26-12-2004 01:28									#211
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I agree with the suggestion that only 1 tech may be gifted per turn. The 'alliance system' is too strong as it stands... it really helped me last game, and in this game I got left behind for a couple of turns (as far as alliances go) and that hurt me.

	26-12-2004 05:07									#212
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: hmm how about strengthening the other governments by removing the cap on taxable cities?

I don't know about that- then there really wouldn't be much of an impetus to upgrade governments.

	26-12-2004 09:42									#213
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

While I am not sure I agree with Whoha's idea, there would still be a benefit to upgrading your government, both with the trade bonus (x1.5 for Monarchy, x 2 for Republic) and the taxation bonus (same multipliers). The advantage of the higher governments would just be lessened.

	26-12-2004 17:17									#214
	Increase the size of your Attachments

The Mafia wonder would also need to be replaced, because it'd have no effect.

	26-12-2004 21:31									#215
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

well, if needed I suppose it could go back to giving 5 gp per every city in the world (an upgrade from 1 gp).

	26-12-2004 23:20									#216
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

How about keeping the government benefits as it is, but restore the original high cost of revolution?

	26-12-2004 23:27									#217
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Meaning no production in the revolution turn.

While this would be simpler, I don't like this option either.

* Sparrowhawk who doesn't have any better solutions

Edit: Anyone care to start a sign up thread?

Last edited by Sparrowhawk on 28-12-2004 at 07:52

	30-12-2004 09:50									#218
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

So what does everyone vote?

I see that sparrowhawk wants to start a new signup thread, but what decisions have we made:

1. Start game with 20 gold coins.
2. ???

Has everyone spoken on these issues so far?

Maybe we can create a voting thread in another day or two?

	03-01-2005 01:58									#219
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

bump.

	03-01-2005 03:58									#220
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Let's first get a survey of what the biggest problems are right now:

In my opinion:
-Excessive allied tech gifting
-Complex math
-Cost of revolution too low
-Not enough different strategies on first turn

	03-01-2005 05:39									#221
	Full PM-box? Change here!

My views on Smiley's four mentioned problems:

- Excessive Tech Gifting: as the biggest abuser of this flaw in the game, I think that the proposed 1 tech per turn gift max is acceptable. I hope that we do not eliminate foreign aid all together, as it should still be a key part of the game.

- Complex Math: part of the game, and it cannot be eliminated without fundamentally changing the game. If anyone has any suggestions to eliminate some unneccessary portions I would consider them, but I don't think we are going to make significant change here (I do like Darkcloud's suggestion of eliminating the need for trade partners to be within their tech level distance away).

- Cost of revolution too low: I disagree, or people would be revolting to Monarchy rather then waiting until Republic. I think the revolutions should be left as is (including leaving the tax at 1/2 tax + one turn of production on the revolution turn).

- Not enough different strategies on the first turn: Agreed, and I think we solve this by increasing the starting gold as suggested. Not sure of the amount to increase it however, 20 gold sounds reasonable to me though.

I would also like to repost my previous suggestions that wonders be switched: Colleseum to Tech 1, Tower to Tech 2, Silk Road to Tech 4, Acropolis to Tech 5.

Having said all this, I am open to any proposed change

* Sparrowhawk

	05-01-2005 04:54									#222
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Oh yes, the wonder tech moving is a good succestion for game balance and logic.

Here's what I think that most of us can agree upon:

Thus some solutions (and rule changes):
1.) Turn One Start with 20 Gold.
2.) Colliseum to Tech 1, Tower to Tech 2, Silk Road to Tech 4, Acropolis to Tech 5.
3.) Eliminate need for trade partners to be x distance away

--
Issues to be solved:
1.) Should we limit tech giving to one tech/turn?
2.) Is revoultion cost too low?

****
And by the way, who's GMing the next game? Sparrowhawk?

Oh and Sparrowhawk I finally had a chance to look at your program. In some ways it seemed a bit more manual than the program I used- but it seemed a lot more manageable. Kudos to you!

	05-01-2005 05:37									#223
	Increase the size of your Attachments

my opinions on your "issues to be solved".....
1) Yes
2) No

____________________________

As for GMing, I have volunteered to do so, but only if no one else wants to. I would rather play then GM, but I am willing to GM

As for my "program" I think that is too strong a word, it is merely a spreadsheet, but I have found it makes GMing easier. I think your program is far superior, and with the bugs worked out (and maybe a how to guide from 's like me) it would make GMing a breeze I think.

* Sparrowhawk

	06-01-2005 00:09									#224
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I'll agree to the gifting of only one tech per turn.

Okay, then I think that we should get started- I just modified the rules document to reflect those changes, Sparrowhawk.

As soon as I can, I'll get the program to correspond to the new rule changes and then I'll be able to put together a 'how to' guide!

	13-01-2005 01:17									#225
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Just wondering, Sparrow, are you planning on starting a signupthread?

depending on my commitments, I might be able to GM a game in March/April. But not in February or May at all. After June, I should be pretty open as well.

	06-02-2005 04:22									#226
	Full PM-box? Change here!

When I originally volunteered to GM this game I beleived that by now it would almost be complete.

As it stands now, not only can I not GM a game, neither can I participate (I am away the last 2 weeks in February with little or no internet access).

I don't want my favourite of forum games to be forgotten however, and with Galactic Overlord, Nuclear War and Nascar all coming to a close very soon, now would seem to be the time to start a new game of society before it is another forgotten forum game.

Do we still have enough interest in this to play another?
Is anyone else willing to GM?
Will the start up thread take until the beginning of March letting me play in the next game or will I play in the one after that?

by the way, I apologize to the other players for volunteering to GM and then not carrying through with it, with the rules discussion this kinda was pushed to the back burner for me, and then in late January a family crisis came up that made me forget the game completely for a time, hopefully we can still keep it going however.

* Sparrowhawk

	07-02-2005 07:36									#227
	Support Apolyton

quote: and then in late January a family crisis came up that made me forget the game completely for a time, hopefully we can still keep it going however.

Okay, I understand that.

On the GM issue- I am unable to commit to GMing a game of this magnitude, even with the program until at least March.

	07-02-2005 08:08									#228
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I'll start working on a streamlined version after Galactic Overlord VII finishes.

	07-02-2005 09:26									#229
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

for what it's worth i'd participate in a game of society