08-11-2004 01:10									#331
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nobody uses it, prolly should think about making .75 instead of .5

	08-11-2004 01:31									#332
	Put an end to popups!

And on the topic of Wonder, I like changing Mafia to allow you to attack anyone anywhere in the world (no border necessary).

	08-11-2004 01:54									#333
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I'd say its still quite valuable if you're in a situation where you're at war with everyone else. Definitely more valuable in a game with fewer players.

	08-11-2004 02:00									#334
	Remove this text

To be honest, I was happy that the person that had Nascar in the game I GM'd didn't use it because I don't really get it.

Normally Caravans result in trade going both ways, sender and recipient. I think that Nascar means that only the sender gets the trade, but what is the calculation? (your own Tech Level * your own Tech Level) * Number of Caravans * 0.5 <---- is there only one way benefit or does this get multiplied x2 (sender and recipient are the same person).

* Sparrowhawk

	08-11-2004 02:07									#335
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One way benefit.

A person with tech level 10 trading 10 caravans with self gets 10*10*5=500 gold as the sender. He doesn't get any additional gold as recipient.

	08-11-2004 21:55									#336
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Turn 12: Beauty is only skin deep, but butt ugly goes all the way to the bone.

Trade:
8 Caravans from Muxec[17R] to Vlad Antlerkov[17R] - 4624
9 Caravans from Muxec[17R] to Smiley[17R] - 5202
17 Caravans from Whoha[17R] to Dark Cloud[17R] - 9826
17 Caravans from Smiley[17R] to Muxec[17R] - 9826
11 Caravans from Vlad Antlerkov[17R] to Muxec[17R] - 6358
6 Caravans from Vlad Antlerkov[17R] to Smiley[17R] - 3468
17 Caravans from Dark Cloud[17R] to Whoha[17R] - 9826
NOTE: I am not rounding up fractional gold due to goverment bonuses. Please plan accordingly *Denotes governmental change.

Wonder Building
Vlad Antlerkov constructs a Femto-Diodes (18th wonder) in B12 by outpacing the competitions spending and dropping 4659 on it.

Espionage
Muxec protects his military production with one spy.
Whoha sends one spy to sabotage Vald's War Phase.
Smiley sends a spy to disrupt Dark Cloud's espionage.
Vlad Antlerkov has 1 spy protect his trade
Vlad Antlerkov keeps 1 spy at home defending his wonder building phase.
Dark Cloud keeps one spy a home defending his War Phase.

**Espionage end game:
Vlad's war phase it sabotauged. Both spies from Smiley and Dark Cloud were killed in a horrible drinking accident.

Gifts
Whoha gives Dark Cloud 500 armies.
Smiley (in yet another attempt to end his turn with 0 gold) send 9 gold to Muxec.
Vlad Antlerkov shows Muxec the ways of Nano Diodes (tech 18).
Dark Cloud sends 3000 gold to Whoha and shows him the ways of Nano Diodes (tech 18) as well.

Nukes!
Muxec builds 12 more nukes and sends 14 nukes at Dark Cloud toasting all of his cities.
Whoha builds 20 nukes and sends 25 nukes at Muxec. His SDIs stop the first 8, but the rest rain destruction down on his cities eliminating him from the game.

Battles
Dark Cloud is not out of this yet. Even with no home cities to return to in the event of failure, he sends a massive 1050 unit force to the territory of Vlad Antlerkov.
Vlad's response was, "We don't need no stinkin' army!" Well apparently he don't need no cities either. Dark Cloud moves in without shedding a drop. Vlad is gone.

In other war news, Smiley's army is again on the move, but once again his army watches the territories (sneak attack on Dark Cloud) that they were ordered to capture explode in fireballs of destruction. His armies turn back.

Wonders:
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Jonny) (Vlad Anterkov) (Gambecube64) - G11 - Tower of Babel.
Smiley - K2 - Colosseum. - Obsolete
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) - K11 - Trojan Horse.
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Gamecube64) - G10 - Acropolis.
Whoha (Sparrowhawk) - B6 - Jihad. - Obsolete
Dark Cloud (Ljube-ljcvetko) - K6 - Silk Road. - NUKED
Sparrowhawk (Dark Cloud) - F6 - Trans-Siberian Railroad. - NUKED
Whoha (Sparrowhawk) - A7 - National Rifle Association.
Whoha (Sparrowhawk) - B7 - Mafia.
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Jonny) - B11 - University of California.
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Jonny) - A12 - NASCAR.
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Jonny) - A10 - The KGB. - Obsolete
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Jonny) - C12 - The Majestic-12 Program.
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Jonny) - C10 - Galactic Overlord.
Dark Cloud - A1 - O-rings (15th wonder). - NUKED
Muxec - C3 - Field Degenerator (16th wonder). - NUKED
Muxec - B3 - Stupidity Ampliphier (17th wonder). - NUKED
Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) - B12 - Femto-Diodes (18th wonder).

Tech prices:
Nano Diodes (tech 18) is now 3446 gold.

Subline Warp fields (tech 19) is still 16724 gold.
Tunneling Gamma Quarks (tech 20) is still 27060 gold.
Artificial Stupidity (tech 21) is still 43784 gold.

Wars
Dark Cloud and Smiley.

Misc.
Those who build wonders 15, 16, and 17 can at anytime designate another player's SS part to be destroyed. I will then mark the wonder as obsolete. You must wait until after the wonder is built, you cannot use it one the same turn as you build it.
I've added a column to the chart that should the amount of SS parts that are built. Reminder 4 components are needed to win. Tech 15+'s wonders can be built and cost tech level squared. They can be used to ruin one of your opponents already built SS parts.

Commentary
Since this is going to come up, I'll repost from the sign-in thread:
Attacking across nuked territory (Y or N)?-- allowed, but if your tech is less than 15, you lose half your armies from the radiation. If it is 15 or greater, but still less than 20, then you lose 25% of your armies. If 20 or greater, you lose no armies.
Hmm...looks like I capped caravans at 15, but forgot, so no cap.
Also think that targeting another player's espionage should not be allowed, too powerful. For instance, say there are two players left. For player one to protect all of his production, all he has to do is sabotage the other player's espionage instead of trying to decide which to protect making spying less of a cat-and-mouse type of operation.

code:

 
    
    
 
      
Society
 
      
Goverment
      
Cities
 
      
Tech
 
      
Army
 
      
Nukes
 
      
SDI
 
      
SS Parts
 
      
Gold
 
    
 

    
    
 
      
Whoha
      
Republic
  
      
15
 
      
18
 
      
620
 
      
10
 
      
0
 
      
0
      
15841
 
    
 

    
    
 
      
 Smiley
      
Republic
  
      
36
 
      
17
 
      
2287
 
      
0
 
      
0
 
      
3
      
12503
 
    
 

 
    
 
      
Dark Cloud
      
Republic
 
      
31(31)
 
      
18
 
      
1050
 
      
5
 
      
5
 
      
3
      
9169
 
    
 

Attachment: society_map_blank1.gif
This has been downloaded 41 time(s).

	08-11-2004 23:23									#337
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Wait! When I wasted all of the DarkCloud's cities I wasted all of his armies so he could not attack.

	08-11-2004 23:27									#338
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Nope, the attacks occur simultaneously so when you were wasting Darkcloud's cities his armies were on the move to Vlad's territory. They would have been celebrating their romp over Vlad's undefended territory when they found out that their cities back home were reduced to Nuclear Waste.

Great round, I at the endgame, should be over soon, unless Whoha somehow finds a way to nuke both Smiley and Darkcloud.

* Sparrowhawk

Edit: Not sure who the black coloured player is, but I am betting on him to win .

Just kidding, it looks like someone will win this thing, but black is now the dominant colour on the map.

Last edited by Sparrowhawk on 08-11-2004 at 23:49

	09-11-2004 01:15									#339
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quote: Originally posted by muxec Wait! When I wasted all of the DarkCloud's cities I wasted all of his armies so he could not attack.

You did actually waste his defending armies.

	09-11-2004 01:28									#340
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quote: Originally posted by Spaced Cowboy You did actually waste his defending armies.

So me and Vlad misunderstood the rules

	09-11-2004 03:11									#341
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I figured muxec was up to something... thus the desperate pleas to whoha

quote: Dark Cloud (Vlad Antlerkov) (Jonny) (Vlad Anterkov) (Gambecube64) - G11 - Tower of Babel.

It seems the tower of babel is doing its job... now it's up to possession by 4 different nations

	09-11-2004 03:19									#342
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quote: Also think that targeting another player's espionage should not be allowed, too powerful. For instance, say there are two players left. For player one to protect all of his production, all he has to do is sabotage the other player's espionage instead of trying to decide which to protect making spying less of a cat-and-mouse type of operation.

well that should only destroy one spy... that's how I thought the targeting worked...

	09-11-2004 03:57									#343
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Address to Supporters at the Colosseum

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. You just have no idea how warming and how generous that welcome is, your love is, your affection, and I'm gratified by it. I'm sorry that we got here a little bit late and a bit short.

Earlier today, I spoke to President DarkCloud, and I offered him our congratulations on his victory. We had a good conversation and we talked about the danger of division in our world and the need – the desperate need – for unity, for finding the common ground, coming together. Today, I hope that we can begin the healing. In Society it is vital that every city count, and that every city be counted. But the outcome should be decided by those resources within the cities, not a protracted nuclear exchange.

I would not give up this fight if there was a chance that we would prevail. But it is now clear that even when all the gold is spent, which they will be, there won't be enough outstanding gold for us to be able to destroy the Galactic Overlord system. And therefore, we can not win this war.

My friends, it was here that we began our campaign for world domination. And all we had was hope and a vision for a better world. It was a privilege and a gift to spend six thousand years traveling this world, coming to know so many of you. I wish that I could just wrap you in my arms and embrace each and every one of you individually all across this planet. I thank you from the bottom of my heart. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

	09-11-2004 04:34									#344
	Tired of ads?

Trade 18 caravans with Darkcloud.
Build 50 nukes and send 60 at Smiley unless that last post of his was a surrender.

	09-11-2004 04:40									#345
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Suggestions for next game:
Majestic 12: Make it take 2 sdi to destroy 1 missile(or reduce sdi from 100% chance intercept down to 50% chance and have gm do random numbers to determine if nukes hit).
Galactic overlords:2 hits to kill a city down from 4.(or random as above).
SDI: cut them down to 250, nukes are just too good.
Nukes: Move em up to 1000 a piece.

	09-11-2004 04:52									#346
	Put an end to popups!

By the way, why am I the only person here who builds lots of nukes?

	09-11-2004 05:04									#347
	Inflate your Upload Space

I worked out possible espionage scenarios, and basically there's no way to stop DarkCloud from winning.

Very well played DC, especially recalling the situation you were in when the game began.

	09-11-2004 05:05									#348
	Remove this text

I guess you are... at least the only one who uses them

	09-11-2004 05:06									#349
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: SDI: cut them down to 250, nukes are just too good. Nukes: Move em up to 1000 a piece

I think I can agree with this... somewhat- perhaps nukes should be 750... a sort of mid-way compromise.

As for these two:

quote: Majestic 12: Make it take 2 sdi to destroy 1 missile(or reduce sdi from 100% chance intercept down to 50% chance and have gm do random numbers to determine if nukes hit). Galactic overlords:2 hits to kill a city down from 4.(or random as above).

2 SDI to destroy 1 missile sounds good.

Galactic Overlord is OK, I think, despite my earlier complaints...

	09-11-2004 05:17									#350
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On the Eve of Accepting Victory

As the Empire of Iguana Fire's final enemy, Smiley coalesces, Emperor Dark Cloud has decided to celebrate his total victory with his ally, Whoha.

Thoughout much travails, Whoha has stood by our fledgling nation, gifting gold and military aid first against the Axis Powers of Ljube-Ljcvetko and Vlad Antlerkov... then after Ljube was destroyed and the power of Communism rose in the guise of Jonny the Yellow (of china) and Sparrowhawk the Orange, he destroyed the orange with a barrage of nuclear power... and the Unholy Alliance versus Jonny took out the Yellow... then, it was time to deal with the Nazi... and with Whoha's aid- the Red- muxec, bitterly plotting against all the entire game- was eliminated.

Finally, America- in the guise of Smiley coalesced, and the European Union of Whoha and DarkCloud triumphed.

-Emperor DC
2900 AD

Last edited by DarkCloud on 09-11-2004 at 05:24

	09-11-2004 05:18									#351
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quote: I worked out possible espionage scenarios, and basically there's no way to stop DarkCloud from winning. Very well played DC, especially recalling the situation you were in when the game began.

Thank's smiley.

Yeah, without whoha, I would have been eliminated. and starting in the middle of the map was the worst tactical starting position ever.

I thought I was down and out sooo many times... and kept losing my capital cities.

---
I'll start the next game in a few days, but first- let's iron out the rules in the startup thread.

For the next game I also encourage people to choose city and Empire names.

	09-11-2004 05:25									#352
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Suggestion for next game: Make the map wrap-around on all sides. Essentially, that would put everyone in the same position DC was originally, with other players on all sides.

	09-11-2004 05:57									#353
	Inflate your Upload Space

Now that would be interesting to see how people would deal with that, but it greatly complicates the game.

	09-11-2004 07:06									#354
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Hmmm...Smiley, did you consider conventional war in your calculation?

	09-11-2004 09:58									#355
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Vlad- that sounds like a good idea I don't really see how it would complicate things overly, though.

	09-11-2004 10:41									#356
	Inflate your Upload Space

thats because you were in that situation, we all had only 2 neighbors, and you had 8.

	09-11-2004 13:26									#357
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Congrats DC. Nezt time I'll read the rules carefully.

Do not change nukes, they are just powerful enough.

Balancing Overlord and Majestic is the next thing to do.

Thanks for playing.

	10-11-2004 05:08									#358
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Congratulations DarkCloud. Well played.

	10-11-2004 23:09									#359
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thank you

	17-11-2004 05:36									#360
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Just wondering- any ideas on how we're going to work around thanksgiving- delay over it or play through? I know I won';t have access to my main computer- but I will have a pen drive and a laptop...