13-09-2004 17:07									#1
	Turn 195, 790AD Increase the size of your Attachments

Status

- Republic
- Researching Chemistry (~940 beakers stored, need 1440 beakers total, 2 turns left)
- Treasury 242 gold (end of last turn), approx +31 (+x) gpt, = approx 273 gold (at begining of turn).
- Running at 4/6/0 Sci/Tax/Lux

- Anticipated start of GA - Turn 223 (910 AD)

Place for the save, when it arrives

Urgent Business for This Turn

Economic:

To be edited by the Consul/MoI


Military:

to be edited by the Consuls/MoW


Diplomatic:

To be edited by Consuls/FAM


Other:

To be Edited by the Consuls

Link to turn 194 report
Edit link to point to previous turn's report

Last edited by MrWhereItsAt on 13-09-2004 at 17:29

	13-09-2004 17:28									#2
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Just out of interest, and prompted by a post of con's at the CFC/APO/CGN alliance forum, I wanted to check to see if I could tell when GWT last researched something. I only went back as far as 660AD, but I know now that GWT still has not got the following (ie we can still offer these to them)
Music Theory, Astronomy, Monarchy

As we can offer these and only these, we know they have

Gunpowder, Education, Theology.

BUT we cannot tell from the negotiations screen alone whether they have Chemistry, Printing Press or Banking. So I calculated the price of these before and after someone else discovers them. The raw prices are:

Chemistry 1440 (1276)
Printing Press 804 (765)
Banking 1248 (1105),

where the numbers in brackets are the cost after discovery by one civ.

As of 780AD the prices for these are all higher than the 1-civ-discovered values, and as best as can quickly be determined are at the same values as if no-one has discovered them. The one exception to this is Chemistry, which we are discovering now, and we have (as of last turn) put around 610 beakers into over two turns, meaning that the cost shows up as around 830 beakers.

This is something to keep in mind for future turns - every turn we must make a quick check of tech costs in order to see if GWT/GCA have discovered anything we haven't. And by seeing what we can offer them we can to a degree determine what they discover and when.

Also of interest, we can manage at present 320 or so beakers per turn whilst still posting a small profit, or 370 with a small (22gpt) loss. With this, we can keep up with 4 turn techs for Economics and Printing Press, should we want them. Otherwise we can do all other techs (Metallurgy, Physics, Military Tradition, Democracy, Theory of Gravity, Magnetism) at 5-6 turns, depending on whether we want to run a small profit or a small loss.

	13-09-2004 19:32									#3
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Well from the last chat I think its pretty much a done deal that CFC is going after GCA.

What I think we need to do now is figure out where the best place to hit GCA is, to give us the best chance of an opening, convince CFC to do that and then time our attempted landing accordingly.

I assume also that the "appearence of our southern fleet" will also be coordinated to induce the maximum amount of "the fog of war" on GWT again possibly inducing them to move northern units south.

	14-09-2004 00:33									#4
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quote: Originally posted by conmcb25 I assume also that the "appearence of our southern fleet" will also be coordinated to induce the maximum amount of "the fog of war" on GWT again possibly inducing them to move northern units south.

Exactly. We may even make a landing with them at the same time we land up North. Why not give GCA a little hell as well!

	24-09-2004 01:05									#5
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code:

W h y   
h  a  s   
t   h   i   s     
g    a    m    e        
s     l     o     w     e     d  
d     o    w    n       
t      o            
a           
c       r       a       w       l       ?

Last edited by BigFree on 25-09-2004 at 02:25

	24-09-2004 03:38									#6
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Because CGN did not have someone to play the turn, then CFC did not, then it turned out that the player who played the CGN turn did not offer peace "accepted" to GWT as they agreed to so it had to be replayed yet again.

	25-09-2004 00:13									#7
	Remove this text

BTW, my post looked a lot cooler on the screen when I was typing it than on the display view.

Web page deleted the extra spaces

	25-09-2004 02:26									#8
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quote: Originally posted by joncnunn BTW, my post looked a lot cooler on the screen when I was typing it than on the display view. Web page deleted the extra spaces

You mean like that?

	27-09-2004 04:43									#9
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Save was sent to us, but Furloaf doesn't know the address, so he sent to me so I could post it here.

Attachment: ptw isdg to apolyton 790 ad.sav
This has been downloaded 5 time(s).

	27-09-2004 04:50									#10
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Cyrene should have been sent to CGN last turn.

Maurentia should be sent next turn.

	27-09-2004 04:54									#11
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We should cut the Tripoli iron soon and have 3 Workers on it ready to remine so the city doesn't lose any shields.

We need to get more Horsemen built.

We also need cities to start on Caravels. Big Bend, PoV and Solace can start this turn and we need others to do so also as soon as they finish what they're working on. Those 3 cities can do 4-5 turn Caravels and should start immediately.

We can turn the slider up to 100% and finish Chemistry in one turn.

We need to get CFC to send us gold to speed up research!

Last edited by Trip on 27-09-2004 at 04:59

	27-09-2004 05:23									#12
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Sounds good to me. I want OPD to have a chance to take a look at the turn and give his input before we proceed.

	27-09-2004 08:56									#13
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I will try to do so this evening (my time).

I'm still uncertain about those boats, but everything else I hope I can look at. And maybe I should keep going with my MoI rough ideas, er, ideas thread.

	27-09-2004 09:08									#14
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I would suggest making an appearance of the northern fleet this turn, and then the southern fleet in a couple more turns, just to keep them off-balance. After each of those sightings, send them home. A couple ships from the southern fleet can then head back to pester GWT and keep them distracted.

	27-09-2004 11:54									#15
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I don't want to look like we are making an apearance. I just want to look like we got "caught" again. I think we should move in closer, say 3 tiles from shore making it look like we were hoping for none of their Galley's to be around.

	27-09-2004 20:21									#16
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Right, that's what I mean.

	27-09-2004 22:00									#17
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quote: Originally posted by BigFree Sounds good to me. I want OPD to have a chance to take a look at the turn and give his input before we proceed.

Cheers BF,

Although, I've just got back from work and now immediately have to leave for my evening class and won't be back for 3 1/2 hours, don't hold up the save on my behalf, but I will have a look at things when I get back if it hasn't been sent.

	28-09-2004 00:09									#18
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Just an idea on the turn:

If we have Big Bend work the new shielded grass this turn and have the Workers begin mining it then we can achieve 40 shields for the Caravel by the time the build finishes. 4-turn Caravels from BB would be very nice.

	28-09-2004 02:04									#19
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I'll wait till around 6 PM PST (4 hours from this post) to play it.
Thanks for the tips Trip. BB is good for that job.

	28-09-2004 02:06									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Trip Just an idea on the turn: If we have Big Bend work the new shielded grass this turn and have the Workers begin mining it then we can achieve 40 shields for the Caravel by the time the build finishes. 4-turn Caravels from BB would be very nice.

That sounds like a plan, 10 spt is divine,
however do you want a harbor first? If they aren't to be combat vessels then perhaps not?
BB is likely ok sans harbor as it only has 2 sea tiles.

	28-09-2004 02:17									#21
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Just regular Caravels for now for use as a sentry net.

We have a LOT of ocean to cover and need boats out. We're not building a warship fleet yet, we just want to be able to spot GWT coming, not to sink them.

The first ships we should care about having vets for would be Ironclads should we start constructing a real war fleet with them.

	28-09-2004 03:01									#22
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Helpful culture expansion in Chiquita this turn

Dom builds market, at 10 sheilds per turn and no more improvements for size 12 millitary orders would be cool here.

PoV builds aqua, unless there are objections from the millitiaritst a market for growth would be good here.

BB builds lib set to caravel presumably

Solace builds aqua, MP would be nice but if ships are more urgent then that too is cool

Down under builds courthouse, now at 5spt, set to harbor or millitary.

BFC builds musket, suggest it be changed to NM

3 workers built,


Solace should stop working the irrigated horse tile and work the mined iron mountain,

then Arcadia stop working the forest and hill tiles and work 1 sea tile and the irrigated horse from Solace

then back into Solace and switch a mined GL tile for the hill tile to give 10spt question though, will that city still grow next turn? If not then take action to make it grow.

Also as a note - Solace must stop working that hill next turn.

Dang, panic at EN as something's gone wrong, WF is not as stated in last orders, I think it's not that orders from last time weren't followed it's that other changes were also made or perhaps the orders were unclear and misleading, Lumen seems to have taken a mined BGL from EN resulting in it being 1 sheild short of the worker.
Stay building worker but maximize growth.

Set PoV to grow next turn by stopping working the forest tiles, this will only cost us 1 shield as the new labour will go back to the furs forest. Which will be made up for in 1 turn at size 7.

Make sure workers chop by eye.

The worker by the karina mountian may want to move to mine it.

Karina at 10spt looks good.

As Trip said have the workers by BB mine the BGL

have silk road work the freshly mined mountain instead of the non-silk forest

have areaX move labour from forest to forest on river

have kanoala work the non-mined BGL instead of the mined BGL (extra sheilds is lost anyway)
Then have lumen musae work that instead of the non-mined BGL to it's SW, then have Einsten work that tile taking off an irrigated plains tile which Hero's summit can then work instead of the forest. A 4 city shuffle.

Have freedom city set to work 2 plains tiles for growth this turn.
Then have thunderbay work that saltpeter hill instead of the other hill.

maximize growth in Chiquita.

Set Dominus to work the mined Gl tile instead of the hill tile, allowing it to grow this turn. It'll still get the hills sheilds with the new labourer from growth.

That's all I can see, I haven't much time again. Feel free to overule or make any changes, aslong as you know what you're doing.

And, of course anyone else who wants to weigh in with something or suggestion like Trip did.

Also make any millitary build changes that are neccesary, aslong as they're not in worker cities. - Sorry I can't handle the change of focus properly.

	28-09-2004 03:22									#23
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We should get 3 Workers to the Tripoli iron ASAP so we can cut it and then start on building Horsemen again for cities like Chiquita and BFC. 50 Cav = good = necessity.

quote: Originally posted by OPD PoV builds aqua, unless there are objections from the millitiaritst a market for growth would be good here.

Sorry, but I have to object.

Most of our coastal cities are A) doing Aquaducts or B) doing Courthouses. We NEED to get boats built! I would like it if all cities that have finished Aquas or CHs to start on Caravels until we have a complete net and some backup up.

quote: Down under builds courthouse, now at 5spt, set to harbor or millitary.

We can have it start on Caravels or do an Aquaduct like Silk Road is doing.

	28-09-2004 03:33									#24
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Oh, and thanks for all your work OPD, it is appreciated.

	28-09-2004 06:32									#25
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We have two chops going on at PoV. One finishes in 2 turns, the other in 5 turns. It's hard to get everything we want. I'm going to remain with the Market build, for now. We will need gold for upgrades.

I set Down Under, Solace and BB to Caravels. Down Under builds at 8 turn pace (5spt) while the other two will build at 4 turn pace. Antlergrad grows this turn and finishes CH; depeding on shield output, it may do well to make Caravels.

BFC, Chiquita and Dominus will do 3 turn Horsemen. Freedom City can do 4 turn Horsemen with a little short rushing.

I have workers standing by at Tripoli to mine the Iron we pillage next turn. We can then change builds from Knights to Horses in the other cities. What do we want Tripoli to do after it's Library finishes in 3 turns? It has a Barracks and makes an easy 15 spt...Other than military, a Uni is good.

Incensity finishes an Aquaduct in 4 turns. In order to get the most out of it, we need to add workers to the city ASAP. With the Harbor, it can make lots of commerce. But, then it need a Market as well!

Changed build of CH to Library in Heroe's Summit. It nets 4 out of 6 shields now and the city is severely limited in it's growth potential. Set que to build: Library-Harbor-Aquaduct-Market.

Next player, keep eye on Kanoala area; it need the right amount of mined and irrigated BGL tiles in order to do workers properly. Also, make sure to change Coliseum build in AP to a Wonder on the next turn!

Upon Trip's advice in set science to 100% to get Chemistry in 1 turn. from what i could gather we need 540 more beakers to complete it. At 100% we make 549; a 9 commerce waste but not bad though.

GCA nor GTW have Astro.

Sent Education to CGN.

Sent Dyes to CFC.

Keep up with the input OPD and Trip.

I didn't follow all of the suggestions and I found a few other things as well, so don't get too upset wih me Trip.

Screens to follow

Last edited by BigFree on 28-09-2004 at 07:09

	28-09-2004 06:38									#28
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And here's the dilema at HS:

	29-09-2004 01:25									#29
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Hero's summit is more limited by the lack of a harbor than the lack of a library and it would certainly need an aqua before library too. A lib would only give it more unusable 1 food sea tiles and wouldn't really help any of the surrounding cities that much either.

	29-09-2004 03:09									#30
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I disagree only because if it were to use the Coastal tiles it would then not put out many shields to build anything. If we want it to build its own improvements it's going to need to work as many land tiles as possible. The city is limited in its growth potential. At size 6 and using the Harbor would give it a shield output of 2. The only way to get out of this situation with this city is to rush the improvements needed. But, we have many other needs for our gold now. So, a library now will increase our Science by 2-3 beakers a turn and let the culture expand in the area. Once an Aquaduct is in place, and the city can grow larger than 6, then a Harbor would be more useful. The city still won't produce much but it would make plenty of commerce.