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Edan
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Huh? |
They rejected a plan to hold a referendum on Gaza.
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lord of the mark
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FUKCOV - Former United Kingdom Colony of Virginia
Dec 2000
time: 00:37
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quote:
Originally posted by Azazel
nothing more than an ad-hominem. The fact that the statement is hypocritical from them doen't make the statement untrue.
Sharon, on all political fronts  |
It makes it irrelevant. Sharon won with a strategy that seemed to be the best at the time of the election, given circumstances at that time. While some of his voters may have been ideologically averse to land for peace, many undoubtedly saw no opening for it then, and trusted Sharon to hold on for a better deal than Barak or Mitzna, the latter of whom wanted to negotiate with Arafat, IIUC.
Now Arafat is dead, the US is in Iraq, and the geopolitical situation is different - but the long term strategic/demographic dilemma remains. Polls indicate that in THESE circumstances the maj of Israelis, including many who voted for Sharon before, IIUC, support the new approach. The reluctance of the right opposition to take on Sharon at the ballot box supports that, ISTM.
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Edan
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quote:
a) Sharon did run on a completely different platform than what he's suggesting. In fact, he hijacked his opponent's political plan, while following his own economic plan. |
Leaders shouldn't be flexible, and should follow years old platform in light of a change in circumstances?
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Az
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MACEDONIA - It's the name of the sovereign country to the north of Greece
Apr 2000
time: 07:37
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quote:
Leaders shouldn't be flexible, and should follow years old platform in light of a change in circumstances?
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Ugh, what change in circumstances? the plan was started much before Arafat was dead ( and lately, I've seen no good signs from the other side, in any case)
quote:
It makes it irrelevant. Sharon won with a strategy that seemed to be the best at the time of the election, given circumstances at that time. While some of his voters may have been ideologically averse to land for peace, many undoubtedly saw no opening for it then, and trusted Sharon to hold on for a better deal than Barak or Mitzna, the latter of whom wanted to negotiate with Arafat, IIUC.
Now Arafat is dead, the US is in Iraq, and the geopolitical situation is different - but the long term strategic/demographic dilemma remains. Polls indicate that in THESE circumstances the maj of Israelis, including many who voted for Sharon before, IIUC, support the new approach. The reluctance of the right opposition to take on Sharon at the ballot box supports that, ISTM.
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I don't think that the right would mind an election right now. I actually don't know where you take it from. ( After all, they did push the referendum, so I assume they expect a success in the polls ).
I just loved that piece of legislation because it's about time we had some more direct democracy here.
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Edan
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quote:
Ugh, what change in circumstances? the plan was started much before Arafat was dead ( and lately, I've seen no good signs from the other side, in any case)
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Sure, but there are changes from that plan and the current one - that one was unilateral and would have assumed no cooperation by the PA.
quote:
I don't think that the right would mind an election right now. I actually don't know where you take it from. |
Could they really gain more seats? They did pretty damn good last time, and with Labor more willing to work with Sharon, traditional labor/moderate voters who voted for likud last time would be more willilling to vote for labor.
quote:
( After all, they did push the referendum, so I assume they expect a success in the polls ). |
Not necessarilly - it could just be a desperate attempt to stall a plan and present some opposition. I suppose it's possible that it could energize them relative to most of the population, but I'm skeptical they could win a referendum and seriously doubt they could do better in an election, especially since Likuds big win last time was done at the expense of Labor.
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Az
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MACEDONIA - It's the name of the sovereign country to the north of Greece
Apr 2000
time: 07:37
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quote:
You mean Palestinian security forces would be working with Israel to try to prevent terrorist attacks if Arafat were still in power?
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ahahahahahah.
Ok, let's get one thing straight: palestinian security forces don't prevent ****. The only thing they may do is try to reason with the *******s. That's, in itself, is effective, but only for now.
second: This has nothing to do with the disengagement plan. The palestinians are getting this as a cookie for being good. After all, the plan was adopted when the palestinians were effectively pacified by steel.
quote:
You're right.
Can Likud gain any seats? Do they risk losing some back to Shas?
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In an election?
current polls show that the status quo stays, however, this is only if Likud doesn't fall apart on the things that will happen during the actual ... "disengagement". If that happens, **** hits the fan, and if it happens before an election... well, it's anyone's guess.
You must remember that Likud is a brandname. If people will actively pursuit the discussion of what that brandname means during an election campaign, either Likud will be dead, and Sharon will be in somewhat of a mess, or Likud will be dead, and Sharon will win.
in any case, an election now will bring the death of Likud. ( another reason why I support an election now  )
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Edan
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quote:
Originally posted by Odin
I was talking about the religious nut-head settlers who are asking for a referendum. The settlers will loose, referendum or no referendum. The majority supports the pull-out; the settlers they are just trying to delay it. |
Sure, but some people who support the pull-out support the referendum because it would be more democratic, and possibly because it would given Sharon a bigger mandate (or smaller, if the result is close) for the plan.
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Apolyton Time is 00:37. |
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28-03-2005 23:28
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