05-03-2005 16:45									#61
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Apparently you guys like to laugh at yourselves.

Thread started by an American, 47/64 responses from Americans.

	05-03-2005 16:56									#62
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quote: Originally posted by KrazyHorse Apparently you guys like to laugh at yourselves. Thread started by an American, 47/64 responses from Americans.

We get more fun from that then going through 3+page threads counting the nationalities.

	05-03-2005 17:02									#63
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"The reason there are fewer foreign students attending US universities is because since 9/11 the government has made it much more difficult for foreigners to get visas. The news is full of stories about foreigners who have been accepted at American universities but who can't get visas to enter the country."

This is VERY true. Also it's not the only reason, well it derives from this... people are simply afraid, if they apply for visas, that some undereducated evil bastard at the customs will take their visas, take them to the room in the back and put then to prison or something. You may laugh at this, but this is a very common .. scare. You know this scare only applies for NK and US these days. Yeah, only the ones who have something to hide have to worry about it? WRONG.

It would be better for some to get over their own salivating arrogance and to recognize the reality. If the US does not keep being on the top of where people want to go to Uni's to finish their degrees or what ever, it will simply stop being the number 1 ANYTHING soon. ****, only thing it is no1 these days is some economical facts and military. Face it, it's on the downfall soon if it doesn't get directed into better direction, and that starts from attracting prominent people there again. Now it attracts terrorists and not the prominent people.

And YES, US is definitely NOT the place to be anymore, as the only option. It is a great choice, yes.. but these days so is Canada, EU region, some Asian places.. it's not so clear anymore even if it still leads. The point is, the future does not look better, it looks worse unless something is done, and this is for your benefit so don't get your panties on a twist 'well stay the hell away then commie111!'. Take these words and learn from it, it's about ****ing time to start getting back on the track again, or start the downfall. And how do you know it will happen? I know it, because there are now other options that seems to be as good as US is for many things, the things that makes it the top player. Mainly, it's attractiveness. Get a boobjob.

	05-03-2005 17:06									#64
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Personally, I am sort of frightened by so many people of ALL nationalities not knowing these things....

	05-03-2005 17:13									#65
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quote: Originally posted by Pyrodrew We get more fun from that then going through 3+page threads counting the nationalities.

Click on the part on the forum index which tells you how many responses there are to this thread...

	05-03-2005 17:16									#66
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NM

	05-03-2005 17:43									#67
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quote: The United States is 49th in the world in literacy (the New York Times, Dec. 12, 2004).

I'd like to respond to this, but I couldn't read the article.

According to the statistics I could find, the US has a literacy rate of 97%. I don't think it's nearly as serious a problem as the above suggests.

	05-03-2005 18:42									#68
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara [ • Foreign applications to U.S. grad schools declined 28 percent last year. Foreign student enrollment on all levels fell for the first time in three decades, but increased greatly in Europe and China. Last year Chinese grad-school graduates in the U.S. dropped 56 percent, Indians 51 percent, South Koreans 28 percent (NYT, Dec. 21, 2004). We're not the place to be anymore.

This is mostly a function of the climate after 9-11, than the schools I believe. It is a terrible hassle to come to the US to study now.

Jon Miller

	05-03-2005 19:46									#69
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quote: Originally posted by KrazyHorse quote: -Electrons are smaller than atoms. (True) Electrons have no well-defined size...

Are you suggesting that the part is larger than the whole?

quote: Originally posted by KrazyHorse quote: -The center of the Earth is hot. (True) Pffft. It's not even on the weak scale.

compared to the Earths surface I'm sure...

	05-03-2005 20:21									#70
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quote: Originally posted by Edan I don't think it's nearly as serious a problem as the above suggests.

You should do alot more than that on several of his topics.

quote: Originally posted by Ramo I take it that you're gonna pay the Austin Chronicle for adding these rediculous extra publishing costs?

Why should I? How much extra money would it have taken to follow the rules I was taught in English 101 and put in the title of the article cited?

	05-03-2005 20:31									#71
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin By your logic I could claim 25% of Americans believe bananas are space aliens yet it must be true.

Uh, no...where did you get that from my "logic?" Nothing I said remotely correlates to that.

All I said that arguments that state "I haven't personally encountered it, so ergo it isn't true" are so obviously stupid that only an idiot would proffer them.

quote: That's about as likely as the bogus claim that 25% of Americans believe the sun rotates around the Earth.

And Ramo showed you that the claim is NOT bogus. Care to rescind your unfounded comments now?

quote: Especially given that I've already pointed out several factual errors and/or obvious omitions with this op-ed piece. The guys screwed up several facts and this one smells fishy too.

You haven't pointed out a single "factual error" that I've seen, just pointed out some omissions/logical errors on the part of who wrote it.

Regardless, even if you had shown a factual error, it wouldn't mean everything in it is wrong. Care to guess which fallacy that is?

I'm not agreeing with this piece in toto, but there are definitely some things pointed out within it that are of valid concern to me as an American.

	05-03-2005 20:33									#72
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel Personally, I am sort of frightened by so many people of ALL nationalities not knowing these things....

Indeed. Reminds of the Jay Leno bit where he goes to the "person on the street" and asks basic questions you would think everyone would know. The answers are often frightening.

Of course, we don't see in those bits all the people he approached who answered the questions correctly.

	05-03-2005 21:23									#73
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc When only one source is easily checked, warning bells go off for me that someone is either lieing or grossly missrepresenting their facts.

I guess you aren't much one for grading term papers. What, no hyperlinks on this paper!?! He must be making up his facts!

	05-03-2005 21:32									#74
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quote: This puts Europeans at a level of prosperity on par with states such as Arkansas, Mississippi and West Virginia.

I can assure you Europeans are better off than Arkansans. After you're done whining about GDP, look up things like divorce, poverty, hunger, availability of healthcare, education, and other development indicators that look at more than a few numbers, and see the difference.

quote: • One-third of all U.S. children are born out of wedlock. One-half of all U.S. children will live in a one-parent house (CNN, Dec. 10, 2004).

(One to add, I think it was el freako that said we ought to be glad for our outrageous teenage pregnancy rates, as teen mothers account for 1/3 of the births gap between the US and the EU)
This is probably the most disturbing stat in the article. Is there any similar comparison for any European or developed Eastern nation?

	05-03-2005 21:32									#75
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Polls are often junk unless they are done correctly. I have seen anti-abortion rights people claim that 80% of the American population is anti-abortion (true figure is closer to 1/3). How'd they get that poll result? They passed out the poll at a Sunday Catholic mass in a consevative town.

While that may be the case for a specific survey, depending on how you interpret the data, you could come up with the number they did. It also depends on the questions asked. "Should the government allow partial birth abortions?" will get you a very different set of results from, "Should abortion be legal?"

In the case of this poll (Earth centric universe), there isn't a lot of wiggle room for such things. Either the Earth goes roun the sun or it doesn't. As far as those who think the Earth goes round the sun in a single day, I suspect its people who got their terminology mixed up, rotation versus revolution.

	05-03-2005 21:41									#76
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quote: Originally posted by Edan According to the statistics I could find, the US has a literacy rate of 97%. I don't think it's nearly as serious a problem as the above suggests.

It depends on how you measure literacy. I've seen stats claiming that about 30% of Americans are functionally illiterate. I'm sure you could measure literacy on a scale, so that you could both be literate, but one could be more or less literate than the other.

	05-03-2005 21:44									#77
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I think the simple fact is that the distribution of wealth in the US is skewed more than in any other developed country- hence statistics that come from poverty, like infant mortality, are bound to be higher in the US, since we have both more millionaries and more people feeling huger than the Europeans.

	05-03-2005 22:21									#78
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Divorce rates
Arkansas: 6.6 per 1,000 (2001)
Russia, the highest in Europe: 3.65 per 1,000 (1999)
England: 2.66 per 1,000 (1999)
France: 1.98 per 1,000 (1999)
Italy: 0.6 per 1,000 (2000)

Poverty rate
32% of AR children under age 18 live in poverty in addition to 18% of the regular 18-65 year old population.
The total German poverty rate is 13.5%.

Hunger
12.6% of Arkansas households have limited access to healthy, safe food. 4.6% of Arkansan households suffer from severe hunger or lack of access to food.
I couldn't even find a percentage for Europe.

Healthcare - Life Expectancy
White males in Arkansas have a life expectancy of 73 years (white females, 79 years.) Black males have a life expectancy of 66 years (black females, 74 years).
Ireland males altogether have a life expectancy of 75 years (females, 80).

Education
20% of Arkansas adults read below a sixth-grade reading level.
Germany has a literacy rate of 99%.

Obviously Arkansas blows away all those fancy pants Europeans.

	05-03-2005 22:30									#79
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin By your logic I could claim 25% of Americans believe bananas are space aliens yet it must be true. That's about as likely as the bogus claim that 25% of Americans believe the sun rotates around the Earth.

Errr... sounds perfectly plausible in a country where many more people believe in creationism than in evolution...

	05-03-2005 22:32									#80
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara USA! USA! USA!

now propose a solution.

	05-03-2005 22:34									#81
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Stop starving the government and believing the market will solve all your problems. Even a mildly social-democratic government like Canada's would be an improvement over what we have.

	05-03-2005 22:36									#82
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So throw more money at groups like the NEA?

	05-03-2005 22:37									#83
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Better than throwing money at the military and police.

	05-03-2005 22:40									#84
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara I guess you aren't much one for grading term papers.

put in the title of the article cited /= hyperlinks

	05-03-2005 22:41									#85
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Whoha, the solution, partial one, is to make US more acrattive again for young prominent people that makes sure the braindomain STAYS in the US. It currently works, but will slowly decline. THis means, stop with the student visa hassles, stop with the visa hassles all together and change it how it used to be. I doubt many terrorists will be caught with these new 'improvements'.

And of course, do better PR and image campagning in the world. The cool US seems to be fading away slowly, when it is gripping itself in terrorism, threats, paranoia, fear and loathing . You know.. what about the cool stuff, that is still there, it's just not promoted anymore. Basically the government should stfu for a while with the fear mongering, and start with the cool mongering. You know... cool stuff. Stop saying freedom and libert 30934 times in a speech, it makes them look like they think every world citizen is somehow retarded so it must be said thousand times. Out with the new and in with the cool.

And I'm not saying it should be liberal leader, heck, continue with conservative ones, however start campagning the cool and the... just stop making the world look every day how this and that and fear and bombs and **** and crap. Even though it happens outside US mostly, the actual flying of crap, you know it's still not cool because the cool factor is gone. At least bring it to the side with it.

Don't believe I'm right? Fine, what ever, of course then again I'm just stating the obvious here. NOTE: I'm not suggesting any changes in actual plans or execution of them. Just marketing. And how the leadership behaves. They should take a vacation or something, so we can focus on the good things, which are there already, but under a blanket now.

	05-03-2005 22:45									#86
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Pekka, immigration isn't gonna solve all our other problems. You just want to get in the U.S.

	05-03-2005 22:50									#87
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che, hey, did I say in the first sentence that partial solution to a problem... well I did. It IS a problem, the new arrangement are a problem. Many people will just choose something else instead.

And how nice that you see behind my words some agendas, that actually isn't it. I would have no problems with student visas, plus I do study in here already, in a great school.

Underline the power of getting the top notch scientists etc to work in there and line up is stupid. That's partial reason why US dominates today. Give it away, who knows what happens but it's not something positive.

Basically I don't understand what you are even saying here. You disagree with me? I don't think you really disagree with me. Your racist ways just again thinks you know me and my motivation for all things and that it dictates my opinions. Well FYI I'm sometimes pragmatic too, just like today. And now I'll go eat something.

	05-03-2005 22:51									#88
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underline = undermine

	05-03-2005 23:09									#89
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Are you using racist to me, anything disagreeing with Pekka, or is there some assumption I want to keep immigrants out of my country? I'm for reasonably open borders (with safeguards to catch criminals and terrorists.

The big problem is that our public discourse for the last 25 years has been anti-government, antigovernment, antigovernment. The result has been dismantling even the meager protections from the market that we had. This means more ignorance, more sickness, more premature death, more unhappiness, so that a few more people can get richer. America needs social democracy if it wants a future as something other than a land of ignorance and poverty.

It 's funny. My people are choosing to go into their own dark age.

	05-03-2005 23:14									#90
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You are racist because you are against me even though I would save your life if I had the power to do so. You have juvenile angst against me, prolly because you feel my superiority and you need to bash me. I won't be so arrogant to think that I know the exact reasons behind your anger, but then again there's nothing I can do to stop it, because it's your right and I won't be someone else. I am my own ethnicity, race and group. And you hate me because of my race, ethnicity and the group I belong to, thus you are a racist, because I have done nothing bad to you. Simple, and true. But I wish you well anyway, because that's the caliber of a man I am.