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I'mNowCivilized
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Ok, before I get into the nitty gritty of the game, I thought I would post my initial setup. Please advise as to any changes that seem appropriate. Thanks.
I. Choose Your World
World Size: Standard
Barbarians: Roaming
Land Mass and Water Coverage: Continents (70% Water)
Climate: Normal
Temperature: Temperate
Age: 3 Billion
II. Player Setup
Me: Egypt
Them: 7 Random Rivals
Game Limits: Changed Turns to 1000. Everything else remains at default
Rules:
Allow Domination Victory
Allow Space Race Victory
Allow Diplomatic Victory
Allow Conquest
Culturally Linked Starting Loc
Allow Cultural Conversions
Allow Scientific Leaders
AI Agression: Normal
Difficulty: Warlord
There's what my set up looks like. Unless you see any changes I should make. I'll be back with some turn saves. Thanks.
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I'mNowCivilized
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Ok, I followed all the suggestions. Switched my civ to France and founded my first city. The city I founded seemed like a pretty good location so I didn't move, I just settled the spot where my settler started out in.
So here's a screen shot of my first action. Hopefully I resized it properly.
And with any luck my first decision wasn't a bad one.
 Attachment: france4000bc.jpg
This has been downloaded 123 time(s).
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I'mNowCivilized
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Ok, that looks a little big. How do I reduce it?
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I'mNowCivilized
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quote:
Originally posted by Krill
quote:
The city I founded seemed like a pretty good location so I didn't move |
Seemed?
4 turn settler pump potential? that will be needed to go through the jungle. |
"4 turn settler pump potential?" Ok, what do you mean?
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Krill
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On a cold wet rock, in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.
Dec 2003
time: 05:35
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Basically, if you build a granary in that city, and irrigate the wheat and cow, you will have +5 food per turn. That means growth every 2 turns. If you have enough pop to work another mined bonus grassland, and a mined grassland next to the river, you will have enough shields and food to grow twice, and to also create a settler in those four turns.
(effectivly, start at 4 pop, work the wheat, cow, BG, and mined river grass, for +6spt. You get an extra 2 shields when you grow, because the city govener places the new labourer on the forest, because food is calculated before shields in the turn order. you get 6 shields on turn 1, 8 on turn 2, 7 on turn 3 (move the labourer to another mined river grass manually) and 9 on turn 4 = 30 shields)
voila, 4 turn settler pump.
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I'mNowCivilized
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ah, I see. Thanks.
And how many turns should it take to produce a settler? What's a good rate? And more important what do I do to fix this?
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I'mNowCivilized
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The only thing, in order to irrigate the cow, I am going to have to clear out some of that jungle that's on the the bank of the river closest to the cow. Should I get started on that or irrigate the wheat first?
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Krill
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On a cold wet rock, in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean.
Dec 2003
time: 05:35
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build a warrior, warrior, worker, granary. the first worker should head south (move 9, road then irrigate, move 1 then irrigate, then mine the BG) the 2nd worker can head north (move7, road then irrigate, 8 then irrigate, then mine the BG)
And that is forest on the banks of the river, not jungle...
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Solomwi
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Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Dec 2002
time: 23:35
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BAH! Move 6 and nail down that tobacco! I'd agree with UnO on moving 4, but mainly because I despise those 1f coastal tiles. Of course, tight enough city spacing will allow at least one to be worked by a coastal city.
My worker choice would be to move 7, mine the tile, then road it, giving Paris one fully developed tile to work after seven turns (1 to move, 2 to road, 4 to mine), then move 9 to irrigate the grassland. Roading isn't important on the grassland, since you should get your second citizen down to the cow (growth and culture expansion will be simultaneous and that will be a 2f2s tile before improvement, giving you a 2 turn worker, and can be moved to the wheat in the second turn for food, since the 2 shields will be excess), and already have a road leading to the wheat on the BG. Irrigation takes 3 (somebody correct me if this is wrong) turns for France, so your second worker will already be south to mine a BG when you're done. Move worker 1 to the wheat, irrigate and road, then move him down for a forest chop (2,2) to help your granary and allow water to the cow.
Crap, the 2 turn worker bit relies on the second warrior taking five turns, which it won't once the mine is up in turn 5. I'd insert another warrior into the queue before the worker, but I'm not a dirty stinking builderer  . I'm at a bit of a loss what to do with those two turns otherwise. The borders still won't have expanded, so working the wheat for food is out of the question. You could always move off the BG, but that's counterproductive, as it costs you the road commerce. As distasteful as it is, two turns of wealth would be a small help, and keep that thrid warrior from costing you unit support until you found your second city.
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Dominae
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quote:
Originally posted by vmxa1
I have not calculated it out, but my instincts suggest to road and irrigate the grass and then the wheat. Now I do not have to do anything to the grass for a long time as it will wait until I have mined those BG tiles. By then I can afford to mine the original grass with the workers I will be adding into the city anyway.
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This is probably what I would do, too. Your Food output is both higher and achieved faster this way than the Cattle route. This is worth a little lost Worker efficiency. After a Warrior, the capital would build a second Worker which would chop the Forest on the way down to the Cattle, adding the 10 Shields to a Granary.
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I'mNowCivilized
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Maybe I'll Start over from the 4000 BC save, because this is where I am at at 350 BC.
I also have the following resources that aren't visible because there are cities on them.
Chartes has Tobacco
Iron under Rheims and Tours
Horses under Lyon
Incense under Rouen
I didn't want to put Tours right on the horses but Arabia declared war 1 turn before I was planning on do settling it. They had 5 warriors I had 2 warriors and a spearman, plus my settler. I figured my best chance of not losing everything plus losing the horses was to go right there.
Attachment: france350bc.jpg
This has been downloaded 88 time(s).
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I'mNowCivilized
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and here's the part of my civ that's off map in the first one
Attachment: france350bca.jpg
This has been downloaded 87 time(s).
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Solomwi
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Don King of the Apolyton HLA Movement
Dec 2002
time: 23:35
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Six things stand out.
First, your city spacing is very loose. C-x-x-C with the occasional C-x-x-x-C is my preference, but C-x-x-x-C should be a maximum. I would have founded Marseilles 2 of where it is, both to keep tighter spacing and to take advatage of the river growth bonus. Your southern cities look good, so I can only guess this was in response to the jungle. You can put another city 8 of the wheat to good effect, and let it crank out workers to start clearing jungle. Generally, instead of tramping through the jungle, I'll tighten up my spacing to C-x-C in places to take advatage of banana tiles and work my way north. With Germany so close, the Lyons border check isn't bad, as long as you backfill.
Second, Avignon is at size 3 and building a temple, when it could kick out a settler to found next to that incense. Focus on culture in that city and take the incense from Germany. You can switch now without wasting any shields.
Third, you're overirrigated. There's no reason to irrigate that BG at Rheims-77. Under despotism, you lose the extra food anyway. Other than getting water to Orleans, which can wait until much later, there's no reason for any of those grass tiles to be irrigated. Mine them and get some shields.
Fourth, your military is a) almost all regular and b) evenly spread out. Keep a couple of swords in the south until you claim all the land, and move everything else to the German border. That's where the threat is. You may not want to fight, but just like in the real world, Germany doesn't have a history of letting France live peacefully. Marseilles and Paris are not under any threat, so keep one warrior if you need an MP in Marseilles, and get the spears north.
Fifth, you need more workers. Use Marseilles to pump them out until happiness is restored without MPs and kill two birds with one stone (don't forget to try the lux slider if you're using entertainers). Whatever you do, get the worker force up. One per city is a good rule of thumb.
Sixth, forget about the Great Library. Paris can be put to much better use building workers, settlers, improvements and units to take the inevitable fight to Germany.
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Theseus
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The warmonger formerly known as rpodos. Gathering Storm! Apolyton Spirit!!
Apr 2002
time: 00:35
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Some other random comments (Solomonwi's were quite good):
* Paris: Hmmm, one tile in from the coast is generally not preferred. Either move 1 to be on the coast (and go for the Colossus, which is one of the few Ancient GWs advisable for a capitol), or 9 up the river, for a somewhat more central and more productive location (i.e., Paris cannot as located build harbors, and thus two tiles are relegated to 1F1G).
* Why is Paris777 improved? Maybe a road, OK, for a future city, but the mine?
[SIDENOTE: Do you understand the navigation system we are using? It is basically the numeric keyboard... move '9' for NW [EDIT: NE, of course], for instance.]
* I look to my continental extremities in desiging my CP plan... thus, the SE point where the Barbs are would be a no-brainer for me, and thus I would have placed Rouen elsewhere, to end with at least a CxxC spacing (on the other hand, I am, errr, known for tight spacing, so given what you've done so far I would STILL consider a city where the Barbs are).
* Also about Rouen: Being NEXT to an unroaded lux is useless...
* You have THREE iron? At this size of empire? Hey, if you are that lucky, go find a Tank and attack it with a Spearman. 
___________
That said, you just need to get a handle on a couple of the things we've mentioned, and I can tell you are inches away from a huge leap in your gameplay. Take that 10 city empire you'e built, and tweak it the way that we are advising, and you will be well on your way to mastering the early game... and that is the ticket! 
* Theseus remembers ducki... wipes a tear. 
Seriously, you are on the cusp. Don;t get me wrong, there's a bunch you've gotta learn to do (WORKERS! ROADS!), but you are definitely on the right track.
For the AU crowd watching... doesn;t this seem, I dunno, deserving of a lesson? I sorta feel like cracker at CFC did the lesson before this, but then the next thing is to take that 10-city empire to the next level?
Last edited by Theseus on 28-07-2004 at 09:42
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27-07-2004 23:17
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