14-07-2004 20:30									#181
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If a beggar gives you **** after you put a quarter in his cup because it wasn't a dollar, you should do your best retrieve that quarter, or, failing that, not give any money to him in the future. Self respect demands it.

	14-07-2004 20:33									#182
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Whining bastards I assume.

You mean DanS's rant was directed at himself?!

	14-07-2004 20:36									#183
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Hey, I'm no bastard! (Or at least no rat bastard.)

	14-07-2004 22:02									#184
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Well, I have had no sleep in almost 24 hours, but I just don't see your point. I'm simply saying that while one may have a reasonable expectation of not getting AIDs in the US, even without using a condom, that expectation doesn't exist in much of Africa. As a result, one can have a lot of unprotected sex in the US without getting sick, which would be virtually impossible elsewhere in the world. I believe this line of argument started when someone (forget who) used the phrase "reasonable expectation" of being able to have sex, or something like that.

It started with your claim that you're smarter than people who carry on having unprotected sex despite a high probability of contracting AIDS. I replied that if smarter is defined as valuing risk minimization over sexual gratification, yes. You then said that this was "stupid" - it was about avoiding death, not minimizing risk. I'm still trying to see what distinction you're making between minimizing risk and trying and avoiding death, since risk being minimized in context is the risk of death.

quote: And I was rebutting those reasons.

You've demonstrated that you don't agree with those reasons. Thanks, we knew that already. You've not even tried to defeat them by their own terms.

quote: Then why don't you tell me? Perhaps because it would make my point?

You don't have a point.

quote: Hehe, and here I thought we were arguing "should", rather than "is".

That's hardly my problem.

quote: In that case, the US policy is abstinence, because the powers that be decided it should be. Tough luck, end of discussion.

Tell Bush and the Christian Right (tm):

quote: Under the influence of the Christian right, Bush has adopted the so-called ABC approach to Aids prevention - A for abstinence, B for being faithful and C for condoms. But condoms are to be promoted only for use by 'high risk groups' such as prostitutes and drug abusers, with sexual abstinence the objective for all unmarried young people.

quote: And for that matter, WRT Africa, the powers that be have decided that I DON'T have to pay for their condoms, apparently.

BTW, you also get to pay for the retrovirals for those who've already got HIV infections.

	14-07-2004 23:03									#185
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"Under the influence of the Christian right, Bush has adopted the so-called ABC approach to Aids prevention - A for abstinence, B for being faithful and C for condoms. But condoms are to be promoted only for use by 'high risk groups' such as prostitutes and drug abusers, with sexual abstinence the objective for all unmarried young people."

Jebus Chryst, that means my characterisation of the way Bush and co. "promote" the ABC method is entirely accurate. I'm scared that I can predict the worst Republican behaviour so skilfully

	14-07-2004 23:40									#186
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summary

	14-07-2004 23:40									#187
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summary

the ABC approach, used in Uganda, has reduced the rate of HIV infection.

per the Guttmacher quotes, other ABC approaches, with slightly more emphasis on the C, may be just as effective.

Theres no evidence of an approach that more effective than the Uganda approach.

Social Conservatives in the US would like an AB approach only, but thats not admin policy.

Ergo a lot of people arguing over nothing in particular.

OTOH, the real criticism of the current approach, is NOT how much emphasis it gives to one element or another, but that NOT ENOUGH is being spent overall.

	14-07-2004 23:44									#188
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double-posts don't make you anymore sexy

	14-07-2004 23:50									#189
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I might add that I know for a fact that condom use was pushed heavily in Uganda under its ABC policy. A good friend of mine did Peace Corps work there and described to me the myriad of condom ads paid for by Uncle Sam.