25-08-2004 01:47									#151
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I obviously was too scared of her until I was about 14 or so. But I always thought she was pretty.

	25-08-2004 01:49									#152
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quote: Originally posted by Jarouik Interestingly enough, when I looked at the title "High School Standings", I thought this was about one's grades in high school. Instead, I found a stereotyping list with no fitting groups. Like "nerds" are always bullied or left alone? My school had no such clear-cut groups; though I might be considered a nerd, I was never bullied *or* left alone - I had many good friends at school. Does anybody else feel the list is just plain silly, or are people in some high schools really that obsessed with "popularity"?

Did you go to an actual American high school or to the Finnish "equivalent", that is to say, lukio?

The two are not really comparable. High school, as far as I know, is mandatory in the States. In a "forced" school the students are bound to be more frustrated and prone to teasing, bullying and forming social cliques.

The Finnish system is, in my humble opinion, superior, because the three year school we have from age ~15 to ~18 is entirely voluntary: Nobody will keep you there if you don't like it. Most of the usual suspects drop out after comprehensive school or go to a vocational school instead of lukio, and people tend to treat each other as equals. Bullying goes down to zilch, and I myself have gained an incredible amount of self confidence. The last three grades of comprehensive school are more like high school with the social aspect, but even there I doubt it's nowhere near as cruel as it can get in an American HS.

That is why I really can not reply to the poll either. I consider myself a geek/nerd, and I'm left alone when I want to, but the whole concept of "popularity" feels completely foreign to me, and I can/could get along with anyone in my school.

I have to mention though that school and town size may be a big factor in this. The lukio I go to has 100 people of my age (3rd year), 70 people doing 2nd year and 60 doing 1st year. I've lived in the same town of 7000 for all my life, and I've been in the same school with most of my schoolmates for the past 12 years. Practically everybody knows everybody.

	25-08-2004 01:52									#153
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The Finnish method sounds cool... which of course simply means it's a vital cog in the Evil Finnish Global Conspiracy!

Seriously, though, I like the sound of that system. A lot.

-Arrian

	25-08-2004 02:03									#154
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I have the impression that some Americans consider their time in high school the worst of their youth (of their lives, even) - in Finland most lukio-goers consider the years spent there the best. I at least do, I'm sad to have it end come spring.

The matter of gender is also interesting - 60% or more of lukio students are girls, so basically the boys get to do the picking. It also means that the boys there tend to be geekier than usual - so there's necessarily not that much picking going on anyway.

	25-08-2004 02:21									#155
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AFAIK, you can drop out of American high school at age 16, if you choose. ~ 87% eventually finish high school, though, even though more than 13% drop once or more.

	25-08-2004 03:21									#156
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thats true danS, you can. and i did. i regret it now but at the time it made sense to me.

	25-08-2004 05:36									#157
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I played a lot of sports, I was a nerd/geek/whatever nomenclature you prefer, and I made fun of people (though they all gave as well as they received). I was "bullied" once back in elementary school when somebody made a disparaging remark about my mother, but I can't remember being mocked/bullied/whatever after that, though it's possible that people were actually beating me up but I was too clueless to notice.

	25-08-2004 05:47									#158
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quote: Originally posted by Kassiopeia I have the impression that some Americans consider their time in high school the worst of their youth (of their lives, even) - in Finland most lukio-goers consider the years spent there the best. I at least do, I'm sad to have it end come spring. The matter of gender is also interesting - 60% or more of lukio students are girls, so basically the boys get to do the picking. It also means that the boys there tend to be geekier than usual - so there's necessarily not that much picking going on anyway.

I liked my high school, it was my junior high school (middle school) I didn't like.

Because I went to an inner city high school. No one teased me because I was poor. But when I was in jr. high (our name for middle school- that has changed since they got rid of 6th grade centers- which were the result of integration- it's a long story ), I went to a school that was in a good neighborhood. I was teased alot because I was poor. Not phsyically (I was not bullied since I was in elementary school as I said before), but verbally. And I took a lot of heat because I listened to heavy metal music. I was also called the ugliest kid in my school. That didn't feel good. It still stings to this day. I guess I was the ugliest kid. But someone has to be don't they? I just doesn't feel good to be at the bottom. I just want to be normal and average

	25-08-2004 05:51									#159
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As for my actual "standings" I graduated 38th in my class I think (I'd have to recheck). Which is bullshit of course . I was easily the smartest kid in my class. Well I concede that I might have been #2. But I screwed up my freshman year- which was actually at the jr. high school I mentioned above. I actually failed P.E. . I never dressed. And I missed the class most of the time because of double sessions (as a result of asbestos removal in another school) I had to go to school at 6:30 AM. It was damn near impossible for me to get there on time. And P.E. was my first class. I also missed the maximum number of days each semeseter (18 each semester). My parents were going through a divorce at the time, I didn't fare so well.

And finally I screwed up because of English. I could never figure out how to do well in those courses. We didn't learn actual English. It was more about literature. Shakespeare and crap like that. I could never do well at that. I took composition as well. I thought I could be a good writer, I was wrong. I never got above a B in English. Usually a C. And one time a D I think. I also got a D in Spanish III on time.

I had no chance at valevictorian as you can see . If it weren't for all my AP classes giving bonuses to my GPA, I probably would have been lower in my class.

Not that it matters now I guess. Who cares about high school class standings after high school is over?

	25-08-2004 20:35									#160
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quote: Originally posted by DanS AFAIK, you can drop out of American high school at age 16, if you choose. ~ 87% eventually finish high school, though, even though more than 13% drop once or more.

Can you expect to be able to get anything like a meaningful job as a HS drop-out? (i.e. not flipping burgers)

After lukio university-level studies are really needed to get a job, while vocational schools provide a profession already in three years. They become carpenters, mechanics, electricians, that sort of thing.

After all, it is possible to drop out of the Finnish comprehensive school if you haven't finished it by the age of 17 too, but that doesn't bode well for your future.

As for grades I've been straight A (10 in our system) since first grade but I like not to brag about it

	25-08-2004 20:56									#161
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quote: Originally posted by Jaguar I obviously was too scared of her until I was about 14 or so. But I always thought she was pretty.

Ahh but any individual girl is not necessarily representative. We are talking on average here.

All I know was that going for the very cute but understated girl worked for me. Of course not EVERY ONE wanted to go out with me, but most did.

Then if you can keep your mouth shut about what happens between you two, it happens again and again and again.

Oh another-- don't be trying to go for the gusto 10 seconds in-- Girls warm up slower than guys and most still have some traditional notions in the back of their head about respectibility etc. Take your time and next thing you know you have the reputation as a gentleman all while you are having lots of sex