23-03-2005 03:00									#91
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

That's great... if you run on top of a source build, it will be better. Still, running on a separate source build will be good for you... but you should really test it with the current build. Why? Because that's what most players use now... and frankly, it doesn't make much sense to have a separate build required for your mod. For instance, the up to 12 civs thing can just be mentioned in the readme. The source build is upgraded constantly with new changes, and maintaining and upgrading a separate build for AoM is not feasible.

Same goes for cheat editor. Disabling access to it from the game won't do much good... if people want to cheat, let them. I know I never will, but someone may want to.

I hope you see my point .

Oh, about the King unit... I understand if it dies, the civ loses? If so, isn't that a problem for the AI?

	23-03-2005 03:20									#92
	Full PM-box? Change here!

"Oh, about the King unit... I understand if it dies, the civ loses?"

This is not Civ 3 where all cities turn to rubble if the King dies(stupid concept)

Succession is only an issue for the human. If he is without a King after turn 120, he incurs a -3 happiness hit and there is a 15% chance of a rebellion until he gets another king by building/rushing/disbanding units.

The king lives for 40-80 turns. When your current king reaches 30 turns you get a warning to build another. However, you cannot simply build a pile of kings and not worry about it as there is a too many kings issue. If you have more than one king, another counter starts and if it gets to above 30, there is a chance of a succession rebellion, where the next king leaves and casues a rebellion where 1-4 cities are attacked by enemy forces.

So the idea is to manage your succession, have the replacement King arrive when the main king is about 40 turns old.

The Ai does not have Kings (unless by some freak they get one in a ruin) and no succession. They do however, surrender if at war and reach the required inferiority. The starting default is 5 to 1, so if you are at war with an AI and take a city, if you have a 5 to 1 superiority in forces and cities, there is a chance the rest of the AI will surrender, cities intact, to you(rather than turn to piles of rubble). It is a big achievement, I have never had more than 2 in a game, and you get the triumph special effect and fanfare. If one AI surrenders to you, the surrender ratio goes up 1, so the next one requires a 6 to 1 superiority.

This allows you, early in the game (pre turn 200) to be an Alexander or Caesar, conquer a nation and have a triumph. Later it gets harder and harder, but not impossible. Grand startegy becomes really important.

One of the best things in AOM, thanks to Peter Triggs for the idea and base code.

	23-03-2005 04:01									#93
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Surrender idea . Definitely many situations in the ancient age where it makes sense for the AI to surrender, with a 20-city empire beating on its 2 cities. Very, very nice .

	23-03-2005 04:42									#94
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Can't wait to have a go at this now..........

	23-03-2005 05:55									#95
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Another 2 questions, the game has been tested with more than 8 rival civs? And with ultra gigantic map?

	23-03-2005 06:12									#96
	Increase Your PM Length

AOM has been developed and tested for ultra gig map (which is about 50% larger than the normal gigantic) and 8+civs(I usually have 10). Mainly land and continent settings.

You need access to land based resources to exploit them and on a smaller map, there will not be that much available.

	23-03-2005 08:48									#97
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

you know how CtC has city ratio and unit count ratio w/ default at 3 to 1, and it has been incredibly hard to get my unit counts over double theirs, so if you do unit count needs 5to1, it pretty much is just going to save the winner a few units...

	23-03-2005 08:59									#98
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

The surrender ration intial value can be selected from between 2 to 1 and 5 to one. It defaults to 5 to 1 if none is selected. I always play with 5 to 1 as I feel it should not be too easy.

Each time an empire surrenders, it goes up by 1 because the Human can expand better than a lot of the AI.

	23-03-2005 09:11									#99
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I have a 56k modem and getright - as long as the server has reuming ability I don't care how long it takes to download since I have unlimited hours per month...any way to save 5 bucks! :wink:

	23-03-2005 11:23									#100
	Suffering from ads?

I could download 400mb in short order. No problems there.

	23-03-2005 12:45									#101
	Inflate your Upload Space

I can now announce that we will be hosting the full version of AOM

This should all be complete in the following days....

	23-03-2005 13:04									#102
	Get a bigger avatar today!

to Markos!



ACK!

	23-03-2005 17:22									#103
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Excellent.

Although of course this means I'll have to find a copy of CTP2 somewhere.

	23-03-2005 17:29									#104
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Skanky, I'm sure that can't be much of a problem, the game's free now, isn't it? I mean, with the source code being released and the game not supported anymore, I guess it's free for all?

Oh, and:

	23-03-2005 17:43									#105
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Nikolai Skanky, I'm sure that can't be much of a problem, the game's free now, isn't it? I mean, with the source code being released and the game not supported anymore, I guess it's free for all?

Open Source != Freeware

From the Source Code Project FAQ:

quote: 6) Why did Activision release the source code? / How about making a no-CD patch? You may wonder why Activision would release the source code: surely, if anyone can compile the game and edit it as they see fit, can't they just remove the copyright protection and play the game without paying for it? The answer is that they covered this option: the data and media files are not included in the source code file, so you still need to buy a copy of the CD to be able to use the code. Also, the EULA (user agreement) is set up in such a way that changing the game so that the original game is no longer needed to be able play is strictly forbidden (this means no no-cd patches). Basically, we may edit the game as we see fit, as long as resulting updates/new products still requires the CtP2 CD to play. Releasing the source code was a very generous act of Activision which most software companies would never even consider

And support for the game was never stopped, it has always continued to exist on Apolyton

Skanky,
Stankarp managed to get his hands on a few new copies of CtP2 and offers them for sale (at cost price) on his website (the one he links to in the first post). Considering you both live down under, that's probably the cheapest way for you to get a (new) copy...

	23-03-2005 17:55									#106
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Sorry, my fault. I saw it on a couple of sites for abadonware a few months ago IIRC you see, so I linked the release of the source code and that.

	23-03-2005 18:00									#107
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Skanky Burns Excellent. Although of course this means I'll have to find a copy of CTP2 somewhere.

PM me if you have trouble.

	23-03-2005 22:37									#108
	Increase the size of your Attachments

BTW, if you're considering downloading CtP2, it won't work. You need a legit copy. If you download, you'll get a cracked exe, but the source code build exe checks for the original game CD. And the source code build is much better, so unless you want to be stuck with a game that has many more crashes, bugs and less options... just get yourself an original copy. It's somewhat rare, but also very cheap.

	23-03-2005 22:44									#109
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I think you can still get the Explosiv release. I bought it around the time that the source code was released.

Asmodean

	24-03-2005 07:30									#110
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

nice, we got so many new people for CtP2... thanx Stan
and for the release,

Last edited by HuangShang on 24-03-2005 at 07:50

	24-03-2005 08:49									#111
	Put an end to popups!

I think we might have are CtP3 in AOM . I dont think Activision could do a better than what the fans have done to rebuild CtP2. Hail to Stan for AOM. But must give credit to the early mod makers because they kept at it when Activision no longer cared one way or the other. Cant wait for Ages of Man feel it will be a empire builders dream game.

	24-03-2005 09:55									#112
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

So...when's the release date?

	24-03-2005 10:08									#113
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Next month.

	24-03-2005 12:21									#114
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

The Draft Readme is ready to look at:
http://www.theagesofman.net/index.html

	24-03-2005 17:23									#115
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Hillarious readme. Two more questions.

1) Do the AIs fight wars with each other?
2) The original Frenzy AI had a big problem where you would in fact be unable to have peace with a civ you have attacked ever again. Basically, you signed a peace treaty, and they would attack you the next time they had units near you, often within 3 turns after peace treaty. Have you fixed that? I.e., can you fight some civ, then sign a peace treaty and actually have it last?

	24-03-2005 19:54									#116
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Stankarp is their a way to pay without putting credit card details online at all?
Put it this way i recently sent David Braben my £5 in the form of a uk postal order, as i was playing elite3(shareware).
I would be more than happy to mail an international money order or some such thing. Have a think about it atleast, as i'm sure many people would like the option

I could also then send my donation

	24-03-2005 19:58									#117
	Increase Your PM Length

CoT youre in England right? Send me it and ill pay Stan with paypal if you want?

	25-03-2005 01:46									#118
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

...I'll only read through the first pages...

stankarp, first I'd like to commend you and now I have a few comments for you:

1) Have you tried working out a deal with Activision for sharing profits with them? Of course you would have to establish a price first for gaining a profit, but possibly trying to share half of the profit with Activision might will them to your side.

2) You did a tremendous job on your website; it looks fantastic. Have you tried looking at godaddy.com? From what I know of them, especially since a coworker of mine works for them, they have good rates on hosting the site. As you put it on your post explaining the costs in the first page, it seems as if you're losing money anyways so paying for server costs per month may amount to all the same result.

3) Showcasing your work to a game company somehow might be a good idea if you were interested.

4) Have you thought about recreating the basis of the code yourself? If you're able to create a project this impressive yourself I'm sure spending another year or so on the engine of the game wouldn't be a problem for your expertise, or you could always try to recruit someone to do it for you.


Great work on the game I commend you and good luck.

	25-03-2005 02:56									#119
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Does this play into the modern age? Tanks, bombers, carriers, etc. etc.???

	25-03-2005 03:16									#120
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by DCMike Does this play into the modern age? Tanks, bombers, carriers, etc. etc.???

" main campaign runs from 5000BC to 2300AD."

http://www.theagesofman.net/about.html