14-11-2004 12:26									#91
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DD and I are on the same side in this thread.

	14-11-2004 12:27									#92
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quote: If it's OK to blow up bus loads of school children by homicide bombers in the pursuit of the goals of those guys, why isn't it OK to start laying waste to civilian areas by aerial bombardment in the pursuit of the ends of them other guys?

Because one is the oppressed the other the oppressor. And the oppression is greater realized when the oppressed or the oppressor uses their force. Some people like the oppressor's politics and back their state terrorism. That's fine. I just like the other people's politics.

quote: Tell me, is it OK for one side to use poison gas and not the other? How about nuclear weapons?

Hey, I supported Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

quote: tarring and feathering tax collectors is on a wholly different level than suicide bombing public markets.

Because you like one group of guys and don't like the other? What about burning down native american villages simply because their nation threw in with the Brits?

	14-11-2004 12:29									#93
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Hamilton, ...

I have to apoligize. I missatributed the quote earlier. It really belongs to Major General Nathanael Greene. It was written in a letter to Hamilton. We also have George Washington's efforts to avoid the excesses he had witness while fighting the French on the frontier being taken to such an extent that he imported mercenaries to assist in the task of drilling his men.

	14-11-2004 12:31									#94
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Because you like one group of guys and don't like the other? What about burning down native american villages simply because their nation threw in with the Brits?

Who is denying atrocities committed against Amerindians during the Revolutionary War? Not me.

Such actions were really not justified, which reinforces my point that the suicide bombers in the Middle East of today, are just as bad.

	14-11-2004 12:32									#95
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Because one is the oppressed the other the oppressor. And the oppression is greater realized when the oppressed or the oppressor uses their force. Some people like the oppressor's politics and back their state terrorism. That's fine. I just like the other people's politics.

Right. So you support targeting civilians if you agree with the politics. That's all I wanted to know.

You are a ****wad, and the avatar suits you. Enjoy it.

	14-11-2004 12:34									#96
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quote: So you support targeting civilians if you agree with the politics.

As does just about everyone does. Stop trying to be all high and mighty. Do you think that Nagasaki and Hiroshima were war crimes? Do you think General Sherman in the American Civil War should have been strung up for deliberatly targeting civilians? Do you think Churchill should have been prosecuted for Dresden?

I just admit that I believe that targeting civilians can be justified if the cause is 'just'.

	14-11-2004 12:35									#97
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Imran, you're pointing out some acts of war that could be seen as atrocities, as if none of us would agree with you that some of those acts were indeed, atrocities.

Which in that case, does NOT undermine our position that Arafatty was too complacent, if not actively supportive, of terrorism which is WRONG, in our view.

	14-11-2004 12:37									#98
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Actually, there are more than a few who think Bomber Harris was over the line as far as war criminals from our side are concerned, and yes, that is for things like Dresden.

Do you think the US and NATO would engage in an area bombing campaign today?

	14-11-2004 12:37									#99
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And only a very few people on this site say that Nagasaki and Hiroshima were war crimes. Do you, MrFun?

	14-11-2004 12:40									#100
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That Arafatar is soooo 70s.

	14-11-2004 12:40									#101
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I terror and NYE is being an asshat.

	14-11-2004 12:40									#102
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I think he should have gone for one of Loins choices. Though I love how appropiate my sig is to this thread.

	14-11-2004 12:41									#103
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quote: That Arafatar is soooo 70s.

And, I'm sure sometime soon, Loin's #2 Arafat will be adopted.

	14-11-2004 12:44									#104
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One man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter.

People like Dick Cheney believed that Nelson Mandela was a terrorist. If so we need more like him.

With very few exceptions (OBL being one), if the US labels someone a terrorist it means that they are doing something noble.

Nuff said really.

	14-11-2004 12:44									#105
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Which in that case, does NOT undermine our position that Arafatty was too complacent, if not actively supportive, of terrorism which is WRONG, in our view.

Do you denounce all terrorism, or just the terrorist acts committed in support of political views you don't agree with?

	14-11-2004 12:45									#106
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actually the pic is from the early 80s, I presume, but the look, the look is so 70s.

In any case, my arafatar pwns all.

	14-11-2004 12:46									#107
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quote: Do you denounce all terrorism, or just the terrorist acts committed in support of political views you don't agree with?

I don't think the gay liberation movement has been that militant. Having said that, if they blew up Fred Phelps' church I don't think anyone would care.

	14-11-2004 12:46									#108
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Do you denounce all terrorism, or just the terrorist acts committed in support of political views you don't agree with?

My point exactly, UR. We back terrorism for views we like and are against terrorism for views we don't like... well, except for some pacifists like Ben Kenobi.

	14-11-2004 12:46									#109
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quote: With very few exceptions (OBL being one), if the US labels someone a terrorist it means that they are doing something noble.

You're just not hardcore enough for OBL.

	14-11-2004 12:46									#110
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Do you denounce all terrorism, or just the terrorist acts committed in support of political views you don't agree with?

Can we not draw a distinction between terrorism and other acts of atrocities? Or all atrocities, by definition, terrorist acts?

	14-11-2004 12:47									#111
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quote: My point exactly, UR. We back terrorism for views we like and are against terrorism for views we don't like... well, except for some pacifists like Ben Kenobi.

The meek shall surely get their heads kicked in and a cap in their ass. - J.H. Christ.

	14-11-2004 12:47									#112
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Do you denounce all terrorism, or just the terrorist acts committed in support of political views you don't agree with?

Does he get bonus points for believing slaughtering school kids is an assbackwards was to fight for Palestinian freedom?

	14-11-2004 12:47									#113
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui My point exactly, UR. We back terrorism for views we like and are against terrorism for views we don't like... well, except for some pacifists like Ben Kenobi.

This is hilarious sh!t coming from a Reaganite.


So why don't you see Reagan's imposition of dictatorships in Latin America as terrorist activity?

	14-11-2004 12:50									#114
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quote: Can we not draw a distinction between terrorism and other acts of atrocities? Or all atrocities, by definition, terrorist acts?

No.

Terrorism is a political word, hence it just means violent people you don't like. By any reasonable understanding of "terror" (the use of force to terrorize civilians into compliance) the United States is far and away the world's leading terrorist state.

Of course it can't mean that, "we" are by definition good and righteous!!!

The intellectual and moral poverty of US administrations rivals that of Idi Amin.

	14-11-2004 12:51									#115
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I think I'd like to see the reaction around here if the Israelis went after civilian targets without remorse, the way some like Hamas do.

On second thought, I really do not want to see that.

	14-11-2004 12:52									#116
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quote: So why don't you see Reagan's imposition of dictatorships in Latin America as terrorist activity?

Well imposition of dictatorships isn't a terrorist activity in itself. Backing groups killing civilians is supporting terrorism, but not terrorist in itself.

And... Did you NOT read the post? Even if it was supporting terrorist regimes, I kind of dislike Communism.

	14-11-2004 12:52									#117
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quote: So why don't you see Reagan's imposition of dictatorships in Latin America as terrorist activity?

I do. All the so called Islamic terrorism is chicken feed compared to what that bastard sponsored.

Of course our friendly capitalists are always ready to yell "terrorist" when some poor bunch of people decide it's time for some payback.

	14-11-2004 12:54									#118
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon quote: Can we not draw a distinction between terrorism and other acts of atrocities? Or all atrocities, by definition, terrorist acts? No. Terrorism is a political word, hence it just means violent people you don't like. By any reasonable understanding of "terror" (the use of force to terrorize civilians into compliance) the United States is far and away the world's leading terrorist state. Of course it can't mean that, "we" are by definition good and righteous!!! The intellectual and moral poverty of US administrations rivals that of Idi Amin.

Ok -- if the argument can be made that all atrocities are by definition, acts of terrorism, that still does not undermine my position that wiping out Amerindian villages is just as horrid as suicide bombings of public markets.

	14-11-2004 12:55									#119
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quote: I think I'd like to see the reaction around here if the Israelis went after civilian targets without remorse, the way some like Hamas do.

What do you mean, "if"?

Didn't they break the legs of every man in a village for throwing stones at tanks?

Haven't they been motoring over peoples' houses in tanks?

Haven't they been keeping millions of people under an apartheid system for 30 years?

Jeez. If the ANC had started bombing the crap out of white South Africans, I'd have cheered. They bloody deserved it, the racist scum.

	14-11-2004 12:55									#120
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quote: if the Israelis went after civilian targets without remorse

They have. Before Arafat alerted the world to the Palestinian plight, there had been villages wiped away by the Israelis.