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Zeiter
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Yes, especially when there are infinitely many modifications for it. About six months ago I completed a modern Earth mod of the alpha.txt file, and it was like a whole new game, and actually, in my opinion, even better than the regular. And then when I play now on my Earth map, man, those Eurasian wars get crazy. Yang with the PTS spreading across Eurasia like a virus is NOT easy to deal with, especially with this mod.
In fact, I don't know if I can go back to regular SMAC now.
I'm also in the process of making a cold war scenario, based off of this alpha.txt. Hmmmm, might make an interesting 1 or 2-team democracy game, eh?
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Darsnan
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New Syracuse, Beta Prime
Dec 2001
time: 00:25
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Now that we've heard from the Introverts with the Oedipal Complex of wanting to go back to the womb of Humanity, lets hear from the Extroverts: why go back to a planet that has probably been turned into a charred cinderblock (and if it hasn't, then how come our "parents" haven't written, or sent a second ship to check up on their errant ofspring?)? And why stay on just Planet? The wreckage from those Progenitor Battlecruisers have to be insystem somewhere. Find just one of them with a working FTL Drive (or a Progenitor computer with the FTL technology on it), and along with the Progenitor's starmaps, why the Galaxy beckons before us to be explored!
To sum it up: one of Mankind's strongest traits has been his desire, and drive, to explore the unknown. From our earliest anscestors who first came down out of the trees to explore the savanah's around them, to Mankind's first foray into the stars (i.e. the Unity), those that have passed on the true genes that make us unique are those that ventured the farthest.
So, you can either stay up in the trees where it is safe and you know what to expect, or you can strike out into the unknown lands that are the savanah's of space that surround us....
D
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Flubber
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With a view of the Rockies
Aug 2000
time: 22:25
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I doubt I will ever stop playing
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Dis
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Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Zeiter
Yes, especially when there are infinitely many modifications for it. About six months ago I completed a modern Earth mod of the alpha.txt file, and it was like a whole new game, and actually, in my opinion, even better than the regular. And then when I play now on my Earth map, man, those Eurasian wars get crazy. Yang with the PTS spreading across Eurasia like a virus is NOT easy to deal with, especially with this mod.
In fact, I don't know if I can go back to regular SMAC now.
I'm also in the process of making a cold war scenario, based off of this alpha.txt. Hmmmm, might make an interesting 1 or 2-team democracy game, eh? |
I was going to ask where you found it, but I see you modded it yourself. What did you change?
I have played on earth maps before, it's an interesting change of pace. It can be pretty easy one one's with no fungus. But it helps the ai out a great deal as well not having all that fungus to clear.
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Zeiter
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quote:
I was going to ask where you found it, but I see you modded it yourself. What did you change? |
Ah, I almost forgot, I've made a few minor modifications since my last version of it, and I've supplied concepts.txt, labels.txt, etc. files to go along with it. I've also tweaked my Earth map a little bit to make the polar regions less habitable, place resources where they actually occur in real life, and trim up some coastlines. This Earth map version is without pods, which is more realistic. Anyways, it's here:
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...906#post3496438
What changes did I make with my modern Earth alpha.txt? The biggest change is that the tech tree is completely different. Not just the names, but the order and attributes of each one too. Crawlers are completely disabled (and I've become firmly convinced after playing like this that this is how it's supposed to be). Air power has been diminished in a number of ways, although it's still very potent. But this mod forces you to integrate strong land forces with the air power, especially if you are up against a lot of AAA defenders (which get +150%). Comm jammers are slightly less useful (+25%), making tank warfare much more feasible. Tanks have been moved down to around the early middle game. Infantry and, later, Tank transports become very tactically useful. Artillery can do up to 100% damage in the open and up to 60% in a bunker or base. Probe teams are only 1 move units until you get the rover chassis, which is in the middle early game. Native units are now insurgents, and now they have a cool icon. Genejack factories are now assembly line factories. They become available at IA, but they create 2 extra drones instead of just 1. This simulates quite well, I've found, the boons and difficulties of industrialization as it really was in history.
The computer rocks with this mod. I was in a genuine battle with computer yang in one game, and he used 3 planet busters on me, taking out key bases with SP's in them (such as one with the HSA. Yeah, that hurt). It took a good 40 years of heavy fighting, with losses of over 150 units on both sides (actually, my losses were about 140 and his were about 250) to subdue him. I don't know about you, but I'm not used to those kind of losses.
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Zeiter
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Sure, I'll walk you through it. First, go to your SMAC file directory. Make copies of all of the .txt files that you'll be changing (such as alpha.txt, concepts.txt, labels.txt, menu.txt, tutor.txt, script.txt). I usually name the copies "alphareal.txt, conceptsreal.txt," etc.) To change the name of a file, just click once on the file, wait a second, click again on the file name, and edit the file name. Then place the modded files that you extracted from the zip file in this directory. Rename these files (modernearthalpha.txt, conceptsME.txt, etc.) to the names that the game will recognize (alpha.txt, concepts.txt, etc.). Then you are ready to play. Loading the earth map should work just like any other map. And I don't think that it should mess up anything with regards to SMAX.
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Kaboth
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Wollongong
Dec 2003
time: 05:25
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You can get SMAC overload but you can never forget SMAC; its such an incredibly immersive game and is one of the best examples of video games as an art form. 30 years, 100 hundred years nothing will stop "those wise enough to recognise this deep thrumming of our common pulse."
Last edited by Kaboth on 25-02-2005 at 07:31
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korn469
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Poetic Justic
Apr 1999
time: 00:25
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Well it's been years since I've played SMAC, and I don't know if I will ever play it again. The game has one major shortcoming and that is a completely inferior AI. I guess I could reinstall if and try to play multiplayer, but I don't have the time for PBEM. So I guess it's possible to try and find an IP game or something, but I'm not going to do that.
Having said that I do think that SMAC is a great game. I spent hundreds maybe thousands of hours playing it and it entertained me quite a bit, possibly more than any other game I have ever played. I think part of the reason I won't go back to the game is that I've mined out all of the enjoyment I could possibly get from the game, and any further play would simply result in disappointment because the shortcomings of the game would still crop up. Maybe in a few years I will change my mind and play it again, I can't say for sure.
Anyways out of all of the civ games (Civ, Colonization, Civ2, SMAC, Civ3) I think that SMAC is probably my favorite. It has the best imersion factor by far, and that's what makes it so great. The back story, although purposely incomplete, certainly seemed to follow a path. From the data files in the original SMAC it seems like the Gaians won by a transcendence victory after wiping out the Spartans or seizing the last of their cities after worms had wiped them out. The tech blurbs, the wonder movies, all of the little touches is what made this game so great.
As far as gameplay goes, I think that Civ3 surpassed it in many ways. If you examine the data files closely it seems like Civ3's culture system might have been in either in protypical stage and not ready for primetime yet, or a passing though that SMAC never realized. It seems like their is a resource called psi that cities could have generated at one point. Yet they never implemented it in the game. So culture, along with leaders, real air missions, armies, drafting, mobilization, different city levels, small wonders, global unit support, and those are the ones I can think of just off the top of my head, make's SMAC game play obsolete. Yet SMAC certainly has the best diplomatic model, and social engineering far surpasses governments. Both of those two things not only make the game more enjoyable than Civ3, but add just as much to the game's imersive quality as the back story. When I'm rampaging through Zack's territory and he begs me for mercy, by signing up as a submissive pact brother, that's classic. Just as fighting Yang to the death after a PB exchange. Then trade income, sanctions, Talents/workers/drones (SMAC has a much better implementation than Civ3), etc, certainly means that Civ3 either took a few steps sideways or back. Then as far as game balance goes SMAC has better balance in some ways. I never felt limited by SMAC. SMAC never constrained the player, and it always seemed like there was something interesting to do. Civ3 felt like it had a straight jacket around players so that they wouldn't blow out the AI by too much. That resulted in running out of things to build in the later stages of the game, units that didn't seem balanced at all (while unlikely or almost impossible spearmen could beat tanks in Civ3, so high tech units usually couldn't dominate...all of that research and shields spent on those units for nothing while tech was almost TOO dominating in SMAC), and while many of Civ3's design decision helped the AI it left me with an empty feeling after playing the game. I felt channeled into one single way of playing the game, because every strategy seemed to require the same playstyle, and the game had no personality or polish. SMAc had tons of personality, intellectual polish, and let the player decide on how they felt like laying. It was far easier to roleplay in SMAC. However, the AI certainly didn't understand all of the implications of the rules, and couldn't really use any of the units besides land units, and Planet busters. If SMAC had of had Civ3's no collateral damage rule then the AI would have been far more competitive. As it was I could set up a choke up and have like three elite rovers with slightly better tech than the AI that could take out stack after huge stack. Then if you consider how humans could use crawlers or choppers compare
to the AI this usually meant the death of the computer.
Graphically SMAC is a mixed bag. I think that SMAC's main map is ugly and doesn't have enough differences, and the unit design wasn't good at all. Wonder screens, wonder movies, and other little touches were quite nice. The main problem with the main map in SMAC is that it only had three different variables: altitude, moisture, and rockiness. Also altitude was fairly stilted so that it always resembled rolling hills. If SMAC could of had more extreme differences in altitude (not higher, just the ability for more abrupt altitude changes), and factored in temperature (yes Alpha Centauri needs snow!) then the map might have been better. As it is, without forrest or the monsoon jungle, it always looked like rooling hills in a desert. Although graphics don't really matter that much, they do make some difference, and I don't think it has aged that well. I think that SMAC could have used a Civ2/Civ3 approach to the map to have achieved a better presentation in the long run.
I guess I'll finish this since it's became far longer than what I expected. SMAC is the best of the Civ series because it has rules designed with players and not the AI in mind. It also has a wonder back story, and tons of nice little touches that imerses the player in the game. I will never forget my first few games of SMAC. They filled me with a sense of wonderment, exceitement, awe, and I felt like I was genuinely exploring a different word. I hadsn't felt that since my first game of the original Civ, and I didn't feel it as intensely as I did playing SMAC. All of the little things added up to make the sum of the parts more than any little feature. Seriously tiny things like the screen that recorded the dates of important events had a large impact on the overall intellectual presentation of the game. SMAC had fairly ugly graphics, but that didn't deter me from the game. It had horrible AI, which ultimately killed my fun. It's one thing if the AI couldn't have ever beat me, but it seriously couldn't handle some parts of the game (like air units). This made me feel like I was shooting fish in a barrel everytime I played, and If I didn't have a completely easy game it was because I was slipping at some point. I mean I had a transcendence victory once in 70 some turns, hell it might have been in the high sixties, (though zso-zso beat my record with an amazing game as the gaians if I remember correctly, I knew I couldn't beat him, because I remember thinking "this is my best game ever, I'm playing at the limit of my ability). I like that SMAC respected the player. I fear that Civ4 will dumb down the civ series far more than civ3 did, instead of elevate it like SMAC. Maybe good AI can only come from such restraint, but I hope not. Social engineering, the planetary counsel, and diplomatic interactions certainly have no equal in the civ series. I would say that SMAC's social engineering even beats Paradox's slider system, though more in interesting strategic consequences and imersion rather than total ability to customize your civ. SMAC certainly gave the player strategic choices, whereas Civ3 didn't. Now if only they could combine all of Civ3's gameplay improvements into SMAC's frame work. That would be the ultimate game to me.
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Dis
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Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:25
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quote:
Originally posted by molly bloom
Other than games based on history, I've never found a game that gives so much, in terms of background, analysis, depth, mysteries, variation, subtle shading, and of course at times, teeth grinding frustration.
Usually when you end up one neighbour away from Yang who completely crushes your next door neighbour who has just discovered Doctrine: Air Power before you have adequate air defences in place.
Those blue planes just keep comin' over and going pop pop boom on your crawlers and formers.... |
Variation is the key I think. In civ3 I actually enjoyed the game, but too oftem my empires look the same, and I have to play the same exact way to win.
There's many more ways to win in SMAC (I'm not talking victory conditions, but tactics).
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Ka Plewy
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quote:
Originally posted by korn469
Well it's been years since I've played SMAC, and I don't know if I will ever play it again. The game has one major shortcoming and that is a completely inferior AI. I guess I could reinstall if and try to play multiplayer, but I don't have the time for PBEM. So I guess it's possible to try and find an IP game or something, but I'm not going to do that.
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PBEM's take virtually no time, a friend and I play a couple of games a year this way. When we get large, maybe 1/2 to hour per turn. We play long drawn out builder style games.
IP games take a lot of time all at one sitting, PBEM spread that time out. I honestly can't see how you don't have time for a PBEM, if you think you might have time for an IP game.
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17-02-2005 05:00
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