31-07-2004 06:57									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia heres my plan 1. the bottom 50% of america (using the median income) pays 0% income taxes

Already done: http://www.irs.ustreas.gov/pub/irs-soi/00in01rt.xls

Check out G:149

	31-07-2004 06:57									#62
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Well, if we aren't prepared to take power, fascism is indeed a real threat from capitalism.

I don't think anyone is prepared to take power, but do you think the fascist will be prepared before us? In Germany, it was really a special case I think.

	31-07-2004 08:24									#63
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I myself prefer use taxes over income taxes- tax consumption, NOT income. Obviously various things, like luxuries, entertainment, vices, stocks and so forth would be taxed as all different levels. I would keep things like property taxes though.

	31-07-2004 08:43									#64
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I prefer only 3 taxes - on profit, rent, and interest, 100%.

	31-07-2004 09:34									#65
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat No, they just provide some extra employment for trust and estate lawyers and find ways to make tax-free transfers.

I mentioned this to Ming but he seemed to think estate taxes were still theft. I guess he has a point. All taxes are theft but they are theft for the common good and a necissary evil.

	31-07-2004 09:58									#66
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quote: Tax does have a name, and it's: ESTATE TAX

Tha Patriot Act has a name too, that doesn't mean it's patriotic. Politicians always give their legislation nice sounding names to distract from what they're doing... It's a DEATH tax! It's a tax on people who die, the fact it only applies to people who've acquired a certain level of wealth is irrelevant. Someone on your side argued that since only some people who die pay the tax, it can't be a death tax. Well, not everyone with an estate pays the tax either, so it can't be an estate tax.

Real simple: it's a tax on people who die. You don't die, you don't pay the tax... You don't use tobacco, you don't pay tobacco taxes - but that's still a tobacco tax. The fact the tax is imposed selectively means nothing...

	31-07-2004 10:49									#67
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Real simple: it's a tax on people who die. You don't die, you don't pay the tax... You don't use tobacco, you don't pay tobacco taxes - but that's still a tobacco tax. The fact the tax is imposed selectively means nothing...

Tobacco tax is suppose to discourage you from using tobacco. According to your logic, 'death' tax must be designed to descourage you from dying.

I don't give a **** if we tax people for dying actually.

	31-07-2004 11:47									#68
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It isn't "according to my logic", I'm not the one who (allegedly or sincerely) wants high taxes on tobacco to discourage tobacco use. You're confusing the logic of politicians with mine and acting like I'm responsible for their desire to discourage tobacco use.

And of course you don't care, I'd bet you would be robbing graves if it was legal.

	31-07-2004 16:20									#69
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Me thnks you have your terms confused. The median is higher than the mean, i.e., most folks make less than the average wage.

If most people make less than the mean average then the median income is lower than the mean, almost by definition.

	31-07-2004 17:43									#70
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Tha Patriot Act has a name too, that doesn't mean it's patriotic. Politicians always give their legislation nice sounding names to distract from what they're doing... It's a DEATH tax! It's a tax on people who die, the fact it only applies to people who've acquired a certain level of wealth is irrelevant. Someone on your side argued that since only some people who die pay the tax, it can't be a death tax. Well, not everyone with an estate pays the tax either, so it can't be an estate tax. Real simple: it's a tax on people who die. You don't die, you don't pay the tax... You don't use tobacco, you don't pay tobacco taxes - but that's still a tobacco tax. The fact the tax is imposed selectively means nothing...

Someone who is dead can NOT pay taxes- they are dead and no longer a person. I went over with Sky why this facile arguement is just that. Don;t repeat the same dumb arguements that have been refuted already...

	31-07-2004 17:55									#71
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quote: Someone who is dead can NOT pay taxes- they are dead and no longer a person.

Liberals have found a way to tax the dead.

quote: I went over with Sky why this facile arguement is just that. Don;t repeat the same dumb arguements that have been refuted already...

And your "refutation" was? Oh yeah, since you and some politicians call it an "estate" tax, it can't be a death tax. Of course, estates aren't taxed until the owner dies. So it's really a death tax, not an estate tax.

	31-07-2004 18:12									#72
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A thesis disproved by reality, Kuci.

Rather like Communism, then, eh?

-=Vel=-

	31-07-2004 18:14									#73
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***Resistence is futile...DP has been assimilated***

	31-07-2004 18:20									#74
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I prefer only 3 taxes - on profit, rent, and interest, 100%.

Well and good!

Without any incentive for profit, you have no incentive to WORK

You yourself have said that you agree with an individual's right to property, and if that is so, you set up a "have" and "have not" caste within your own proposed system that beats the pants off anything "rent" could do.

And without interest, you cannot finance future growth.

The future looks bright indeed for the folks in Kidville!



-=Vel=-

	31-07-2004 19:33									#75
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quote: Originally posted by GePap Someone who is dead can NOT pay taxes- they are dead and no longer a person. I went over with Sky why this facile arguement is just that. Don;t repeat the same dumb arguements that have been refuted already...

Dead people do pay taxes. A dead person is still required to fill out an income tax return and pay any due taxes for the year.

	31-07-2004 19:36									#76
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quote: Originally posted by GePap The truth? Though of course that moniker is much closer to reality than "death tax". But of course, the Tax does have a name, and it's: ESTATE TAX

The truth would be "Death Estate Tax". There is no tax simply for owning an estate, it is a tax on an estate left upon death.

	31-07-2004 19:43									#77
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx I prefer only 3 taxes - on profit, rent, and interest, 100%. Without any incentive for profit, you have no incentive to WORK

I don't really propose a capatalist system. So I can't really answer this question, anyway. I apologize for wasting your time.

	31-07-2004 19:44									#78
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quote: Originally posted by Dauphin Dead people do pay taxes. A dead person is still required to fill out an income tax return and pay any due taxes for the year.

Dead people don't do anything. That is ridiculous.

	31-07-2004 19:46									#79
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious Dead people don't do anything. That is ridiculous.

Tell that to the inspector of taxes.

	31-07-2004 19:48									#80
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quote: Originally posted by Dauphin Tell that to the inspector of taxes.

Why would I do that? Do you think that he really believes that dead people actually do things.

	31-07-2004 19:50									#81
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Taxmen believing many weird and wonderful things when they're owed money.

	31-07-2004 19:57									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Dauphin Taxmen believing many weird and wonderful things when they're owed money.

edit: That's how people generally are. They'll believe just about anything if it will put a dollar in their pocket.

	31-07-2004 20:53									#83
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quote: Originally posted by Kidicious edit: That's how people generally are. They'll believe just about anything if it will put a dollar in their pocket.

They might even believe in communism.

	31-07-2004 20:59									#84
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat They might even believe in communism.

Of course. We will all be rich beyond our wildest dreams.

	31-07-2004 21:45									#85
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I'm still with taking a healthy share of the estates of the wealthest people. Doing so still passes on a good start in life to the fellow's offspring (hell, they could get everything if he just did a bit of estate planning) but it also helps to guard against the creation of a perminent immutable upper class. Thus peoples' wealth will rise and fall based upon their ability to personally perform.

I don't like the idea of having dynasties of landed gentry owning most of the country's wealth. It's much healthier for a society not to have that.

	31-07-2004 21:54									#86
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin it also helps to guard against the creation of a perminent immutable upper class.

This class already exists.

	31-07-2004 22:05									#87
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quote: Originally posted by Dauphin If most people make less than the mean average then the median income is lower than the mean, almost by definition.

Not if those on the top make so much money it skews it in the other direction.

	31-07-2004 22:08									#88
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Uh, che, if the people on the top make tons more money, then the mean gets skewed upward and the median is lower than the mean, like he just said!

	31-07-2004 22:08									#89
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Not if those on the top make so much money it skews it in the other direction.

That makes the mean higher, not the median.