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Googlie
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Commanding Officer, CRYPTEIA
Apr 1999
time: 21:18
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It's never too soon to start planning ............
We have 6 crawlers coming on-line next turn, plus TH's to be reassigned:- Fort liberty - pull the CDF back into base and send the Hoplite out, restore the worker to the forested river tile and send the TH crawler back to work the mine it came from. Move its new crawler thru the monolith to work the forested road tile
- Ironholm - move FS's worker off the forested river tile and onto a regular forested tile, and send the IH crawler to work that vacated tile for its minerals (no effect on energy due to inefficiency)
- Rio Grande - candidate for an F-6 or B-6 (only workable tile would be the farm, and move the 3/1/0 worker off it to the forested mineral special due south (currently being worked by a FB worker - he'd have to move to the regular forested tile due east of Sector Cratersouth)
- Santiago Citadel - as above, or, reassign southwestern regular forest (1/2/1) worker to the solar panelled farm (3/1/2) and send crawler to the vacated forest
- Sector CraterWest - 1 tile west, to work the forest tile there
- Vladivostok - move the mine worker north onto the forest, and crawler to the mine; move the Fungal Gin Freighter thru Olympus Academy and rehome there
- Olympus Academy - take the worker off the mine and reassign him to the rainy crater river tile (for a 2/0/1 and an extra lab point) or to one of the unimproved rolling moist tiles (1/1/0) and send the Fungal Gin Freighter to the vacated mine (better minerals balance between OA and V V)
The paucity of workable tiles for our crawlers suggests that we need more forests and/or mines in our heartland for them to work, so we should think about our terraforming fleet orders (and if we want to put a borehole per base, they won't be worked with crawlers either, so maybe we need to double our Tomcat fleet)
Last edited by Googlie on 11-04-2005 at 21:42
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Googlie
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Commanding Officer, CRYPTEIA
Apr 1999
time: 21:18
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And Tomcats ...........- Two Nuts Strand new Tomcat - forest over the nut special northeast (10 meters, flat and moist)
- Tomcats MT-1 and SCS-1( 61:27) - SW then S to build a road on the mine at 60:30, then connect to 2NS by road (clearing the fungus at the river fork on 63:31}
- Tomcat SCW-1 - on 52:14 - move 1 tile NE to forest that tile SW of RG
- Tomcats RG-1 and FB-1: currently building a road on 59:11. Either string solar collectors up the Rio Grande to Mt Taygetus' summit - to be bolstered later by echelon mirrors, for an energy park, or else move to NW of Messena (58:6) and build a borehole there
- Do we want to send a Tomcat or two to 47:17 and build an airbase there? - it will bring all of morgan territory within 10 tile range except for their 5 northcoast bases
Our next round of builds should prolly be creches - and perhaps rec commons at the faster growing bases, but a few more formers wouldn't harm either, so that they can gang-build at least one borehole per base
Last edited by Googlie on 11-04-2005 at 22:15
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Maniac
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Gent, Belgium
Jul 1999
time: 06:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Googlie
(This p[rolly belongs in our 2168 or 2169 plans, after the B-6 has healed (send it to FS next turn, maybe, to heal in 1 turn?) |
If I count correctly, the crawler is one tile out of range. Plenty of other juicy targets though. 
I think indeed it would repair fastest by sending it to FS.
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[*]Rio Grande - candidate for an F-6 or B-6 (only workable tile would be the farm, and move the 3/1/0 worker off it to the forested mineral special due south (currently being worked by a FB worker - he'd have to move to the regular forested tile due east of Sector Cratersouth)
[*]Santiago Citadel - as above, or, reassign southwestern regular forest (1/2/1) worker to the solar panelled farm (3/1/2) and send crawler to the vacated forest |
I'm not sure I understand. Are you suggesting to build aircraft in RG and SC2? If so, why not use GF and OA who are right next door?
quote:
Originally posted by Googlie
And Tomcats ...........- Two Nuts Strand new Tomcat - forest over the nut special northeast (10 meters, flat and moist)
- Tomcats MT-1 and SCS-1( 61:27) - SW then S to build a road on the mine at 60:30, then connect to 2NS by road (clearing the fungus at the river fork on 63:31}
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Looks like a good plan for our road network.  Before Tomcat-MT & -SCS1 start on it though, how about first building a sensor array east of MT? That way we're better protected against sneak attacks.
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Tomcats RG-1 and FB-1: currently building a road on 59:11. Either string solar collectors up the Rio Grande to Mt Taygetus' summit - to be bolstered later by echelon mirrors, for an energy park, or else move to NW of Messena (58:6) and build a borehole there |
Third suggestion  : how about moving a tile north to build a road and then farm the tile for quicker growth and later popboom?
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Originally posted by Googlie
Tomcat SCW-1 - on 52:14 - move 1 tile NE to forest that tile SW of RG
Do we want to send a Tomcat or two to 47:17 and build an airbase there? - it will bring all of morgan territory within 10 tile range except for their 5 northcoast bases |
An airbase sounds great! How about already moving Tomcat-SCW to the suggested tile though? AFAIK we don't really need an extra forest around RG, and the sooner we can have that airbase, the better.
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Originally posted by Googlie
Our next round of builds should prolly be creches - and perhaps rec commons at the faster growing bases, but a few more formers wouldn't harm either, so that they can gang-build at least one borehole per base |
I think we have to choose at the moment. Either we popboom, or either we build boreholes. We need a 2-nut surplus to popboom, a borehole doesn't produce nutrients, meaning we'd need to build lots of expensive condensers or convoy nuts with crawlers to get back to +2 nutrient surplus. This kinda reduces the use of boreholes. Personally I only start building them after I've popboomed (and have lots of hybrid forests or condensers already in place) and there's no need anymore for large nutrient surpluses.
I agree btw - we could use more formers.  Let's hope peace with the Corporation gives us enough free production capacity.
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Maniac
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Gent, Belgium
Jul 1999
time: 06:18
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To give that base some more tiles to work, we could change the Messenan forest worker to the rolling & rainy tile (will speed up growth to size 3), and then put the new RG worker on the now empty river forest.
where would you place the new RG crawler? I'm not sure I understand.
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The paucity of workable tiles for our crawlers suggests that we need more forests and/or mines in our heartland for them to work |
Q: Do we want to continue our airfleet build-up in FB, OA & FS, or already switch to builder production in the assumption peace talks will work out?
In case we do want to continue our build-up, the shortage of suitable tiles to harvest doesn't appear: we could cash in the new SC3, SC2 & the existing AU crawler (79.17) at respectively FB, OA & FS for missile aircraft production.
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- Santiago Citadel - as above, or, reassign southwestern regular forest (1/2/1) worker to the solar panelled farm (3/1/2) and send crawler to the vacated forest
- Vladivostok - move the mine worker north onto the forest, and crawler to the mine; move the Fungal Gin Freighter thru Olympus Academy and rehome there
- Olympus Academy - take the worker off the mine and reassign him to the rainy crater river tile (for a 2/0/1 and an extra lab point) or to one of the unimproved rolling moist tiles (1/1/0) and send the Fungal Gin Freighter to the vacated mine (better minerals balance between OA and V V)
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This way we leave the mine the fungal gin freight is currently working unmined, and OA will be working a relatively unproductive tile. How about the following that solves these problems?:
- New SC2 crawler: (unless we want to cash it in for a B-6) move to mine (61.15) NW of OA and mine for minerals. It can get there after the road on the Santiago monolith has been completed.
- New VV crawler and worker relocations: as you proposed.
- Olympus Academy - take the worker off the mine and reassign him to the solar panelled farm (3/1/2). That way OA's nutrient tanks will be filled in two turns and we'll get an extra worker. Worth it I think even if it would mean leaving a mine unworked for two turns.
- Fungal gin freight: as you propose, rehome to OA, but then move it back to the mine it's currently working. That way it's still in range of the (61.27) mine when we have a crawler available to work its current mine.
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Two Nuts Strand new Tomcat - forest over the nut special northeast (10 meters, flat and moist) |
How about first building a road? Now it takes one turn. After a forest is planted three.
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Fort liberty - pull the CDF back into base and send the Hoplite out, restore the worker to the forested river tile and send the TH crawler back to work the mine it came from. Move its new crawler thru the monolith to work the forested road tile |
May I suggest first sending the hoplite out to flame the fungal tower? That way, if the hoplite fails (you never know with those towers), the CDF can immediately complete the job.
As for the TH CDF currently on the Liberty monolith. If the hoplite fails to flame the tower and the FL CDF needs to finish the job, the TH CDF can move into FL for garrison duty. If it isn't needed in FL, it can already proceed to AU, where it can free up two units for worm hunting. We'll then have a respectable force for the worm cash project.
Like on this screenie:
Note the hoplite is moving towards the tower over the fungus instead of the forest - while we have a positive Planet SE rating, all our elite units can move two tiles over fungus, as I discovered a short while ago (shows you how often I run Green economy ).
PS: where will the new FL crawler be placed? The forest where the previous one was placed has been taken over by a fungal bloom (white "circle").
 Attachment: wormhunt2167.jpg
This has been downloaded 53 time(s).
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Googlie
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Commanding Officer, CRYPTEIA
Apr 1999
time: 21:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Maniac
If I count correctly, the crawler is one tile out of range.
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yeah - you're right - I missed the little hilly one by the base (ah, well, maybe after we get one up to Elite - or fusion - and get a bonus mp)
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I think indeed it would repair fastest by sending it to FS.
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I agree - let's send it there next turn
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I'm not sure I understand. Are you suggesting to build aircraft in RG and SC2? If so, why not use GF and OA who are right next door?
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Well, I was - and with the MM we'd have them built next turn with little overspill, leaving the mineral rich bases for other builds better utilizing their high mineral counts. (of course, they'd lose their morale boost that comes with the aerospaces - I presume, btw, that you meant FB rather than GF - but with a handful of credits both these bases can instabuild a B-4 without using a crawler in the process (of course, if we want an F-6, then it's a whole lot more time to build from scratch even in these two bases)
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Looks like a good plan for our road network. Before Tomcat-MT & -SCS1 start on it though, how about first building a sensor array east of MT? That way we're better protected against sneak attacks. |
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Third suggestion : how about moving a tile north to build a road and then farm the tile for quicker growth and later popboom? |
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An airbase sounds great! How about already moving Tomcat-SCW to the suggested tile though? AFAIK we don't really need an extra forest around RG, and the sooner we can have that airbase, the better. |
good suggestion - forests are great for minerals crawling or treefarm/hybrid forest workers, but you're right, we don't need the extra forest right now, and the sooner we get an airbase built the better
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I think we have to choose at the moment. Either we popboom, or either we build boreholes. We need a 2-nut surplus to popboom, a borehole doesn't produce nutrients, meaning we'd need to build lots of expensive condensers or convoy nuts with crawlers to get back to +2 nutrient surplus. This kinda reduces the use of boreholes. Personally I only start building them after I've popboomed (and have lots of hybrid forests or condensers already in place) and there's no need anymore for large nutrient surpluses.
I agree btw - we could use more formers. Let's hope peace with the Corporation gives us enough free production capacity. |
Then I'd go for the nutrients. If we get peace with Morgan (do we care about the Gaians? Do we want to try and frame them for a credits-steal from Yang - all my tests indicate 100% certainty of success if we try to frame Deirdre, versus about a 50% probability if we try framing Morgan) then we can shift out of fundy to Dem and then force a popboom with creches everywhere and nuts galore
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Googlie
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Commanding Officer, CRYPTEIA
Apr 1999
time: 21:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Maniac
To give that base some more tiles to work, we could change the Messenan forest worker to the rolling & rainy tile (will speed up growth to size 3), and then put the new RG worker on the now empty river forest. |
Good idea. Messena goes from a base total of 2/3/1 (nuts/mins/energy) to 3/2/1 while RG goes from 2/8/2 to (prolly - inefficiency distorts it somewhat) 3/10/3 or 4
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where would you place the new RG crawler? I'm not sure I understand.
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Ah - I see the confusion. I had both an FB worker and a SC2 crawler working the same forested tile (due east of Sector Cratersouth) I was suggesting putting the new crawler (if not used as an MM build) onto the 3/1/0 tile currently being worked, (crawl nutrients) and then move that worker to the "to be vacated" forested mineral tile between RG and FB (currently being worked by an FB worker who would move to a "to be vacated" SC2 forest tile). We'd achieve the same (almost) effect if we just ran the crawler downriver 1 tile and got 2 nuts instead of 3
(Remember I'm new to this micromanagement stuff - not that I let Governors take over - but I'm much less inclined to squeeze that last nut or mineral from the game in my MP and SP games)
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Q: Do we want to continue our airfleet build-up in FB, OA & FS, or already switch to builder production in the assumption peace talks will work out?
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I'd switch - creches, rec commons and tree farms, followed by hab complexes?
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In case we do want to continue our build-up, the shortage of suitable tiles to harvest doesn't appear: we could cash in the new SC3, SC2 & the existing AU crawler (79.17) at respectively FB, OA & FS for missile aircraft production.
This way we leave the mine the fungal gin freight is currently working unmined, and OA will be working a relatively unproductive tile. How about the following that solves these problems?:
- New SC2 crawler: (unless we want to cash it in for a B-6) move to mine (61.15) NW of OA and mine for minerals. It can get there after the road on the Santiago monolith has been completed.
- New VV crawler and worker relocations: as you proposed.
- Olympus Academy - take the worker off the mine and reassign him to the solar panelled farm (3/1/2). That way OA's nutrient tanks will be filled in two turns and we'll get an extra worker. Worth it I think even if it would mean leaving a mine unworked for two turns.
- Fungal gin freight: as you propose, rehome to OA, but then move it back to the mine it's currently working. That way it's still in range of the (61.27) mine when we have a crawler available to work its current mine.
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I agree that's a good solution that delivers maximum results
Presumably the MM works as well for instabuilding facilities? So if we do decide that peace is in the offing, we can iuse some spare crawlers for instant creches or rec commons (and time our podpops for that too, for other instavuilds)
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PS: where will the new FL crawler be placed? The forest where the previous one was placed has been taken over by a fungal bloom (white "circle"). |
How about taking the Tegea Harbour worker back off that mine and putting him on the nut special, (we need to do that anyway to avoid starvation next turn there) and working the mine with FL's new crawler. We have some nice emptyland forest 2 tiles south of TH that can be worked by TH's crawler when it comes on stream.
(It's a pity we can't "persuade" Lal to usde that roaming former to plant a forest over that arid nut special)
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Zeiter
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quote:
Q: Do we want to continue our airfleet build-up in FB, OA & FS, or already switch to builder production in the assumption peace talks will work out? |
quote:
I'd switch - creches, rec commons and tree farms, followed by hab complexes? |
Am I the only one still in favor of a quick strike to take out the PEG and HGP? Don't we have a carrier group on its way to Morgania right now? The elite amphibious rover is along with it, right?
If we are going to switch to builder stuff, I'd suggest creches and tree farms. That would allow us to pop-boom to size 7 in most places, I reckon. Then we could stay at that level for a bit and build up some more.
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Modo44
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in western Poland
Jul 2004
time: 06:18
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I just got SMAX, and opened the last available save.
We have way too few forest tiles for my taste. The ex-Zak territory looks much better. 
I see 4-5 very good base sites, and no Colony Pods in the making. We definately need a small break from units. 
Fort Sup should have made a Tree farm long ago. It is a sin to leave this kind of production and energy output stagnant.  (I had no idea it had that big production compared to structure costs.)
Vander Eudaimonics does seem like a weak target. We could have it in 3 turns, starting next turn. Loading up the transport sitting north of Yang now, and possibly upgrading en-route should do the trick. If we can hold it, now that is the question. But the base does sit well, forcing all 2-move units to stop before reaching it... We could always gift it to Yang if things get tricky.  Of course, Morgan might start sending out planes in 2 turns, so...
Definately get that rover going along the Rio Rojo on the Fungal Wall. I would even add one 1/1/2 in Twonuts Stand as the next build, and send it to join in the fun. There is potential there.  Same goes for Arcadia, as there are rivers too. Meaning, the Fungal Tower can go without worries.
Wh are our bases showing no numbers indicating population? I thought this was done for the screenies, but I see nothing in the game too. 
Last edited by Modo44 on 15-04-2005 at 22:21
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Maniac
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Gent, Belgium
Jul 1999
time: 06:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Googlie
Do we want to destroy that tower? it's a pretty good generator of mindworms for that fungus field, and if we kill it off, then wormhunting might produce sparse results |
AFAIK the intended feature that towers would give worms never worked.(?) Only hearsay of course, but then again neither can I recall myself worms frequently appearing near a tower.
quote:
Originally posted by Googlie
Well, I was - and with the MM we'd have them built next turn with little overspill, leaving the mineral rich bases for other builds better utilizing their high mineral counts. (of course, they'd lose their morale boost that comes with the aerospaces - I presume, |
Indeed. And those two morale levels are very important I think. We have enough noodles on our western front that can attack weak targets, but none that can take on the plasma sentinels (except that one veteran B-6).
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btw, that you meant FB rather than GF - but with a handful of credits both these bases can instabuild a B-4 without using a crawler in the process (of course, if we want an F-6, then it's a whole lot more time to build from scratch even in these two bases) |
When cashing in RG's & SC2's crawlers at FB & OA, we'd get them just as fast as cashing them in at RG & SC2, with two more morale.
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Originally posted by Googlie
Presumably the MM works as well for instabuilding facilities? |
Yes indeed! In fact I think crawler-hurrying will show fully its use here. No longer energy-poor factions have to despair because they can't scrap together the necessary credits for that vital hurry order.
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How about taking the Tegea Harbour worker back off that mine and putting him on the nut special, (we need to do that anyway to avoid starvation next turn there) and working the mine with FL's new crawler. |
Just for the record, TH fortunately won't starve.  It's current nutrient deficit is just because it's working a mine and is convoying a nut to FL. Both these will be solved next turn.
FL crawlers on the mine sounds good.
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(It's a pity we can't "persuade" Lal to usde that roaming former to plant a forest over that arid nut special) |
If we're anticipating peace with Morgan, how about building a former next in FL? Then we can do a couple of those long-expected terraformations.
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Originally posted by Zeiter
Am I the only one still in favor of a quick strike to take out the PEG and HGP? Don't we have a carrier group on its way to Morgania right now? The elite amphibious rover is along with it, right? |
Unfotunately we don't have a strike force ready to invade Terrapeso.  Though as Modo suggests, we could load up the Tiger's Claw with eg a probe and three combat units next turn, and sail towards Vander Eudaimonics. I doubt we could get further than there though with so few units.
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Originally posted by Modo44
We have way too few forest tiles for my taste. The ex-Zak territory looks much better. |
Indeed. If we're gonna start preparing for a popboom, I'd suggest all the Arcadian bases (except Ironholm) to get tree farms and creches first.
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Modo44
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in western Poland
Jul 2004
time: 06:18
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Thanks guys, but I changed to Cyborg look instead.
quote:
Originally posted by Maniac
Unfotunately we don't have a strike force ready to invade Terrapeso. Though as Modo suggests, we could load up the Tiger's Claw with eg a probe and three combat units next turn, and sail towards Vander Eudaimonics. I doubt we could get further than there though with so few units. |
I think we should prepare to do that anyway. If Morgan starts phony negotiations (this time we are interested in ending them!), we could teach them a lesson. The range of our transports is so good, they will hardly be able to anticipate a blow. And, as said, we can immediately gift a captured base to Yang, or leave it empty, extracting to the ship. By the way, those are few units, but those could be very strong units too.
We can always rethink this in three turns, depending on the Morgan Doc:Air situation and our relations with Yang. My idea is to prepare a potential attack, using the units available.
Last edited by Modo44 on 16-04-2005 at 11:08
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Googlie
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Commanding Officer, CRYPTEIA
Apr 1999
time: 21:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Maniac
1> We can first execute a framing operation. As far as I can tell the chance for framing the Gaians is just as high/low as framing the Corporation though. So who would we want to frame?
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In my sims I always had a better chance of framing the gaians, for some reason (about 90% versus about 30% with Morgan)
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2> If we want to declare war, don't do it directly. Ask Yang to withdraw troops, which he of course won't do. That way we prevent another reputation loss - which may be important to keep good relations with Lal - he refuses to talk to us right now. |
Trouble is, he may not talk next turn or the turn after anyway. if we are unsuccessful in framing he'll declare V on us anyway, resolving that problem. If we try to "blind-control" that arty unit and fail, likewise
We could try for a double whammy - 122 for the arty and 76 for the infantryman - but there are drawbacks - costs 122 then 76 to achieve, and we'd have instant problems in MT with support
Why are we so worried about our rep in any event - we're "ruthless" after our base obliteration
EDIT: Ah - you meant that Lal refuses to talk to us right now - I had assumed Yang
In fact, Yang refuses as well
Last edited by Googlie on 17-04-2005 at 20:34
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Maniac
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Gent, Belgium
Jul 1999
time: 06:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Modo44
Opened the turn. Morgan likes us... How good are the chances of a dameged B-6 destroying a Crawler? Are we willing to risk it, if it gives us a chance to destroy an AA as well? Please? |
Sounds great! 
quote:
Originally posted by Googlie
I thought we needed the Xenoempathy Dome to get the fungus treated as roads? |
You indeed need the Dome to treat fungus as roads. However I noticed while normally moving on fungus costs 3 or 4 MPs, if you have a positive Planet rating, it costs only one or two, depending on the unit and the underlying terrain.
So Skanky's Sileni would use only two MPs to move on the fungal tile, and would have one left to attack the Fungal Tower.
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We are hell bent on flaming it, eh? What's the ec gain versus the cost of replacing the unit{s} that might be lost in the effort? |
We'd gain 60 credits, so even if we'd lose the CDF (10 mins) - which isn't sure of course - we'd still gain 6 credits per mineral lost.
quote:
Originally posted by Modo44
How do you do hat, if he is ignoring our calls? |
Open the commlink menu on the right. Rightclick on Yang, and then click the option that asks to withdraw troops. Even works under solar spots IIRC.
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11-04-2005 21:36
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