, and been told that the economic numbers attained from 1999-2000 (appx) were not only unrealistic but unhealthy, the sort of economic indicators that point to an inevitable decline. However, we are now being told that the inability to re-achieve previously-unhealthy goals "isn't good enough."

I bet a lot of people would be shocked to re-learn that starting from August 1974 it would be another 13 and a half years, until April of 1988, before this country saw unemployment rates as low as 5.6%. Even the Kennedy years had more months of >=5.6% (25) unemployment than <5.6% (7). If you want to run an economy, find out Eisenhowers secret - his highest unemployment rate was 7.5% his lowest was 2.5%.

At worst, unemployment-rate wise, you can say this is an average economy, and recession wise, it was below-average.

You can get the figures here. Just click on "Unemployment Rate (Seasonally Adjusted)" and retrieve the data. The table allows you to go back to 1948 - earlier information would require books. Also, click on "include graphs" for a graph of the unemployment rate.

Last edited by JohnT on 05-06-2004 at 00:21

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
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  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:17
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quote:
Originally posted by DinoDoc
GePap seems to be fighting for Roland's now vacant position. We just need to get him frothing at the mouth about Greenspan and we could start calling him Roland 2.0


Any of you gents care to challenge the fact that payrolls are lowet today than at the end of 2000?

Drake Tungsten is offline Drake Tungsten
Prince
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Oct 2001
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  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:19
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quote:
Any of you gents care to challenge the fact that payrolls are lowet today than at the end of 2000?


Why challenge it? It's a stupid comparison; just look at JohnT's post for the reason.

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:23
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quote:
Originally posted by JohnT

I bet a lot of people would be shocked to re-learn that starting from August 1974 it would be another 13 and a half years, until April of 1988, before this country saw unemployment rates as low as 5.6%. Even the Kennedy years had more months of >=5.6% (25) unemployment than <5.6% (7). If you want to run an economy, find out Eisenhowers secret - his highest unemployment rate was 7.5% his lowest was 2.5%.

You can get the figures here.


Only those that don;t know much.

Lets stop the bullshit. The point of this thread is to state that the economy is "roaring" and that bush will reap political benefits from it-just as every single DanS jobs thread has been.

And you guys know what? DanS was wrong month one, he was wrong month 2, he will probalby be wrong this month, and that is a sad track record.

People measure things in relation-it does not matter that 20 years ago the average unemployment rate was higher-4 years ago it was much lower and that is what carries political heft. The high price of oil and its pressure on consumers will stick in minds more than the jobs numbers, since all Americans feel that instantly. Crime today is far far lower than 10 years ago-and yet people still demand even tougher crime prevention: why? preception.

Will bush get a political boost with swing voters with this? He hasn;t the last two months, and unless other news stops getting billing, he won't. So again, danS was wrong in April, he was wrong in may, and he will be wrong in June. How is that for a three month track record?

Drake Tungsten is offline Drake Tungsten
Prince
Knee deep in alien womyn...
Oct 2001
time: 14:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:26
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quote:
it does not matter is 20 years ago the average unemployment rate was higher-4 years ago it was much lower


Actually, the current unemployment rate is lower than the average annual unemployment rate in every year of Clinton's term. The average annual unemployment rate hasn't been as low as the current unemployment rate since 1989...

quote:
Will bush get a political boost with swing voters with this? He hasn;t the last two months, and unless other news stops getting billing, he won't. So again, danS was wrong in April, he was wrong in may, and he will be wrong in June. How is that for a three month track record?


The economic news won't stay buried forever, despite what you may wish.

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
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Feb 2001
time: 00:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:31
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Notice how as soon as GePap is completely pwned on whether or not the economy has "rip roaring growth", he pretends he wasn't arguing about that at all and that it was all about whether Bush would gain politically from it...

Drake Tungsten is offline Drake Tungsten
Prince
Knee deep in alien womyn...
Oct 2001
time: 14:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:33
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Tired of ads?

It's somewhere around his fourth topic change of the thread, so I can't say I'm surprised...

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
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Feb 2001
time: 00:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:34
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quote:
Originally posted by GePap
Lets stop the bullshit.


Yes, let's.

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Kucinich
Notice how as soon as GePap is completely pwned on whether or not the economy has "rip roaring growth", he pretends he wasn't arguing about that at all and that it was all about whether Bush would gain politically from it...




One, your point was patheticaly wrong, so, what do you speak of?

None of you Bushketeers have answered the simple question, so whatever. (I think your name has gotten to you)

quote:

Actually, the current unemployment rate is lower than the average annual unemployment rate in every year of Clinton's term. The average annual unemployment rate hasn't been as low as the current unemployment rate since 1989...




Speaking about lie being told, from JohnT's link:

1998 4.6 4.6 4.7 4.3 4.4 4.5 4.5 4.5 4.6 4.5 4.4 4.4

The highest being 4.7, the lowest 4.4. Explain to me math genius Drake how then average of those could be higher than 5.6?


quote:
The economic news won't stay buried forever, despite what you may wish.


What are the two indicators average joe gets daily on TV? Stock numbers, and generally also now price of Gas. If by October, gas per gallon is still at a national avergae of $1.80, people won't give a damned. Oh, and the markets remain below were they were in 2000-that will also remain there.

DanS is offline DanS
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Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:39 Visit DanS's homepage!
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I just think it's fun to bust the left's balls on the fact that they are so morose about good economic growth. It's comical.

During Clinton's presidency, I never heard any Republican looking the gift horse in the mouth with regard to economic growth.

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
It's somewhere around his fourth topic change of the thread, so I can't say I'm surprised...


Actually, no, the topic remain what DanS made it: how much will bush reap politically from this. If anyone is trying to be disingenous about things it is you Drakie Poo.

Any more lies to tell?

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:42
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quote:
Originally posted by DanS
I just think it's fun to bust the left's balls on the fact that they are so morose about good economic growth. It's comical.

During Clinton's presidency, I never heard any Republican looking the gift horse in the mouth.


They were too busy Impeaching him.

In fact, I don;t remember any repugs crediting Clinton for that either...

Get is straight DanS-you can;t DanS the point of a thread, even if you do it to posts all the time. You started this, like you did in April and in may, to extol how Bush would benefit from this (this time you were even more blatant than before)-you were wrong in April and in may (his approvals are lower today)-why on earth would you be right now?

DanS is offline DanS
Emperor
Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:44 Visit DanS's homepage!
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Bush will benefit from this good payroll growth over time. Do you seriously think he won't?

I can guarantee that everybody in the Kerry camp knows this will benefit Bush. Big time.

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
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Feb 2001
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  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:44
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quote:
Originally posted by GePap
One, your point was patheticaly wrong, so, what do you speak of?


My point that growth can occur even if you aren't at a peak?

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:45
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Oh, and to pile on drakes little Lie "but of course, he only speaks the truth!"

From 2000, again from JohnT's site:

2000 4.0 4.1 4.0 3.8 4.0 4.0 4.0 4.1 4.0 3.9 3.9 3.9

So tell me again, if you can, how the average unemployment each year of clinton's term was higher than what it is today?

GePap is offline GePap
King
of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Kucinich


My point that growth can occur even if you aren't at a peak?


I misread your post-though, of course, you mislread mine cause I said the same thing

DanS is offline DanS
Emperor
Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
time: 00:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:46 Visit DanS's homepage!
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Tired of ads?

Now he's accusing people of lieing.

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:52
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quote:
Originally posted by DanS
Bush will benefit from this good payroll growth over time. Do you seriously think he won't?

I can guarantee that everybody in the Kerry camp knows this will benefit Bush. Big time.


Wrong-and you are wrong becuase it is too late.

There was a recovery going on when Poppa got bounced too.

Iraq will dominate the news, thanks to Bush own timetable. The Transfer of power and the high price of oil will dominate the summer, leaving Bush a very small widow in september and October. If the summer was bad, he won;t get to recover.

Verto is offline Verto

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Mar 2002
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  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:53
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quote:
Originally posted by GePap


Wrong-and you are wrong becuase it is too late.

There was a recovery going on when Poppa got bounced too.



H.W. Bush was not running against John Kerry, who can't even get the Democrat party behind him.

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:54
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quote:
Originally posted by DanS
Now he's accusing people of lieing.


Do you read the thread DanS?

Drake accused me of lying becuase I said thee last recession recovery was in 1984. I was wrong, he said I lied.

Then he says something patently false. I just wanted to show him the cold, hard proof he was dead wrong

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 00:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Verto



H.W. Bush was not running against John Kerry, who can't even get the Democrat party behind him.


Poppa didn;t jhave oil at record heights and 140,000 troops getting shot at a year after declaring "mission accomplished".

DanS is offline DanS
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Kickball Capital of the World
Jan 1970
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quote:
There was a recovery going on when Poppa got bounced too.


In 1992 before the elections, the economy created 800,000 jobs.

In 2004, the economy has already created 1.1 million jobs.

We've still got 5 months of good growth ahead of us.

GePap is offline GePap
King
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Nov 2001
time: 23:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 01:04
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quote:
Originally posted by DanS


In 1992 before the elections, the economy created 800,000 jobs.

In 2004, the economy has already created 1.1 million jobs.

We've still got 5 months of good growth ahead of us.


Bush has 5 months to erase the masisve job losses, which go far beyond those Poppa faced-Bush is still in a job hole over the 3.5 years.

Add to that international tensions, Iraq and Oil prices, all things Poppa did not have to deal with as extensively, and as I said before, Bush will run out of time-only so many stories get reported-more jobs has stiff and serious competition.

DanS is offline DanS
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quote:
Bush has 5 months to erase the masisve job losses


Looks like he may well successfully do that. Which means, of course, that we're having massive job gains.

There's a rhetorical symmetry here.

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
Emperor
Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:36
  Old Post 05-06-2004 01:07
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