07-07-2005 18:31									#61
	Suffering from ads?

RJM,
Thanks, I would very much like to try an EL game in the future. I am not sure I would expect my results to be that impressive, however. There is a lot more nuance involved in an EL game that I have not had time to master yet.

Solo,
Well I am not sure that this OCC did not have its own little quirks in it too. It was a "Best Ball" game and I did switch over to your 2000BC save if I am not mistaken. My early game is still a little lacking, and I am quite sure there would be no way that I could have beaten 1600AD, much less an early 1400's landing (though the AI may beat me there). So I guess you could call this one a team effort.

StuporMan

	11-07-2005 12:21									#62
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I continue to trundle along - acting as the rear gunner. I failed to get a good trading system going so my doldrums continue.

RJM at Sleeper's

AD 500 Gravity->chemistry
AD 520 Vikings declare war
AD 560 chemistry->invention
AD 620 Invention->steam engine
AD 680 Steam engine->democracy
AD 720 democracy->economics
AD 760 economics->atomic theory
AD 820 atomic theory->warior code
AD 840 swap for warrior code
AD 880 iron working->gunpowder
AD 920 coal bapedi (u) 107 gunpowder->explosives
AD 960 explosives->bridge building

Attachment: rjma1000.sav
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	13-07-2005 23:35									#63
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

On to the finish. As I left off, a major barbarian invasion took place to the east of Madrid, which delayed Space Flight a few turns. No matter, as StuporMan already had that tech before barbs gave me an excuse for not doing better. However, we still must wait for Zenon to return from his trip and finish his game, too. He has this habit of often producing the best game.

1020 wool, Robotics, 2 barb riflemen bribed, 164g
1040 food, 2 more barb riflemen bribed
1060 food, Rocketry, barb artillery bribed, 102g
1080 destroyer, used to destroy the barb frigate still adjacent to Madrid.
1100 Manufacturing Plant, Space Flight, many barbs killed but more appear

Celts – trade for Warrior Code, 50g
Vikings – give tech, 200g
Persians – give tech, 150g
Sioux – give tech, 250g

1120 Apollo Program

Celts & Persians – 100g each
Greeks – 50g
Sioux – 200g

Looks like the barbs have been taken care of, as I kill off the last few near Madrid.

1140 S#1

Celts & Persians – 100g each
Greeks & Sioux – 50g each

1160 S#2, Plastics

Celts & Sioux – 50g each
Greeks – 100g
Zulus – 150g
Vikings – 250g

1180 Zulus learn Communism, S#3
1200 C#1

Celts – 100g
Zulus – 150g
Greeks – 50g

1220 S#4, Superconductor
1240 M#1

Celts – 50g
Zulus – 100g
Vikings – Combined Arms
Greeks – 150g

That should be enough gold to build the ship.

1260 Zulus – trade for Pottery, M#2
1280 S#5, Fusion Power
1300 S#6, engineer lost due to starvation
1320 S#7, another engineer dies

Had I been paying more attention, I might have disbanded these two for their shields.

1340 S#8, pollution mounts
1360 S#9
1380 S#10, lose a citizen due to starvation, now size 21
1400 S#11
1420 S#12
1440 S#13, more pollution
1460 S#14, still more pollution and starvation, size 20
1480 S#15
1500 M#1
1510 C#2 launch 15-1-1-1-1-1. ETA 1546 AD

Well, this game was an improvement over my previous one, where I launched after 1600. I actually had finished it quite a while ago, having not anticipated such a great effort by StuporMan. I think once I knew I was well ahead of my pace in the previous game, I was a bit sloppy in my play during the second half. I also made a big mistake building Colossus at 1 AD, when I should have built Copernicus instead. Still, even with more precise play, I think I would have ended up a turn or two short when compared to Stuporman’s result. Congrats to him on such superb effort!

I have found a good start for an EL game, but will be away on vacation for awhile. I know that RJM wants to play an EL game and perhaps StuporMan and some others would like to try one as well. If you want I can post the start in a thread before I go, and just give this EL game a long time limit, so I can play it myself when I return. Or perhaps people here would prefer to play a conquest game in the interim.

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	14-07-2005 17:09									#64
	Support Apolyton

Well, I guess I will go ahead and end the suspense, who was first to AC Zulu or Spanish...

1020: Struct
1040: Struct
1060: Struct, SuperConductor, Zulu trade for Amphibious Warfare, 100g, Sioux 150g, Celts 100g, Vikings 50g
1080: Module, Zulu 100g, Viking 50g, Sioux 50g, Celts Pottery , Persians 150g, Zulus build Seti
1100: Struct, Another grass mined to forest in case of pollution/barb problems, Zulus build Mikes
1120: Struct,
1140: Struct, Zulus build Adam Smith's
1160: Module
1180: Struct, Zulu Armor appears
1200: Struct, Zulu build Statue of Liberty
1220: Struct, Celts 200g, Sioux 250g
1240: Module, Zulus develop Fusion Power! I do not think I have any tech left to trade them, so I will research it myself, I could steal it but I do not want to risk a war.
1260: Struct
1280: Component
1300: Struct
1320: Struct, Fusion Power!
1340: Component
1360: Struct
1380: Struct, Launch: 15-1-1-1-1-1 Arrival 1416AD!

1400: Zulus have a SS that can overtake mine if they complete one SS Module in time. I may have to start a war. Contact, They immediately cancel alliance.
1402: Zulus complete module. Unfortunately for them, it will still be too late by 1.6 years! They still have time to complete an even faster ship, however.
1403: Zulus seem determined to beat my ship. They are a few mere structurals away now from beating my ship. I may have to destroy Zimbabwe.
1404: Zulus continue to build onto ship. More components and structurals. They may just pull it off.
1406: Zulus ship is now tied with mine. IF they launched now they would beat me by .1 years, but they do not realize this and haven't launched yet. I begin building howies, I already have around 5 armor.
1410: Zulus build too little too late. It was close, however.
1415: Zulus this turn built the fastest possible ship (plus a structural).

This was certainly a scary portion. I was afraid I was going to have to raze the Zulu cities to the ground! Fortunately, they were a single step too slow. In retrospect, I probably should not have given them all the late game techs I did, but it certainly gave me some tense moments here in the late game which is normally quite boring.

I found it interesting that though the Zulus legitimately could have beaten me by launching in 1406, yet they chose not to. I wonder if 0.1 years is enough for the win (in terms of Civ 2 victory) or if since they will be in the same turn the first launcher wins?

I was quite pleased at the speed at which this game went for me. I played lean and mean through most of the game and luck with gifts of gold to help build the key components at key times and helped make this game go faster than I thought I would ever be able to accomplish. There were several turns where a missing gift from an ally would have resulted in a major delay. And I must say, it is quite satisfying to build and bribe things using your competitors money! I am not sure how much I could have improved upon this attempt, but I am sure one turn could have been coaxed out in some way meaning pre 1400AD landings are a very real possibility!

I know I said I was going to wait on everyone, but I wanted to enjoy my landing a little bit before Zenon comes along and beats my landing by 200 years .

Well I know I have learned a ton from this attempt and hope that I can learn even more during the next game be it conquest/EL/OCC or other.

StuporMan

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	14-07-2005 17:59									#65
	Get a bigger avatar today!

A space race is very unusual in OCC. Typically just one or two AI build just a few parts. However, I was never in suspense!

	14-07-2005 18:19									#66
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by solo A space race is very unusual in OCC. Typically just one or two AI build just a few parts. However, I was never in suspense!

It is quite ironic that you were not in suspense, because from around 1385 to 1410 I was in deep suspense. The Zulus managed a couple of turns where they generated 4 SS parts in a turn, had they done that 1 more time they could have won! There were 3 or 4 times they were 1 SS part from being able to launch a faster ship, and 1 time when they did have a faster ship (not by a full year) and did not launch. I was in a panic at that point as there was not enough time to research espionage to reduce Zimbabwe to size 1 so I could destroy it. I obviously could not capture Zimbabwe as this was an OCC and that would make city #2. I also went back after my victory just to see if I could have destroyed Zimbabwe without espionage. As it turns out, Zimbabwe only had 1 defender, and would not build another one after that one was destroyed! I was very fortunate not to have produced such a great result and end up losing to the Zulus!

StuporMan

	15-07-2005 11:03									#67
	Support Apolyton

Brilliant game StuporMan Well done!

I will finish my game and post the results sometime in the next few days. But to avoid causing you to lose sleep I can confirm that I will not launch before 1400 - actually I don't think I will discover flight before 1400

RJM at Sleeper's