20-10-2004 11:26									#91
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quote: Originally posted by Geronimo It didn't work at all! There was a deeply ingrained misconception immediately following the war and up to the present that the US won the war due to the outcome of the (irrelevant to the outcome of the war) battle of new orleans. Electing the general from said battle as president of the US probably served to magnify the influence of this perception.

That's all well and good, but you kept your hands off the maple trees after that. That's all we cared aboot.

	20-10-2004 11:28									#92
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quote: Just remember who's the ***** in this relationship and then we can get on with laughing at the Guardian.

That would be you people.

	20-10-2004 11:30									#93
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As a wise man once said, we're bigger and we're on top That would make you the *****.

	20-10-2004 11:34									#94
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither That's all well and good, but you kept your hands off the maple trees after that. That's all we cared aboot.

Aye, all's well that ends well. Had the war of 1812 resulted in some sort of annexation of Canada like the annexations following the mexican war I suspect the presence of that loyalist population would have meant that Lincoln would have faced a two front war of secession involving the north as well as the south. I don't think the population of Canada would have ever accepted rule from washington regardless of the outcome of the battles with britain and would have jumped at the first real chance to secede from the forced union.

	20-10-2004 11:39									#95
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quote: Originally posted by Geronimo There was a deeply ingrained misconception immediately following the war and up to the present that the US won the war due to the outcome of the (irrelevant to the outcome of the war) battle of new orleans.

Not in Canada. We know the just side won.

In many ways, the war of 1812 marked the beginning of Canada. English, French and Indians, blacks and whites, Catholics and Protestants were united in the fight against an unprovoked attack.

Had it not been for the war, Canadians might have chosen to join the US. Instead, the American atrocities and throwing back the invaders became part of the Canadian mythology.

	20-10-2004 11:41									#96
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither As a wise man once said, we're bigger and we're on top That would make you the *****.

That analogy doesn't work because at the same time Mexico is below the US and more countries below that... at best it's just wild orgy and you're the fat pale chick who jumped on last because no one wanted to jump on you.

	20-10-2004 11:43									#97
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quote: Originally posted by Geronimo Aye, all's well that ends well. Had the war of 1812 resulted in some sort of annexation of Canada like the annexations following the mexican war I suspect the presence of that loyalist population would have meant that Lincoln would have faced a two front war of secession involving the north as well as the south. I don't think the population of Canada would have ever accepted rule from washington regardless of the outcome of the battles with britain and would have jumped at the first real chance to secede from the forced union.

You could be right. It would depend a lot on immigration patterns after 1815. An occupied Canada might be flooded with American immigrants and the Loyalists might have returned to Britain.

	20-10-2004 11:46									#98
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quote: Originally posted by Pyrodrew That analogy doesn't work because at the same time Mexico is below the US and more countries below that... at best it's just wild orgy and you're the fat pale chick who jumped on last because no one wanted to jump on you.

You could be right, but we seem to be screwing you on a couple of accounts, so you'd still be the *****.

	20-10-2004 11:49									#99
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quote: Originally posted by Tingkai Not in Canada. We know the just side won. In many ways, the war of 1812 marked the beginning of Canada. English, French and Indians, blacks and whites, Catholics and Protestants were united in the fight against an unprovoked attack. Had it not been for the war, Canadians might have chosen to join the US. Instead, the American atrocities and throwing back the invaders became part of the Canadian mythology.

It is strange that canadians see the war of 1812 as a victory of canada over the US while the US views the so called french and indian war as a british victory over the French. It's also interesting that while the french and indian war doesnt seem to have done much to unite the 13 colonies, Canadians report that war of 1812 served to unite them even though both wars occured before either was a country and even though both wars were essentially british wars involving british colonies. From whence comes these differing effects I wonder?

	20-10-2004 11:50									#100
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither You could be right, but we seem to be screwing you on a couple of accounts, so you'd still be the *****.

It doesn't really matter which is the ***** so long as we are both enjoying it does it?

	20-10-2004 11:51									#101
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quote: Originally posted by Geronimo It is strange that canadians see the war of 1812 as a victory of canada over the US while the US views the so called french and indian war as a british victory over the French. It's also interesting that while the french and indian war doesnt seem to have done much to unite the 13 colonies, Canadians report that war of 1812 served to unite them even though both wars occured before either was a country and even though both wars were essentially british wars involving british colonies. From whence comes these differing effects I wonder?

We continued, and some continue, to see ourselves as part of the Empire.

One Flag, One fleet, One Empire!

In that context, WE beat your ass.

	20-10-2004 11:56									#102
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quote: Originally posted by Tingkai You could be right. It would depend a lot on immigration patterns after 1815. An occupied Canada might be flooded with American immigrants and the Loyalists might have returned to Britain.

American immigrants tended to immigrant to Canada for political reasons I think. A US-Canada forced marriage might have seen some canadians leave but the flood of US immigration was going to continue to be to be not to Canada but rather to the more inviting (warmer) territories in the US west. It's hard to imagine the Canadians not choosing to leave on the heels of the southern states and just as hard not to imagine the UK which was neutral in the civil war instead siding with the canadian/southern secession.

	20-10-2004 11:57									#103
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	20-10-2004 11:59									#104
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither You could be right, but we seem to be screwing you on a couple of accounts, so you'd still be the *****.

The War of 1812 happened when both countries were kids, "I gave you a black eye when I was 5!"
"Yeah, but you were 6 & I left a scar on you!"
It's all rather silly and really doesn't represent the countries in the present day.

Screwing implies present tense... I've not seen any present day stories of Canada screwing anyone much less the US. If anything it is always the US who is perceived as making "b!tches" for it's own selfish reasons (Iraq is our current b!tch some would say), whereas Canada is the fat chick not getting any.

	20-10-2004 12:00									#105
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither We continued, and some continue, to see ourselves as part of the Empire. One Flag, One fleet, One Empire! In that context, WE beat your ass.

I never heard this before. Very interesting. Does that mean Canadians see the original revolutionary war as somehow a defeat for Canada?

	20-10-2004 12:04									#106
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quote: Originally posted by Pyrodrew The War of 1812 happened when both countries were kids, "I gave you a black eye when I was 5!" "Yeah, but you were 6 & I left a scar on you!" It's all rather silly and really doesn't represent the countries in the present day. Screwing implies present tense... I've not seen any present day stories of Canada screwing anyone much less the US. If anything it is always the US who is perceived as making "b!tches" for it's own selfish reasons (Iraq is our current b!tch some would say), whereas Canada is the fat chick not getting any.

Right, while you guys spend yourself into the next century on defence and we spend ourselves within our means to provide healthcare for all our citizens.

Who's getting the better end of this deal? Who's screwing whom?

	20-10-2004 12:09									#107
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How do you feel about Kerry's plan to import all your drugs?

	20-10-2004 12:14									#108
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Right, while you guys spend yourself into the next century on defence and we spend ourselves within our means to provide healthcare for all our citizens. Who's getting the better end of this deal? Who's screwing whom?

Your healthcare system does not mean you're screwing anyone, much less the US.
As for spending on defence... well some might say that's our masculine side as we like to protect our nice b!tches. The women are naturally better at nurturing and taking care of people.

	20-10-2004 12:22									#109
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As the world gets smaller and smaller, this thing is going to become more common.

The rest of the world has a reason to be concerned considering we have a psycho in the White House.

	20-10-2004 12:25									#110
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quote: Originally posted by Geronimo I never heard this before. Very interesting. Does that mean Canadians see the original revolutionary war as somehow a defeat for Canada?

A defeat for the Empire that had big consequences for Canada? Yes.

You have to remember, the settlers of Upper Canada were mostly loyalists who fled the Revolutionary war. They lost. They left.

During the war of 1812 they and their sons were defending their homes against an invader, along side British regulars and indian irregulars.

It was a very personal war for Ontario (Upper Canada) seeing as it was on that land that the major battles took place and that people from there joined militias and fought to repel the Yanks. It wasn't just the Red Coats who fought. Beyond Ontario it also involved Quebec, New Brunswick, and Nova Scotia.

I'm not from any of those places, but the events that happened there have had a large influence on where I live. I think the same could be said of any Canadian.

So yes, it was 'us' who fought 'you'.

	20-10-2004 12:28									#111
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk How do you feel about Kerry's plan to import all your drugs?

There aren't enough drugs in all of Canada to keep New York City going on a good night.

In short, Kerry is a lunatic who doesn't quite grasp the scale of the problem.

	20-10-2004 12:30									#112
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quote: Originally posted by Pyrodrew Your healthcare system does not mean you're screwing anyone, much less the US. As for spending on defence... well some might say that's our masculine side as we like to protect our nice b!tches. The women are naturally better at nurturing and taking care of people.

Keep telling yourself that. We count on it.

	20-10-2004 12:38									#113
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That reminds me...Britain fumbled our vaccine order, so we're coming north to get yours.

	20-10-2004 12:39									#114
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Keep telling yourself that. We count on it.

Correction, I never said I was telling myself that hence the "some might say" phrase. But I did find the analogies entertaining even if they were awkward. Another analogy I've heard elsewhere is "Canada is our hat, while Mexico is our beard"... just as silly and pointless.

Edit: But if you do have links to how your healthcare system is screwing the US, I would be curious to see them.

	20-10-2004 12:44									#115
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk How do you feel about Kerry's plan to import all your drugs?

Follow up.

A. The drug companies do or may limit the amount of medication that is exported to Canada.

B. The Govt. of Canada may outlaw the export of drugs for individuals.

C. There are 30 million and some odd Canadians. There are 300 plus million Americans. DO THE MATH!

It's a fine idea, in a deranged world. It makes no sense as a basis for national policy on an important issue.

	20-10-2004 12:45									#116
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk That reminds me...Britain fumbled our vaccine order, so we're coming north to get yours.

And from what I saw some are going south to get Mexico's... but that's a bit more brave.

	20-10-2004 12:47									#117
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quote: Originally posted by The Mad Monk That reminds me...Britain fumbled our vaccine order, so we're coming north to get yours.

That's funny. A lot of Yanks have turned up wanting flu shots.

The Govs of Ontario and Alberta are telling physicians to let you sweat it.

The GoC says we have a small number of shots we can spare and we could make them available. Your govt has yet to make a statement about it.

	20-10-2004 12:51									#118
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quote: Originally posted by Pyrodrew Edit: But if you do have links to how your healthcare system is screwing the US, I would be curious to see them.

The arguement goes that you spend your money on defence, which also defends us, while we spend our money on healthcare since we don't have to spend much of anything on defence.

See?

	20-10-2004 12:51									#119
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Never before have so many rushed to get so little, from so few.