19-05-2005 01:41									#1
	More unbelievable garbage from Faux News. Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Neil Cavuto of Faux News just got off the air doing a 15 minute piece trying to blame Alan Greenspan for Bush's failed economic policies. Cavuto was claiming that Bush's jobless recovery was all Greenspan's fault as was the current flirtations with stagflation. Cavuto even went so far as to claim that the late 90's dot com bubble was all Greenspan's fault and called on Greenspan to resign! I seem to recall Greenspan talking about irrational exuberance as early as 1996 and saying that an unsustainable bubble had formed in the tech sector which would eventually pop. I also recall Greenspan vigorously saying that tax cuts are good but only if the budget was balanced and that the US needed to become more energy efficient or face rising energy prices. Did Bush follow any of Greenspan's objective advice?

Not one bit of it! Bush ran up the biggest deficits in the history of any country on the planet (despite repeated warnings by Greenspan that this would cause the dollar to collapse and that it was just about the worst economic policy we could have), Bush didn't push for higher CAFE or energy efficiency requirements when Greenspan warned that not taking action would lead to higher gas prices, and lastly bush ignored Greenspan's warnings that the trade deficit was unsustainable. Bush took no action on any of these and that is the reason for the massive deficits and the current inflation in the energy sector.

This is just so typical of the overly politicized and nonfactually based "reporting" done by Faux News. When things don't work out and the **** hits the fan, just like every intelligent expert said it would, then Faux News, Bush, & Co try to find someone else to blame everything on. The drooling idiots who believe this crap deserve what they get.

	19-05-2005 01:44									#2
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bush has brought this all on himself.

	19-05-2005 01:44									#3
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This is just like the whole oil for food thing. There is a bit of truth to it but Faux News spent two years pumping it up and ignoring that American companies along with allies like Jordan and Turkey were making far more profits then anyone else. The Bushies knew about it and pretended not to see it now they attack the UN for failing to stop it when the Bush Administration was complicitious to it all along!

If the Galloway vs Coleman debate yesterday proved one thing it is in a free fair and open debate the Republican claims get absolutely hammered. That was proven by the ass kicking Galloway gave them and by the fact that dispite all the build up the Republicans called a recess and ended the show just 10 minutes after it started. They were losing so badly they ran away after just 10 minutes when they'd requested hours of TV time.

	19-05-2005 01:47									#4
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Just the day before yesterday one of the talking heads on Faux News said, with a straight face, that the Senate was Constitutionally supposed to give its advice and consent so it was legally mandated to approve of all of George Bush's nominees!

WTF?! Where the hell do these idiots come up with this ****?

	19-05-2005 01:52									#5
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then theres the spin doctor himself, Bill O'Fearmonger, who ignores everything good that the ACLU does and REFUSES to bring libertarians onto his show, knowing that he will get hammered.

	19-05-2005 02:06									#6
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How long before the house of cards falls?

	19-05-2005 02:11									#7
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I don't get it. The economy is doing well. More people are getting jobs and unemployment is low. The deficit is decreasing.

Cavuto should be trying to apportion praise rather than blame.

	19-05-2005 02:18									#8
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quote: How long before the house of cards falls?

I would say "two more terms", but the Americans stupidly bar their presidents from holding power for too long

	19-05-2005 03:20									#9
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there should be no term limits, i agree.

	19-05-2005 03:27									#10
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If Cavuto and Krugman have similar arguments, perhaps you should listen.

	19-05-2005 03:28									#11
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quote: Originally posted by DanS The deficit is decreasing.

You mean the increase in the deficit is decreasing, don't you?

	19-05-2005 03:35									#12
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yeah its only $400 billion this year. Bush and the republican party are the most fiscally incompetant people on this planet. they spend like its going out of style. the spend money like they are drunk alcoholics at a bar needing to get down just one more drink. they spend money like michael jackson. and then they lie, they tell everyone that they are the fiscally responsible party.


vote lp. the only fiscally sane party in america.

	19-05-2005 04:02									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Americans stupidly bar their presidents from holding power for too long

A result of the Right's enourmous vitriolic hate for Franklin Roosevelt.

	19-05-2005 04:09									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia yeah its only $400 billion this year. Bush and the republican party are the most fiscally incompetant people on this planet. they spend like its going out of style. the spend money like they are drunk alcoholics at a bar needing to get down just one more drink. they spend money like michael jackson. and then they lie, they tell everyone that they are the fiscally responsible party.

That is not really the party's fault, but the voter's, we like our government programs and pork, but don't like to pay the taxes to pay for them. Politicians don't want to piss off thier constituents, and borrow and spend is the result.

	19-05-2005 07:40									#16
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quote: You mean the increase in the deficit is decreasing, don't you?

Nope. The deficit will be probably about $350 billion this year, well below last year's deficit of about $410 billion.

A good economy. More jobs. Lower deficit. Cavuto's pessimism isn't warranted.

	19-05-2005 07:42									#17
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Maybe if Bush hadn't driven the country into such a horrible deficit, people would be more willing to praise him for trimming them back.

	19-05-2005 07:43									#18
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quote: Originally posted by DanS Nope. The deficit will be probably about $350 billion this year, well below last year's deficit of about $410 billion.

My bad. I was thinking debt instead of deficit.

	19-05-2005 07:56									#19
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Anyway, does Cavuto think an unwinding of one of the largest equity bubbles in our history would be unpainful? I think the aftermath was managed about as well as could be expected, considering that this could have been a Hoover situation.

	19-05-2005 15:40									#20
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara If Cavuto and Krugman have similar arguments, perhaps you should listen.

...to whoever is saying the opposite.

	19-05-2005 15:59									#21
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Eh?

A good economy??

Not sure where DanS is living, but around here, things aren't so good.

South Carolina is one of the poorest states in the Union, and the recent gas spike put our gas prices at only 13 cents below the national average.

In a state where nearly half the people live at or below the poverty line, you can imagine what that's doing to the rank and file. I see it every day.

Further, as I understand it, even WITH our much vaunted recovery, we actually have marginally fewer jobs than we did before the economy headed south.

Further still, wages have stagnated and begun to decline. Purchasing power of those who have jobs is decreasing.

That, coupled with the still-high oil prices and the rediculously high deficit doesn't spell a rosy economy to me.

And no...the DEFICIT is not decreasing. The amount of increase is decreasing. Deficit is still going nearly straight up through the roof.

Not good.

-=Vel=-

	19-05-2005 19:06									#22
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quote: And no...the DEFICIT is not decreasing. The amount of increase is decreasing. Deficit is still going nearly straight up through the roof.

You don't have a clue, dude.

quote: Further, as I understand it, even WITH our much vaunted recovery, we actually have marginally fewer jobs than we did before the economy headed south.

You understand incorrectly.

quote: Not sure where DanS is living, but around here, things aren't so good.

And I look at the overall economy. South Carolina is only one very small part of the economy. South Carolina is not the center of the universe.

	19-05-2005 19:43									#23
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Really? That's interesting, since the US Government's own labor stats site indicates otherwise:

2001 Unemployment level = 4.7%, current unemployment rate = 5.2%. Now...admittedly, math isn't my strongest suit, but unless I'm mistaken, 5.2 IS still larger than 4.7...innit?

Also, per your own post, the deficit this year will *only* be about 350 billion (as opposed to last year's 400B). This seems to indicate that the deficit IS in fact still increasing, but not as fast as last year.

Or do I need to learn some of that new math to see the light?

And, while SC may not be the center of the universe (interesting sub-point to that tho, is that I never said it was), we DO have TV and newspapers here, and a connection to the outside world, and I'm just not seeing the rosy picture you are.

-=Vel=-

	19-05-2005 19:55									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx A good economy?? Not sure where DanS is living, but around here, things aren't so good.

I am doing right fine. Best it has ever been for me.

	19-05-2005 19:59									#25
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quote: Really? That's interesting, since the US Government's own labor stats site indicates otherwise: 2001 Unemployment level = 4.7%, current unemployment rate = 5.2%. Now...admittedly, math isn't my strongest suit, but unless I'm mistaken, 5.2 IS still larger than 4.7...innit?

I agree. Neither math, politics, nor economics are your strong suits. There are more jobs, but also more potential workers. So the unemployment rate is slightly higher, even if more people are working now versus then.

quote: Also, per your own post, the deficit this year will *only* be about 350 billion (as opposed to last year's 400B). This seems to indicate that the deficit IS in fact still increasing, but not as fast as last year.

You are confusing debt and deficit, just like che did.

	19-05-2005 20:02									#26
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Well, Vel,

I think he meant that you were IMPLYING that since things in your neck of the woods aren't as good as other places, than that MUST mean, overall, the economy is bad and that you think Dan doesn't know what he is talking about.

Also, when you say "you don't know where Dan S is living, but around here, things aren't so good", you are implying that the states of things where you are is the state of things everywhere.

Dan's observations of his neck of the woods are as valid as your observations where you are.

I can also say that where I am, our company is hiring left and right...we can't find enough people.

But, that of course doesn't mean it's that good everywhere.

I suspect it's always been that way regardless of who's in office.

	19-05-2005 20:07									#27
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DanS : More people are getting jobs and unemployment is low.

Clearly, in this quote, you break down the current population and the unemployment rate into two separate things (by mentioning them separately). I guess maybe English isn't my strong suit either, but usually when people talk about "unemployment" being high or low, they imply "unemployment rate" unless they specifically say otherwise (which, in this case, you did not).

Thus, yes, while 5.2% is relatively low, it is NOT lower than it was previous to the economic drubbing we took, so my point stands but it WAS a heckuva good try!

Second, even many economists refer to the "budgetary deficit" as simply "the deficit" while refering to the national trade account balance as the "balance of trade" or "trade deficit." Since you did not specify, I don't think it's a grevious error to have assumed the former, since that's the one that gets the most press time, however, yes...thanks to the weak dollar, the trade deficit IS shrinking...not that the weak dollar is good all around, but it is helping in that one area.

-=Vel=-

	19-05-2005 20:14									#28
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quote: Thus, yes, while 5.2% is relatively low, it is NOT lower than it was previous to the economic drubbing we took, so my point stands but it WAS a heckuva good try!

No, your point was a crock of crap. There are more people with jobs now versus then. End of story.

quote: Second, even many economists refer to the "budgetary deficit" as simply "the deficit" while refering to the national trade account balance as the "balance of trade" or "trade deficit."

You still don't get it, even though the concept is rather simple. The deficit is a one-year figure. The debt is an accumulation of the deficits. The deficit is going down. The debt is going up.

	19-05-2005 20:22									#29
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Incorrect. My point was that the economy is not as rosy as you paint it to be.

People are coming back to work, yes...generally at lower wages than they had before they lost their jobs. Oh joy.

Further, we've got an array of underlying problems that don't spell economic strength, and in fact, hint at weakness.

I know...it's a Dem or Lib conspiracy to speak such utterances against THE BUSH, who obviously can do no wrong, but it's also, nonetheless, the truth.

-=Vel=-

	19-05-2005 21:32									#30
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I got a good job and I blame Bush!